JTM wrote:

In article ,
Donnie wrote:
Exactly. (but perhaps there should have been a smiley)
;-( I haven't seen a rat (or any dormice, shrews, foxes
or housemice) for ages, but I know they are around John

How?
Eh? Because of their traces, just as I haven't seen the
neighbour's dog for a few days, but I know it's been outside
the front of our house

Right, so Im still right then as I have no traces of rats, so my
original statement still stands.

--
Donnie

"JTM" wrote in message
...
In article ,
john brook wrote:


if you look for them it may surprise to see how very
thick main branches are brought down.
Even the mistletoe is enough to catch the wind in some trees
and make them sway much more than the trees without it. In
winter when the leaves have been shed it can be quite
noticeable

--
I have a very large garden with 50+ trees, some of which have ivy on. The
only tree that came down in the gale force winds a few weeks ago was a
damson (without ivy)

wrote in :

In article ,
john brook wrote:

Ivy grew up my ash trees. No sign it's harmed them. Ivy is great
for birds, they hide in it from cold and some nest in it.

Apart from looking unsightly to some, it can cause damage to the
tree from high winds. the tree calculates how strong to make its
branches to a fine degree and doesnt allow for the added *wind-
resistance* of ivy. you often
see broken branches from ivy infested trees.

That applies only when it gets out into the canopy. Even a thick
coat of ivy on the trunk and main branches will not harm a healthy
tree (or most unhealthy ones, for that matter).

if you look for them it may surprise to see how very thick main
branches are brought down.

Sigh. That's irrelevant, as you should remember from your school
days (elementary physics).

It is as much a matter of leverage as quantity. Ivy IN THE CANOPY
can break quite large branches, but ivy ON JUST THE MAIN BRANCHES
will do so only if they are already completely rotten.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Sigh.

With all respect to you Nick, nothing is clear cut. Elementary Physics does
not and cannot be relevent to this discussion without some kind of data to
input. To generalise is not quite scientific, as you know.
Ivy IN THE CANOPY can break quite large branches, to quote you, is hardly
enough data to form a scientific obsevation, now is it!
but ivy ON JUST THE MAIN BRANCHES will do so only if they are already
completely rotten. Another of your observations. This is not scientific in
any way shape or form.
It is as much a matter of leverage as quantity. Yet another quote from your
dissertation. Leverage? Quantity?. Will you give me the correct terms for
these properties expressed in 'elementary physics' language?
Give us some formulae to support some of this and I will shut me gob.

Vanity and pomposity are your constant companions I think, but I mean this
in a kind way. Please don't take offence. We can all be that way. Not an
insult to you.

Baz