Sterilizing Kilner jars
I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the
jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. I do bottle some things when I have the oven on and cooking. Thanks Baz |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
In article , Baz wrote:
I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. I do bottle some things when I have the oven on and cooking. No, they wouldn't. Not even remotely. That combination kills things like acetobacter, lactobacter etc., few of which sporulate. If you are going to store non-acid foods anaerobically, you need to either kill some very tough spores or prevent them from growing. That is why salting, smoking etc. were and are used to preserve such foods. Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
On 07/09/2013 12:39, Nick Maclaren wrote:
In article , Baz wrote: I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. I do bottle some things when I have the oven on and cooking. No, they wouldn't. Not even remotely. That combination kills things like acetobacter, lactobacter etc., few of which sporulate. If you are going to store non-acid foods anaerobically, you need to either kill some very tough spores or prevent them from growing. That is why salting, smoking etc. were and are used to preserve such foods. Regards, Nick Maclaren. I am sure that in the beginning Baz said he was going to bottle fruit and veg. Where have you got this obsessive idea that he is going to bottle fish and meat? For fruit I've used a combination of Sodium Metabisulphite and boiling water to clean the jars, as I do for Jam, just has foul vapour. David @ a now clouding over side of Swansea Bay |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
In article ,
David Hill wrote: I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. I do bottle some things when I have the oven on and cooking. No, they wouldn't. Not even remotely. That combination kills things like acetobacter, lactobacter etc., few of which sporulate. If you are going to store non-acid foods anaerobically, you need to either kill some very tough spores or prevent them from growing. That is why salting, smoking etc. were and are used to preserve such foods. I am sure that in the beginning Baz said he was going to bottle fruit and veg. Where have you got this obsessive idea that he is going to bottle fish and meat? For fruit I've used a combination of Sodium Metabisulphite and boiling water to clean the jars, as I do for Jam, just has foul vapour. I have not, but you seem to have an obsessive delusion that all vegetables are high in acid. Since you seem to have trouble with this: MOST VEGETABLES DO NOT CONTAIN ENOUGH ACID TO STOP CLOSTRIDIUM BOTULINUM FROM GROWING. MOST FRUITS DO, HOWEVER, AND *T*H*E*R*F*O*R*E* EXPERIENCE WITH FRUIT IS *I*R*R*E*L*E*V*A*N*T*. THE RISK OF BOTULISM FROM BOTTLING VEGETABLES IS VERY LOW. BUT THE RISK OF DEATH IS *V*E*R*Y* HIGH IF IT DOES HAPPEN. IT IS PROBABLY *H*I*G*H*E*R* THAN FOR MEAT AND FISH, FOR SEVERAL REASONS. Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
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Sterilizing Kilner jars
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Sterilizing Kilner jars
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Sterilizing Kilner jars
In article , Baz wrote:
Capitals are regarded as shouting. Perhaps you can set your keyboard to whispering. Only joking. But can I bottle......... Joking again. God help me, I am seriously ****ed off with the trolls and just plain idiots who keep ignoring the simple fact that the vegetables you want to bottle are non-acid :-( I don't know exactly what the chances are of a non-gassy, non-tainting botulinus infection are, but the consequences of one are likely to be death for anyone eating the result. If I were bottling vegetables, I would do as we did in the UK in the 1950s and use pressure. Fruit isn't a problem, and you don't need pressure. There were good reasons that most people in the UK up to the 1950s used bottling only for fruit, and preserved vegetables by salting, drying etc. Pressure bottling is a pain to do, and constrains the amounts you do and size of bottles. But it's your life .... Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 14:27:51 +0100, Janet wrote:
In article , says... I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. No, but you only need to have the oven on low for 20 mins so hardly a vast expense. Wash jars in hot soapy water, rinse, drain, pack the empty wet jars standing upright in a roasting tin and put it in the oven. Turn oven on to 120 C, once it's reached temp 10 mins should do it. I've never bottled anything and only occasionally make jam. When making small amounts of jam, I sterilised my jars ( washed, rinsed and drained) by half-filling them with water and giving them a few minutes boiling in the microwave. Is this good enough? Pam in Bristol |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
On 2013-09-07 15:58:40 +0000, Pam Moore said:
On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 14:27:51 +0100, Janet wrote: In article , says... I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. No, but you only need to have the oven on low for 20 mins so hardly a vast expense. Wash jars in hot soapy water, rinse, drain, pack the empty wet jars standing upright in a roasting tin and put it in the oven. Turn oven on to 120 C, once it's reached temp 10 mins should do it. I've never bottled anything and only occasionally make jam. When making small amounts of jam, I sterilised my jars ( washed, rinsed and drained) by half-filling them with water and giving them a few minutes boiling in the microwave. Is this good enough? Pam in Bristol A hot wash (& dry) in the hottest setting dishwasher is recommended by quite a lot of jam makers. I haven't made jam or marmalde for ages but I used to do that and have never yet poisoned anyone. To keep them at a heat that wouldn't allow them to crack when filled with hot marmalade, I put them on a baking tray in the bottom of the Aga but I'm sure a warm setting on an oven would do the same job. -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.com South Devon |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
In article ,
Pam Moore wrote: On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 14:27:51 +0100, Janet wrote: In article , says... I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. No, but you only need to have the oven on low for 20 mins so hardly a vast expense. Wash jars in hot soapy water, rinse, drain, pack the empty wet jars standing upright in a roasting tin and put it in the oven. Turn oven on to 120 C, once it's reached temp 10 mins should do it. I've never bottled anything and only occasionally make jam. When making small amounts of jam, I sterilised my jars ( washed, rinsed and drained) by half-filling them with water and giving them a few minutes boiling in the microwave. Is this good enough? I (and many other people) don't bother with more than ensuring that they aren't excessively grubby. Hot jam will kill most of the heat-sensitive whatsits, and the nasty ones won't grow in an acid, high-sugar product. That being said, my strawberry jam (which I cooked lightly to preserve its freshness) was a little TOO lightly cooked, and has developed mould on top and fermented somewhat. Big deal. Both are harmless to humans - and we consume both from choice (e.g. blue cheese and real beer). Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
On 07/09/2013 18:33, sacha wrote:
On 2013-09-07 15:58:40 +0000, Pam Moore said: On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 14:27:51 +0100, Janet wrote: In article , says... I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. No, but you only need to have the oven on low for 20 mins so hardly a vast expense. Wash jars in hot soapy water, rinse, drain, pack the empty wet jars standing upright in a roasting tin and put it in the oven. Turn oven on to 120 C, once it's reached temp 10 mins should do it. I've never bottled anything and only occasionally make jam. When making small amounts of jam, I sterilised my jars ( washed, rinsed and drained) by half-filling them with water and giving them a few minutes boiling in the microwave. Is this good enough? Pam in Bristol A hot wash (& dry) in the hottest setting dishwasher is recommended by quite a lot of jam makers. I haven't made jam or marmalde for ages but I used to do that and have never yet poisoned anyone. To keep them at a heat that wouldn't allow them to crack when filled with hot marmalade, I put them on a baking tray in the bottom of the Aga but I'm sure a warm setting on an oven would do the same job. I'm not going to go out to buy a dishwasher just to heat jam jars. I'm still making jam, though I haven't done any yet this year, also I make a tomato and apple chutney. One thing I want to try is instead of lids or papers and covers for the jars (I've actually been using cling film for the last few years) is to try candle wag poured on when the jam is still warm/hot it will cap off the contents., The wife who is Canadian tells me that is what her mother used to do. David @ a now damp side of Swansea Bay, well just 3 or 4 very light showers so far but a build up of cloud. |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
On 07/09/2013 13:54, Nick Maclaren wrote:
BUT THE RISK OF DEATH IS *V*E*R*Y* HIGH IF IT DOES HAPPEN. Regards, Nick Maclaren. Think you'll find that although that used to be the case, with antitoxin treatment and intensive care (mainly artificial respiration), it is down to around 10%, maybe less. -- Jeff |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
In article ,
Jeff Layman wrote: BUT THE RISK OF DEATH IS *V*E*R*Y* HIGH IF IT DOES HAPPEN. Think you'll find that although that used to be the case, with antitoxin treatment and intensive care (mainly artificial respiration), it is down to around 10%, maybe less. Could well be. I tend to avoid activities with that level of risk but - hey! - there's no accounting for taste. Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
Sterilizing Kilner jars
"Baz" wrote in message ... I was wondering, instead of wasting gas and electricity to sterilize the jars, if citric acid and sodium bisulphite(as in winemaking sterilization) would do the trick. I do bottle some things when I have the oven on and cooking. Thanks Baz Sterilising is a very exact term and means the destruction of all life. Not possible with boiling water. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sterili...obiology)#Heat Using water, sterilisation can only be achieved with low pressure steam (but more thean atmospheric). The correct term for what you achieve with boiling water (and chemicals) is disinfection (only some bacteria are killed). Plenty can survive boiling water ad infinitum. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disinfection |
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