Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?
--
Jane Lumley

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"Jane Lumley" wrote in message
...
Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?
--
Jane Lumley

I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add
something of use here.

You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to
build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind
breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and
over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the
leeward side of the wall.

A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge
and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs
the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the
leeward side of a wall.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad?

I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?

Try ex-urgler cormaic's site, www.pavingexpert.

We moved (from a rural garden well over 3 acres) partly because of
rapidly increasing traffic noise and nuisance. In our situation, it was
mostly tourist traffic; IOW, it was at its worst at exactly the times we
wanted to be outside enjoying the garden, in good weather and all
holiday periods.

Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or
tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it
in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area
during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30
mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at
busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks?
Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if
you'll be able to sleep with a window open.

I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your
garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise
or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else).

Janet.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Well, really! If you're that suspicious of us.....

......you can tell us when it's yours.

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad?

Maybe. You'd be surprised just how much noise a good dense hedge will
absorb. Walls are expensive things to build, though in the right
position can be used to grow fruit against.

You will need to get planning permission probably. If it's windy and
really exposed, lengths of wall tend to come down. Think
'crinkly-crankly': you use more bricks, but it is not likely to be blown
over.

Best to attend an evening class in bricklaying: it's not really
difficult. I was taught by Old Bob, [1] a brickie's labourer - he was in
his nineties and still labouring. (It got a bit much for him when he was
ninety eight (IIRC) and he got a job cleaning Mr. Whippy vans.)

I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?

Oops! Got a bit ahead of myself there! Old Bob taught me properly, using
matured lime mortar and having the frogs in the bricks on the underside
so water doesn't seep into them and freeze during the winter. Nowadays,
because it's easier and quicker, brickies tend to lay courses with the
frogs upwards. "Oh, that's all right as long as you point them
well....." Pah!

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Well, really! If you're that suspicious of us.....

......you can tell us when it's yours.

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad?

Maybe. You'd be surprised just how much noise a good dense hedge will
absorb. Walls are expensive things to build, though in the right
position can be used to grow fruit against.

You will need to get planning permission probably. If it's windy and
really exposed, lengths of wall tend to come down. Think
'crinkly-crankly': you use more bricks, but it is not likely to be blown
over.

Best to attend an evening class in bricklaying: it's not really
difficult. I was taught by Old Bob, [1] a brickie's labourer - he was in
his nineties and still labouring. (It got a bit much for him when he was
ninety eight (IIRC) and he got a job cleaning Mr. Whippy vans.)

I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?

Oops! Got a bit ahead of myself there! Old Bob taught me properly, using
matured lime mortar and having the frogs in the bricks on the underside
so water doesn't seep into them and freeze during the winter. Nowadays,
because it's easier and quicker, brickies tend to lay courses with the
frogs upwards. "Oh, that's all right as long as you point them
well....." Pah!

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"Philip" wrote in message
.. .

"Jane Lumley" wrote in message
...
Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?
--
Jane Lumley

I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add
something of use here.

You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to
build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind
breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up
and
over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the
leeward side of the wall.

A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge
and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these
circumstancs
the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the
leeward side of a wall.

And that is not just a legend. I had a book (where is the damn thing?) with
test results from research on hedges and walls as windbreaks. A hedge
provides wind shelter for more than twice as far downwind than a wall of the
same height.

Franz

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 09:24:01 +0000 (UTC), "Franz Heymann"
wrote:


"Philip" wrote in message
. ..

"Jane Lumley" wrote in message
...
Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?
--
Jane Lumley

I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add
something of use here.

You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to
build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind
breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up
and
over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the
leeward side of the wall.

A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge
and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these
circumstancs
the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the
leeward side of a wall.

And that is not just a legend. I had a book (where is the damn thing?) with
test results from research on hedges and walls as windbreaks. A hedge
provides wind shelter for more than twice as far downwind than a wall of the
same height.

It's a bit like the difference between a solid break water/sea walls
and barriers of large loose rocks, now so popular in North East
England's sea defences.
The first diverts waves and the second absorbs waves.
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
: The message
: from Jane Lumley contains these words:
:
: Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
: of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
: :).
:
: Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
: noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
: walls around at least part of it. Are we mad?
:
: I've looked at several
: websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
: anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
: those night-school bricklaying courses?
:
: Try ex-urgler cormaic's site, www.pavingexpert.
:
: We moved (from a rural garden well over 3 acres) partly because of
: rapidly increasing traffic noise and nuisance. In our situation, it was
: mostly tourist traffic; IOW, it was at its worst at exactly the times we
: wanted to be outside enjoying the garden, in good weather and all
: holiday periods.
:
: Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or
: tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it
: in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area
: during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30
: mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at
: busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks?
: Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if
: you'll be able to sleep with a window open.
:
: I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your
: garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise
: or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else).
:
: Janet.
:
I would agree with Janet. We live in a suburban cul-de-sac approx 5 miles
from Heathrow. We obviously get a certain amount of aircraft noise and if
the wind is in a certain direction and they are using a certain runway, the
planes take off overhead which can be unbearable - but better now that
Concorde is no longer with us - but does not happen too often. However, my
point is that we always say we prefer to live here than on a road that has
constant traffic noise day and night. Mind you, we may feel differently
when we get the 5th terminal, 3rd runway, etc etc.......

K

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"martin" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 09:24:01 +0000 (UTC), "Franz Heymann"
wrote:


"Philip" wrote in message
. ..

"Jane Lumley" wrote in message
...
Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an
acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps
me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building
brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at
several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one
of
those night-school bricklaying courses?
--
Jane Lumley

I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will
add
something of use here.

You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing
to
build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as
wind
breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up
and
over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the
leeward side of the wall.

A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your
hedge
and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these
circumstancs
the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the
leeward side of a wall.

And that is not just a legend. I had a book (where is the damn thing?)
with
test results from research on hedges and walls as windbreaks. A hedge
provides wind shelter for more than twice as far downwind than a wall of
the
same height.

It's a bit like the difference between a solid break water/sea walls
and barriers of large loose rocks, now so popular in North East
England's sea defences.
The first diverts waves and the second absorbs waves.

Yes. Identical principles.
The principle of least efficient fluid flow - to - mechanical energy
conversion.

Franz

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"Jane Lumley" wrote in message
...
Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?
--
Jane Lumley

Search out from yellow pages a company that simply does bricklaying you will
find they should only charge per 1000 bricks and the cost will be much
cheaper than you think
However you do need to use good bricks .,,......as many ordinary faced ones
like LBC are unsuitable because wet and frost blows face off the bricks

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from Jaques d'Alltrades contains these words:

Best to attend an evening class in bricklaying: it's not really
difficult. I was taught by Old Bob, [1] a brickie's labourer - he was in
his nineties and still labouring. (It got a bit much for him when he was
ninety eight (IIRC) and he got a job cleaning Mr. Whippy vans.)

Missing footnote:

[1] Not as brewed by Ridleys, but quite as good.

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article , Janet Baraclough
writes
The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad?


I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your
garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise
or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else).

Secondary double glazing does a better job of shutting out traffic noise
than the all in one stuff - you need a larger air gap for sound
insulation than you do for heat insulation. We have double glazed units
plus secondary double glazing on the front of the house, and that cuts
out noise quite effectively.

A house is quite good at blocking out noise, so if you can arrange it so
you do most of your living the side away from the road it will be more
tolerable.
--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article , Philip
writes


I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add
something of use here.

You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to
build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind
breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and
over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the
leeward side of the wall.

A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge
and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs
the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the
leeward side of a wall.

But a hedge is fairly rubbish at cutting out noise. Though you'll need a
very tall wall to cut out the traffic sound. A bank with a hedge on top
might do quite well if you have the room - no experience of that, but
it's what they seem to be doing alongside new bypasses nowadays.



--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 15:55:51 +0000, Kay Easton
wrote:

In article , Janet Baraclough
writes
The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).

Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic
noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick
walls around at least part of it. Are we mad?


I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your
garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise
or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else).

Secondary double glazing does a better job of shutting out traffic noise
than the all in one stuff - you need a larger air gap for sound
insulation than you do for heat insulation. We have double glazed units
plus secondary double glazing on the front of the house, and that cuts
out noise quite effectively.

A house is quite good at blocking out noise, so if you can arrange it so
you do most of your living the side away from the road it will be more
tolerable.

It enabled us to hear the planes passing a 1000 feet above our heads
more clearly :-)
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 15:58:18 +0000, Kay Easton
wrote:


But a hedge is fairly rubbish at cutting out noise. Though you'll need a
very tall wall to cut out the traffic sound. A bank with a hedge on top
might do quite well if you have the room - no experience of that, but
it's what they seem to be doing alongside new bypasses nowadays.

It doesn't mean that it is effective.

The Dutch installed hundreds of kilometers of sound barriers along
urban parts of their motorways, before somebody made some independent
sound measurements and proved that the stuff was not effective.

Locally somebody did some tests that demonstrated that in a gale the
whole lot my blow over, so they made lots of really big holes in it.
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

How about a low wall with hedge shrubs planted in the top?

A few years ago I did some outdoor courses at a horse stud and didn't even know there was a busy by-pass only about 50 yards away thanks to some retaining banks and thick hedges - but was told it's sometimes loud in winter after leaf fall. Bearing that in mind, evergreens seem sensible, at least in part.

We built our own stable yard from scratch, so I've learned that brickwork is a doddle. There's only three main rules. First is footings must be right for the soil type, wall height and any surrounding planting. A local builder will offer advice on those fronts. The second is that piers must be built in at distances capable of strengthening the wall depending on it's height. Putting piers at both sides is a good idea. The third is really important, but often forgotten - mortar strength is vital. It must be weaker than the bricks, partly so that if frost damages the wall the mortar will give before the bricks (it's easier to fix, after all!) and partly so that when the bricks come to be re-used they are almost self cleaning.

We had a builder come and give us quotes for our yard and while he was there picked his brains about pier distance and so on, then cheekily built it all ourselves! A gardening book gave mortar mixes and I think we've pretty much cracked the whole thing now just by practice and a bit more practice. To make the stables cheap we used concrete blocks, seconds from the housing trade, and rendered it all. Looks great painted, but will need repainting in places within 5 years. Coloured render would have been more sensible, but you live and learn! Most of the walls are rendered block for the first course, then old bricks from anything knocked down locally. The old bricks are weak but utterly gorgous! They look fantastic once up and really set the place off within the countryside. Being odd sizes and shapes means they are easy to use because any bits I've built off level are soon hidden anyway!

Having said all that, if I were you I would be tempted to plant a nice hedge with maybe some wall to grow things against. The wind filtering of a hedge is better and you won't get the nasty eddies that walls make on their leeward side, nor frost pockets.

Hope it all works out well.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"martin" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 15:58:18 +0000, Kay Easton
wrote:


But a hedge is fairly rubbish at cutting out noise. Though you'll need a
very tall wall to cut out the traffic sound. A bank with a hedge on top
might do quite well if you have the room - no experience of that, but
it's what they seem to be doing alongside new bypasses nowadays.

It doesn't mean that it is effective.

The Dutch installed hundreds of kilometers of sound barriers along
urban parts of their motorways, before somebody made some independent
sound measurements and proved that the stuff was not effective.

Locally somebody did some tests that demonstrated that in a gale the
whole lot my blow over, so they made lots of really big holes in it.

To provide a good path to let the sound get back to the side from which it
came?

Franz

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 18:30:29 +0000 (UTC), "Franz Heymann"
wrote:


Locally somebody did some tests that demonstrated that in a gale the
whole lot my blow over, so they made lots of really big holes in it.

To provide a good path to let the sound get back to the side from which it
came?

I think it was rather than admit how much money they had wasted :-(
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article m,
(Hazell B) wrote:

Having said all that, if I were you I would be tempted to plant a nice
hedge with maybe some wall to grow things against

You'd want the hedge to grow higher than the wall pretty quick.
Leylandii? :-)

Steve Harris - Cheltenham - Real address steve AT netservs DOT com

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"...........Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and
traffic noise ............"
Now this sounds like a good place for a 40ft leylandii hedge

--
David Hill
Abacus nurseries
www.abacus-nurseries.co.uk
***2004 catalogue now available***

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

I
Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or
tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it
in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area
during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30
mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at
busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks?
Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if
you'll be able to sleep with a window open.

But where, exactly, can I find a village house with no traffic noise in
the southeast? Frankly, it's unrealistic, or it is with my budget. The
other houses I looked at recently were a. on the Brize Norton flightpath
as well as an A-road b. within earshot of the M40. Maybe I've been
unlucky, but the only house I saw in a 'quiet' location had a garden
smaller than a pocket handkerchief.

Of course I'd like rural tranquillity, but I don't think complete peace
is obtainable in my part of England. What I do strongly dislike is not
traffic noise but people noise. Radios, nice little barbecues. Little
dears on skateboards. Little dears bouncing their lovely balls against
a wall. This house is at the end of the village, so at least there
should be less of that than in my current terrace.

Having said that, the traffic seems modest rather than constant.

--
Jane Lumley

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

Jane Lumley wrote:

Hello Jane

JL Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and
JL traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden
JL by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we
JL mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of
JL bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a
JL site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one
JL of those night-school bricklaying courses?

uk.d-i-y is the "better place" for this kind of thing, but the reason
it seems complicated is because it can be - especially if you plan on
building walls above a certain height; they need buttressing and
reinforcement at specific places to make sure they don't fall over and
squash someone.

--
Simon Avery, Dartmoor, UK Ý http://www.digdilem.org/

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article ,
Simon Avery wrote:
Jane Lumley wrote:

JL Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and
JL traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden
JL by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we
JL mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of
JL bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a
JL site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one
JL of those night-school bricklaying courses?

uk.d-i-y is the "better place" for this kind of thing, but the reason
it seems complicated is because it can be - especially if you plan on
building walls above a certain height; they need buttressing and
reinforcement at specific places to make sure they don't fall over and
squash someone.

No, it's not complicated - that's not the same as needing to be got
right. I am thinking of doing the same, though I would probably
get someone to do the building (lack of time). But I have designed
it myself - you don't need advanced mathematics. The reference
pamphlet is "design of Free Standing Walls" by J.O.A. Korff,
published by the Brick Development Association. It covers all you
need to know.

If you are doing anything unusual or pushing the limits, such as I
plan to, it is probably worth paying a bit to get it vetted by an
architect. You may also find it a lot cheaper to get a builder
to do it than you think if you are prepared to schedule the time
according to their convenience. But you MUST contract a finishing
date, or it will never be finished!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

Jane Lumley wrote:

JL Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and
JL traffic noise,

I replied

Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or
tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it
in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area
during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30
mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at
busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks?
Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if
you'll be able to sleep with a window open.

But where, exactly, can I find a village house with no traffic noise in
the southeast? Frankly, it's unrealistic, or it is with my budget. (snip

First, you have not previously informed us of your geographical search
area, village location requirements or budget. You can't REALISTICALLY
expect replies tailored to what you haven't mentioned.

Second, you raised the issue of noise. I did not suggest you find a
house with "no traffic noise"; only that you very carefully evaluate the
nature and level of traffic noise at your "find" (which only yesterday
was sufficiently concerning that you were wondering how to reduce it).

I learn from experience. Consequently I shan't waste any more of my
time offering advice to you.

Janet

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

Hi All

Subject: Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
From: Jaques d'Alltrades
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 22:50:17 GMT

The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me!
:).
Good luck with the new garden.
I've looked at several
websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does
anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of
those night-school bricklaying courses?

I did. Found it very useful, although I have not practiced the skill very
much. There are 2 types of course. The full blown C & G type, and a simple
bricklaying. I went on the latter. Not really jargaon laden and when you
understand the relationship betwen bricks and bonds it is beatifully simple.

Oops! Got a bit ahead of myself there! Old Bob taught me properly, using
matured lime mortar and having the frogs in the bricks on the underside
so water doesn't seep into them and freeze during the winter. Nowadays,
because it's easier and quicker, brickies tend to lay courses with the
frogs upwards. "Oh, that's all right as long as you point them
well....." Pah!

I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It allows more
mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.

Peter Bridge

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On 02 Dec 2003 09:00:03 GMT, (BridgeP) wrote:


I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It allows more
mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.

What's a frog in this context?
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article ,
martin writes:
| On 02 Dec 2003 09:00:03 GMT, (BridgeP) wrote:
|
| I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It allows more
| mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.
|
| What's a frog in this context?

Much the same as on a horse, though nothing to do with frogging.

[ The indentation on the top or bottom or both. ]


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On 2 Dec 2003 10:08:52 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:


In article ,
martin writes:
| On 02 Dec 2003 09:00:03 GMT, (BridgeP) wrote:
|
| I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It allows more
| mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.
|
| What's a frog in this context?

Much the same as on a horse, though nothing to do with frogging.

[ The indentation on the top or bottom or both. ]

duh! I always thought that the profile of the top and bottom of a
brick were the same.
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

On 2 Dec 2003 10:08:52 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:


In article ,
martin writes:
| On 02 Dec 2003 09:00:03 GMT, (BridgeP) wrote:
|
| I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It allows more
| mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.
|
| What's a frog in this context?

Much the same as on a horse, though nothing to do with frogging.

[ The indentation on the top or bottom or both. ]

duh! I always thought that the profile of the top and bottom of a
brick were the same.
--
Martin

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article ,
martin writes:
|
| duh! I always thought that the profile of the top and bottom of a
| brick were the same.

With older bricks, that is usually the case. About 150 years
back (I think), bricks started to be made with a frog. Modern
(ordinary) bricks almost always are.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"martin" wrote in message
...
On 02 Dec 2003 09:00:03 GMT, (BridgeP) wrote:


I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It allows
more
mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.

What's a frog in this context?
The indentation moulded into one face of a brick is known as the frog. I
have no idea why.

Franz

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

"martin" wrote in message
...
On 2 Dec 2003 10:08:52 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:


duh! I always thought that the profile of the top and bottom of a
brick were the same.

No. Not on a proper brick-shaped brick.

Franz

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

(Nick Maclaren) wrote:

Hello Nick

[Brick Walls]

uk.d-i-y is the "better place" for this kind of thing, but
the reason it seems complicated is because it can be -
especially if you plan on building walls above a certain
height; they need buttressing and reinforcement at specific
places to make sure they don't fall over and squash
someone.

NM No, it's not complicated - that's not the same as needing to
NM be got right.

Maybe complicated is the wrong word, but building a high wall in brick
is a LOT more, well, complicated than simply putting one brick on top
of another until you're done.

No, I think complicated is what I meant, and that maybe you meant
difficult. It's not /difficult/ per se to build a, say, 8' wall (I've
done several), but it's not as simple as it looks. You need to factor
the right amount and strength of foundation, insert reinforcing at the
correct distance and not only buttress, but provide expansion/fall
gaps. And that's without going into the retaining side.

At least - that's how you're /supposed/ to do it, according to regs.
If it does fall over and squash somebody, you're backside is going to
be mighty popular if you didn't follow the exact regulations laid down
at the time of building.

Lot more complicated than it used to be, but that's the price of a
litigation led society. OTOH, it theoretically leads to fewer
squashees.

--
Simon Avery, Dartmoor, UK Ý http://www.digdilem.org/

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from (BridgeP) contains these words:

Oops! Got a bit ahead of myself there! Old Bob taught me properly, using
matured lime mortar and having the frogs in the bricks on the underside
so water doesn't seep into them and freeze during the winter. Nowadays,
because it's easier and quicker, brickies tend to lay courses with the
frogs upwards. "Oh, that's all right as long as you point them
well....." Pah!

I was taught that it is 'fogs up'. This is in the text books. It
allows more
mortar/brick. 'Frogs down' is the economy method - les mortar.

Nope. You fill the frog with mortar and place a dollop on one end and
lay it, press it into place and trim off extruded excess. Frogs are full
of mortar and can't fill up with water in the case of a broken or poor
bit of pointing.

Modern methods may say frog up. The frog down philosophy was taught me
by a man in his nineties, in the 1950s, but when I lay bricks (which is
seldom) I always lay them that way, and I've never known of any trouble
with what I've put up.

Oh, and the only reason Old Bob wasn't a brickie then was because at his
age he wasn't fast enough, but the firm (Masterbuilder and family) kept
him on, working at his own pace. He was a time-served bricklayer by
trade.

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from "Franz Heymann" contains these words:

What's a frog in this context?
The indentation moulded into one face of a brick is known as the frog. I
have no idea why.

Probably from a similar-shaped indentation under a horse's hoof.

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article , Jaques d'Alltrades writes:
| The message
| from "Franz Heymann" contains these words:
|
| What's a frog in this context?
| The indentation moulded into one face of a brick is known as the frog. I
| have no idea why.
|
| Probably from a similar-shaped indentation under a horse's hoof.

Which is not what the OED says. I agree with you, and think that
the OED is wrong.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

In article , Janet Baraclough
writes

Jane Lumley wrote:

JL Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and
JL traffic noise,

I replied

Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or
tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it
in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area
during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30
mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at
busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks?
Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if
you'll be able to sleep with a window open.

But where, exactly, can I find a village house with no traffic noise in
the southeast? Frankly, it's unrealistic, or it is with my budget. (snip

First, you have not previously informed us of your geographical search
area, village location requirements or budget. You can't REALISTICALLY
expect replies tailored to what you haven't mentioned.

Second, you raised the issue of noise. I did not suggest you find a
house with "no traffic noise"; only that you very carefully evaluate the
nature and level of traffic noise at your "find" (which only yesterday
was sufficiently concerning that you were wondering how to reduce it).

I learn from experience. Consequently I shan't waste any more of my
time offering advice to you.

I'm sorry you felt hurt - I really didn't mean to be rude. I do
appreciate your advice, and I'm grateful that you took time to write.
It truly wasn't a waste of time - I'm awed by the kindness of people on
Usenet, always.
--
Jane Lumley

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:
In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes:
| The message
| from "Franz Heymann" contains
these words:
|
| What's a frog in this context?
| The indentation moulded into one face of a brick is known as the
frog. I
| have no idea why.
|
| Probably from a similar-shaped indentation under a horse's hoof.

Which is not what the OED says. I agree with you, and think that
the OED is wrong.

I went right off the OED when it started including ephemeral words -
sort of M$ philosophy - built-in obsolibrance.

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words:

I learn from experience. Consequently I shan't waste any more of my
time offering advice to you.

I'm sorry you felt hurt - I really didn't mean to be rude. I do
appreciate your advice, and I'm grateful that you took time to write.
It truly wasn't a waste of time - I'm awed by the kindness of people on
Usenet, always.

Janet's probably a bit windswept ATM - weather-wise, of course..

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)

Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
 

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:
In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes:
| The message
| from "Franz Heymann" contains
these words:
|
| What's a frog in this context?
| The indentation moulded into one face of a brick is known as the
frog. I
| have no idea why.
|
| Probably from a similar-shaped indentation under a horse's hoof.

Which is not what the OED says. I agree with you, and think that
the OED is wrong.

I went right off the OED when it started including ephemeral words -
sort of M$ philosophy - built-in obsolibrance.

--
Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano,
iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03)