In article , Sacha
says...
On 3/10/07 16:44, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:


In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| I can't get in. I get a blank page with in the corner a barely
| visible "loading..." thingy that keeps ticking away and getting
| nowhere.

I can reach it, but it is total junk. I am not a flasher, and can't
be bothered to reverse engineer misdesigned Web nonsense unless I
have a very good reason to.

I don't think it's junk but I think it needs careful proof-reading by
someone other than its designer. There are spelling and punctuation
mistakes as in 'accidently' instead of 'accidentally' and 'your' when it
should be 'you're'. Small things but not confidence inspiring if
repetitive.



I agree about the spelling. In a former life I received lots of job
applications from people. Some people had several spelling mistakes on
the envelope (before even getting to the CV). For example spelling the
name of the company and town incorrectly. Others had the most appalling,
illegible hand writing on the envelope. In work where accuracy, clarity
and communication (both written and verbal) is important this eliminated
them before even opening the envelope and reading their CV.

Also, a surprisingly high number of people gave out-of-date or badly
spelled email addresses on their CV. On several occasions, people that
were sent interview invitations never received them due to this. The
emails bounced back to me because the email address given in the CV was
not valid.

When needing to filter out lots of applicants for one position, such
carelessness on job applications proved to be one way of eliminating
candidates.

Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)

--
David in Normandy.
(The free MicroPlanet Gravity newsreader is great for eliminating
rubbish and cross-posts)

On Oct 3, 10:15 pm, David in Normandy wrote:
In article , Sacha
says...



On 3/10/07 16:44, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:

In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| I can't get in. I get a blank page with in the corner a barely
| visible "loading..." thingy that keeps ticking away and getting
| nowhere.

I can reach it, but it is total junk. I am not a flasher, and can't
be bothered to reverse engineer misdesigned Web nonsense unless I
have a very good reason to.

I don't think it's junk but I think it needs careful proof-reading by
someone other than its designer. There are spelling and punctuation
mistakes as in 'accidently' instead of 'accidentally' and 'your' when it
should be 'you're'. Small things but not confidence inspiring if
repetitive.

I agree about the spelling. In a former life I received lots of job
applications from people. Some people had several spelling mistakes on
the envelope (before even getting to the CV). For example spelling the
name of the company and town incorrectly. Others had the most appalling,
illegible hand writing on the envelope. In work where accuracy, clarity
and communication (both written and verbal) is important this eliminated
them before even opening the envelope and reading their CV.

Also, a surprisingly high number of people gave out-of-date or badly
spelled email addresses on their CV. On several occasions, people that
were sent interview invitations never received them due to this. The
emails bounced back to me because the email address given in the CV was
not valid.

When needing to filter out lots of applicants for one position, such
carelessness on job applications proved to be one way of eliminating
candidates.

Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)


And why miss out on such poetry?

But seriously, I think it should be taken as constructive criticism by
the OP, who is after all intending to make a living out of "designing"
things that are useful to people, that the website he/she uses to
advertise her/his wares puts off at least some people, and therefore
potential customers.
I still can't get in, by the way. I suspect my system here is
allergic to it.

Cat(h)

On 4/10/07 11:06, in article
, "Cat(h)"
wrote:

On Oct 3, 10:15 pm, David in Normandy wrote:
In article , Sacha
says...



On 3/10/07 16:44, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:

In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| I can't get in. I get a blank page with in the corner a barely
| visible "loading..." thingy that keeps ticking away and getting
| nowhere.

I can reach it, but it is total junk. I am not a flasher, and can't
be bothered to reverse engineer misdesigned Web nonsense unless I
have a very good reason to.

I don't think it's junk but I think it needs careful proof-reading by
someone other than its designer. There are spelling and punctuation
mistakes as in 'accidently' instead of 'accidentally' and 'your' when it
should be 'you're'. Small things but not confidence inspiring if
repetitive.

I agree about the spelling. In a former life I received lots of job
applications from people. Some people had several spelling mistakes on
the envelope (before even getting to the CV). For example spelling the
name of the company and town incorrectly. Others had the most appalling,
illegible hand writing on the envelope. In work where accuracy, clarity
and communication (both written and verbal) is important this eliminated
them before even opening the envelope and reading their CV.

Also, a surprisingly high number of people gave out-of-date or badly
spelled email addresses on their CV. On several occasions, people that
were sent interview invitations never received them due to this. The
emails bounced back to me because the email address given in the CV was
not valid.

When needing to filter out lots of applicants for one position, such
carelessness on job applications proved to be one way of eliminating
candidates.

Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)


And why miss out on such poetry?

I had 5 attempts to unravel that one - got there finally!

But seriously, I think it should be taken as constructive criticism by
the OP, who is after all intending to make a living out of "designing"
things that are useful to people, that the website he/she uses to
advertise her/his wares puts off at least some people, and therefore
potential customers.
I still can't get in, by the way. I suspect my system here is
allergic to it.

Cat(h)


Of course it's meant as constructive criticism. The OP is aiming to be a
professional working with professionals. Communicating at the level of
those you wish to impress or seek as clients, is essential to the OP's
future. Mike never can resist taking a swipe, even when it's misleading to
original and new posters. His remarks are of no assistance to Holly
whatsoever and his bitterness with this group's distaste for him reflects
that. I do hope she hasn't been drawn into his web!
I like the first page - it's fresh, young and uncluttered. I think the
following pages could give a little more information on the experience of
the OP but as she's still a student, that may inevitably be a bit thin on
the ground. Time will take care of that. For what it's worth, I think,
too, that it's quite courageous of a young student to ask for the assistance
and opinion of a wide variety of people, some much older and more
experienced than herself. Should go far. ;-))

--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

In article , Sacha
says...
Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)


And why miss out on such poetry?

I had 5 attempts to unravel that one - got there finally!

Once I saw a white van with the lettering "Garden Maintinince" or
similar spelling error. I couldn't help wondering if it was accidental
or like the badly spelled sign outside Arkwright's (Ronny Barker's) shop
- there as a lure to get people through the door so he could sell them
something.
--
David in Normandy.
(The free MicroPlanet Gravity newsreader is great for eliminating
rubbish and cross-posts)

"David in Normandy" wrote in message
...

Once I saw a white van with the lettering "Garden Maintinince" or
similar spelling error. I couldn't help wondering if it was accidental
or like the badly spelled sign outside Arkwright's (Ronny Barker's) shop
- there as a lure to get people through the door so he could sell them
something.

Well, David, nobody's perfect - except in his (usually) own estimation.

The man who never made a mistake never made anything.

I doubt that any of the detractors knew everything when starting out.

Mary

In message .com,
"Cat(h)" writes
On Oct 3, 10:15 pm, David in Normandy wrote:
In article , Sacha
says...



On 3/10/07 16:44, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:

In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| I can't get in. I get a blank page with in the corner a barely
| visible "loading..." thingy that keeps ticking away and getting
| nowhere.

I can reach it, but it is total junk. I am not a flasher, and can't
be bothered to reverse engineer misdesigned Web nonsense unless I
have a very good reason to.

I don't think it's junk but I think it needs careful proof-reading by
someone other than its designer. There are spelling and punctuation
mistakes as in 'accidently' instead of 'accidentally' and 'your' when it
should be 'you're'. Small things but not confidence inspiring if
repetitive.

I agree about the spelling. In a former life I received lots of job
applications from people. Some people had several spelling mistakes on
the envelope (before even getting to the CV). For example spelling the
name of the company and town incorrectly. Others had the most appalling,
illegible hand writing on the envelope. In work where accuracy, clarity
and communication (both written and verbal) is important this eliminated
them before even opening the envelope and reading their CV.

Also, a surprisingly high number of people gave out-of-date or badly
spelled email addresses on their CV. On several occasions, people that
were sent interview invitations never received them due to this. The
emails bounced back to me because the email address given in the CV was
not valid.

When needing to filter out lots of applicants for one position, such
carelessness on job applications proved to be one way of eliminating
candidates.

Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)


And why miss out on such poetry?

But seriously, I think it should be taken as constructive criticism by
the OP, who is after all intending to make a living out of "designing"
things that are useful to people, that the website he/she uses to
advertise her/his wares puts off at least some people, and therefore
potential customers.
I still can't get in, by the way. I suspect my system here is
allergic to it.

Cat(h)


I can't get past the front page either - while there is a way past the
Flash animation this doesn't work for me. I suspect that this is due to
the use of JavaScript in the web page. (Unnecessary use of JavaScript
seems to be a least as common a sin as unnecessary use of Flash.)
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

On 4/10/07 11:25, in article , "Stewart Robert
Hinsley" wrote:

In message .com,
"Cat(h)" writes
On Oct 3, 10:15 pm, David in Normandy wrote:
In article , Sacha
says...



On 3/10/07 16:44, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:

In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| I can't get in. I get a blank page with in the corner a barely
| visible "loading..." thingy that keeps ticking away and getting
| nowhere.

I can reach it, but it is total junk. I am not a flasher, and can't
be bothered to reverse engineer misdesigned Web nonsense unless I
have a very good reason to.

I don't think it's junk but I think it needs careful proof-reading by
someone other than its designer. There are spelling and punctuation
mistakes as in 'accidently' instead of 'accidentally' and 'your' when it
should be 'you're'. Small things but not confidence inspiring if
repetitive.

I agree about the spelling. In a former life I received lots of job
applications from people. Some people had several spelling mistakes on
the envelope (before even getting to the CV). For example spelling the
name of the company and town incorrectly. Others had the most appalling,
illegible hand writing on the envelope. In work where accuracy, clarity
and communication (both written and verbal) is important this eliminated
them before even opening the envelope and reading their CV.

Also, a surprisingly high number of people gave out-of-date or badly
spelled email addresses on their CV. On several occasions, people that
were sent interview invitations never received them due to this. The
emails bounced back to me because the email address given in the CV was
not valid.

When needing to filter out lots of applicants for one position, such
carelessness on job applications proved to be one way of eliminating
candidates.

Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)


And why miss out on such poetry?

But seriously, I think it should be taken as constructive criticism by
the OP, who is after all intending to make a living out of "designing"
things that are useful to people, that the website he/she uses to
advertise her/his wares puts off at least some people, and therefore
potential customers.
I still can't get in, by the way. I suspect my system here is
allergic to it.

Cat(h)


I can't get past the front page either - while there is a way past the
Flash animation this doesn't work for me. I suspect that this is due to
the use of JavaScript in the web page. (Unnecessary use of JavaScript
seems to be a least as common a sin as unnecessary use of Flash.)

Oh dear - time for me to display my absysmal ignorance. I don't know what
Flash is and have only the most tenuous grasp of Java. Can you explain,
please? I can get into the whole of the site, BTW.
--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

In message , Sacha
writes
On 4/10/07 11:25, in article , "Stewart Robert
Hinsley" wrote:

In message .com,
"Cat(h)" writes
On Oct 3, 10:15 pm, David in Normandy wrote:
In article , Sacha
says...



On 3/10/07 16:44, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:

In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| I can't get in. I get a blank page with in the corner a barely
| visible "loading..." thingy that keeps ticking away and getting
| nowhere.

I can reach it, but it is total junk. I am not a flasher, and can't
be bothered to reverse engineer misdesigned Web nonsense unless I
have a very good reason to.

I don't think it's junk but I think it needs careful proof-reading by
someone other than its designer. There are spelling and punctuation
mistakes as in 'accidently' instead of 'accidentally' and 'your' when it
should be 'you're'. Small things but not confidence inspiring if
repetitive.

I agree about the spelling. In a former life I received lots of job
applications from people. Some people had several spelling mistakes on
the envelope (before even getting to the CV). For example spelling the
name of the company and town incorrectly. Others had the most appalling,
illegible hand writing on the envelope. In work where accuracy, clarity
and communication (both written and verbal) is important this eliminated
them before even opening the envelope and reading their CV.

Also, a surprisingly high number of people gave out-of-date or badly
spelled email addresses on their CV. On several occasions, people that
were sent interview invitations never received them due to this. The
emails bounced back to me because the email address given in the CV was
not valid.

When needing to filter out lots of applicants for one position, such
carelessness on job applications proved to be one way of eliminating
candidates.

Obviously it depended on the job. A Mike mentioned, a cleaner would not
be eliminated on the basis of their spelling. Though, it could lead to
signs on the toilet doors saying "Bog is art a horder" :-)


And why miss out on such poetry?

But seriously, I think it should be taken as constructive criticism by
the OP, who is after all intending to make a living out of "designing"
things that are useful to people, that the website he/she uses to
advertise her/his wares puts off at least some people, and therefore
potential customers.
I still can't get in, by the way. I suspect my system here is
allergic to it.

Cat(h)


I can't get past the front page either - while there is a way past the
Flash animation this doesn't work for me. I suspect that this is due to
the use of JavaScript in the web page. (Unnecessary use of JavaScript
seems to be a least as common a sin as unnecessary use of Flash.)

Oh dear - time for me to display my absysmal ignorance. I don't know what
Flash is and have only the most tenuous grasp of Java. Can you explain,
please? I can get into the whole of the site, BTW.

Flash is a browser plugin that displays (possibly interactive)
animations (.swf files). It is often misused to display static images.
(If you want to use part of static images as links the appropriate
method is to use the MAP feature of HTML.

I don't know how dangerous Flash is - for all I know it might be
properly sandboxed[1] and robustly designed against buffer overrun
attacks[2] and other exploits[3] - but it seems to be disabled when
other active content is disabled. (In general allowing web sites to
execute arbitrary software on your computer is a bad idea.)

JavaScript is not the same as Java. There is a connection in that
JavaScript supports scripting of Java applets, but the relationship is
much more tenuous that the names suggest.

JavaScript is a client side scripting language. The proper use of
JavaScript is for interactive web sites (to save on bandwidth and server
CPU cycles). (I think that JavaScript can also be used as server side
scripting language, but PHP, PERL, ASP, etc, are more commonly used for
that purpose.)

Both Java Applets and JavaScript are supposed to be properly sandboxed.

[1] sandboxed - confined to using a reduced set of the capabilities of
your computer so that it can do any harm if it is maliciously or
incompetently programmed.

[2] buffer overrun attack - in an insufficiently defensively programmed
piece of software a malicious user can write, say, 110 characters where
only 100 is allowed for. This overwrites other data; depending on what
the data is it can have severe effects.

[3] exploit - a means of defeating the security features of a computer.
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

On 4/10/07 12:14, in article , "Stewart Robert
Hinsley" wrote:

snip

Flash is a browser plugin that displays (possibly interactive)
animations (.swf files). It is often misused to display static images.
(If you want to use part of static images as links the appropriate
method is to use the MAP feature of HTML.

I don't know how dangerous Flash is - for all I know it might be
properly sandboxed[1] and robustly designed against buffer overrun
attacks[2] and other exploits[3] - but it seems to be disabled when
other active content is disabled. (In general allowing web sites to
execute arbitrary software on your computer is a bad idea.)

JavaScript is not the same as Java. There is a connection in that
JavaScript supports scripting of Java applets, but the relationship is
much more tenuous that the names suggest.

JavaScript is a client side scripting language. The proper use of
JavaScript is for interactive web sites (to save on bandwidth and server
CPU cycles). (I think that JavaScript can also be used as server side
scripting language, but PHP, PERL, ASP, etc, are more commonly used for
that purpose.)

Both Java Applets and JavaScript are supposed to be properly sandboxed.

[1] sandboxed - confined to using a reduced set of the capabilities of
your computer so that it can do any harm if it is maliciously or
incompetently programmed.

[2] buffer overrun attack - in an insufficiently defensively programmed
piece of software a malicious user can write, say, 110 characters where
only 100 is allowed for. This overwrites other data; depending on what
the data is it can have severe effects.

[3] exploit - a means of defeating the security features of a computer.

I don't think I'd grasped how dangerous it is out there!! I'm extremely
cautious about emails with attachments but this sounds v. worrying! Thank
you for bothering to go into all this, though. I'm beginning to get a faint
grasp of the essentials.
--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

In reply to Sacha ) who wrote this in
, I, Marvo, say :

[1] sandboxed - confined to using a reduced set of the capabilities
of your computer so that it can do any harm if it is maliciously or
incompetently programmed.

[2] buffer overrun attack - in an insufficiently defensively
programmed piece of software a malicious user can write, say, 110
characters where only 100 is allowed for. This overwrites other
data; depending on what the data is it can have severe effects.

[3] exploit - a means of defeating the security features of a
computer.

I don't think I'd grasped how dangerous it is out there!! I'm
extremely cautious about emails with attachments but this sounds v.
worrying! Thank you for bothering to go into all this, though. I'm
beginning to get a faint grasp of the essentials.

You've got a Mac. I wouldn't worry.

It never ceases to amaze me how, whatever the subject of a thread, they seem
to end up talking (normally out of a hat) about technical things. I suspect
it is something to do with the medium.

Can't the technical rubbish be put in another thread, or something?

Just an idea.

In article , Stewart Robert Hinsley
says...

Both Java Applets and JavaScript are supposed to be properly sandboxed.

[1] sandboxed - confined to using a reduced set of the capabilities of
your computer so that it can do any harm if it is maliciously or
incompetently programmed.

[2] buffer overrun attack - in an insufficiently defensively programmed
piece of software a malicious user can write, say, 110 characters where
only 100 is allowed for. This overwrites other data; depending on what
the data is it can have severe effects.

[3] exploit - a means of defeating the security features of a computer.
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

I always browse with JavaScript disabled. I read a few months ago of a
security expert demonstrating that it is possible to create a scenario
whereby control can break out beyond the sand box. I don't know if
exploits of this are out in the wild yet, but apparently the exploit was
impossible to block as the attack was constructed with simple standard
JavaScript (just used in an unconventional way). The "fix" would
apparently render JavaScript useless.

This of course means that if you simply visit the wrong web site with
JavaScript enabled, then you have handed the keys of your computer to
someone else, who can do or plant whatever malware they like on your
computer. This security breach will still happen on fully patched
Windows systems with up to date firewall and anti-virus software. To
make matters worse, apparently with cross-site scripting the malware can
even be put onto your system via "legitimate" web sites too.

I'm beginning to think that two (none-networked) computers are necessary
nowadays. One for browsing the web in general and one for accessing
online bank accounts or other sensitive sites.
--
David in Normandy.
(The free MicroPlanet Gravity newsreader is great for eliminating
rubbish and cross-posts)

In article ,
Sacha writes:
|
| Oh dear - time for me to display my absysmal ignorance. I don't know what
| Flash is and have only the most tenuous grasp of Java. Can you explain,
| please? I can get into the whole of the site, BTW.

I fail to see why anyone should be required to know about those
disgusting minutiae, but they do :-( Anyway:

Flash (or ShockWave Flash) is an application that bolts into your
browser to display cartoons. It is considerably less heavyweight
than a video add-on, but more so than a static graphic one (such as
one for JPEG, as with files like fruitflies.jpg).

Java is a general-purpose, fully-functional scripting language and
has nothing to do with JavaScript, but can be used in the same way.
It is considerably less repulsive and more secure.

JavaScript is a hacked-up scripting language that bolts into your
browser to allow the Web server you are visiting to do horrible
things to your computer (i.e. run programs on it). You had better
pray that either it wasn't written by a malicious hacker or that
your local JavaScript interpreter is tolerably secure.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 4/10/07 12:21, in article , "Nick
Maclaren" wrote:


In article ,
Sacha writes:
|
| Oh dear - time for me to display my absysmal ignorance. I don't know what
| Flash is and have only the most tenuous grasp of Java. Can you explain,
| please? I can get into the whole of the site, BTW.

I fail to see why anyone should be required to know about those
disgusting minutiae, but they do :-( Anyway:

Flash (or ShockWave Flash) is an application that bolts into your
browser to display cartoons. It is considerably less heavyweight
than a video add-on, but more so than a static graphic one (such as
one for JPEG, as with files like fruitflies.jpg).

Java is a general-purpose, fully-functional scripting language and
has nothing to do with JavaScript, but can be used in the same way.
It is considerably less repulsive and more secure.

JavaScript is a hacked-up scripting language that bolts into your
browser to allow the Web server you are visiting to do horrible
things to your computer (i.e. run programs on it). You had better
pray that either it wasn't written by a malicious hacker or that
your local JavaScript interpreter is tolerably secure.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Thanks, Nick. I don't see any Flash on Holly's site, so perhaps that's
because I use a Mac.
--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

In article ,
Stewart Robert Hinsley writes:
|
| I can't get past the front page either - while there is a way past the
| Flash animation this doesn't work for me. I suspect that this is due to
| the use of JavaScript in the web page. (Unnecessary use of JavaScript
| seems to be a least as common a sin as unnecessary use of Flash.)

Yes :-(

I have seen pages where the menu item to select the text-only pages
was encoded as a Flash image, and ones where the item to select no
JavaScript was handled by JavaScript.

D'oh.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In reply to Nick Maclaren ) who wrote this in
, I, Marvo, say :

In article ,
Stewart Robert Hinsley writes:

I can't get past the front page either - while there is a way past
the Flash animation this doesn't work for me. I suspect that this
is due to the use of JavaScript in the web page. (Unnecessary use
of JavaScript seems to be a least as common a sin as unnecessary
use of Flash.)

Yes :-(

I have seen pages where the menu item to select the text-only pages
was encoded as a Flash image, and ones where the item to select no
JavaScript was handled by JavaScript.

D'oh.

It called Catch-22. Micro$loth did it when they pre-released NT4, how I
laughed, you couldn't install the CD drivers because they were on a CD. When
I rang them to find out what I was supposed to do, they said it was the
first time anyone had reported such a problem. Whoops. And, furthermore,
D'Oh.

Seems so long ago now.

:-)