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Weedkiller
Hi Just starting out on an allotment and need a pointer. I have been advised to treat the weeds with 'Roundup'. now this stuff is about £20 a container. Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? And where from? Cheers Steve |
'Steve',
Don't use weed killer. Just dig it (double digging is best) and remove the weeds as you go. Regards. Emrys Davies. "Steve" wrote in message .uk... Hi Just starting out on an allotment and need a pointer. I have been advised to treat the weeds with 'Roundup'. now this stuff is about £20 a container. Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? And where from? Cheers Steve |
In article , Emrys Davies
writes 'Steve', Don't use weed killer. Just dig it (double digging is best) and remove the weeds as you go. I agree with Emrys. Poisonous herbicides like Roundup are not suitable for use where food plants are to be grown. -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. |
I have been advised to treat the weeds with 'Roundup'. now this stuff is
about £20 a container. Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? And where from? The main ingredient is glyphosphate. |
"Alan Gould" wrote in message ... In article , Emrys Davies writes 'Steve', Don't use weed killer. Just dig it (double digging is best) and remove the weeds as you go. I agree with Emrys. Poisonous herbicides like Roundup are not suitable for use where food plants are to be grown. -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants before the crop is harvested. |
In article , Jimbo
writes Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants before the crop is harvested. I try not to. :-( -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. |
Jimbo (remove $ ) wrote in message ... "Alan Gould" wrote in message ... In article , Emrys Davies writes 'Steve', Don't use weed killer. Just dig it (double digging is best) and remove the weeds as you go. I agree with Emrys. Poisonous herbicides like Roundup are not suitable for use where food plants are to be grown. -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants before the crop is harvested. In this context, it doesn't matter what happens to commercial potatoes. Most gardeners growing their own crops do so to avoid the poisons associated with commercially-grown crops (excepting organic produce, of course). Spider |
The message
from "Jimbo" (remove $ ) contains these words: Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants before the crop is harvested. They are sprayed with very strong sulphuric acid - IIRC, 85% -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
I agree with Emrys. Poisonous herbicides like Roundup are not suitable
for use where food plants are to be grown. Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants before the crop is harvested. I assume you are saying that commercial potato growers use glyphosate on the field before they harvest the potato crop. If they do does that make it good practice? I would have thought that if someone is taking the time and trouble to maintain an allotment, then they are probably aspiring to growing food that is not tainted by commercial practices. I dont want to put words into the OP's mouth, just that would be uppermost in my mind if I had the time to 'dig'. |
The message
from Martin contains these words: On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 13:09:19 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades wrote: The message from "Jimbo" (remove $ ) contains these words: Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants before the crop is harvested. They are sprayed with very strong sulphuric acid - IIRC, 85% To remove the leaves before picking or what? Since there is a weak solution of sulphuric and hydrochloric acid falling out of the sky daily, does it really make any difference if the spuds are sprayed with 85% mix? It's to kill the foliage so that the skins quickly harden on the tubers. If you just harvest spuds when the haulm is still green they don't keep so long. -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
In article ,
(Steve) wrote: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. And where from? Garden Centres, etc. Steve Harris - Cheltenham - Real address steve AT netservs DOT com A useful bit of gardening software at http://www.netservs.com/garden/ |
In article , Martin
writes Organic producers uses organically acceptable poisons in some cases. I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers. Could you be more specific? -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. |
I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers.
Could you be more specific? Vinegar is a non-selective herbicide. Is it acceptable to "organic" producers? |
"Steve Harris" wrote in message ... In article , (Steve) wrote: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. And where from? Garden Centres, etc. But make sure you compare like with like when looking at prices. The stuff is being marketed at various concentrations. Franz |
The message
from (IntarsiaCo) contains these words: I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers. Could you be more specific? Vinegar is a non-selective herbicide. Is it acceptable to "organic" producers? So is urine, especially a bitch's. -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
Franz Heymann wrote:
:: "Steve Harris" wrote in message :: ... ::: In article , ::: (Steve) wrote: ::: :::: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? ::: ::: Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. ::: :::: And where from? ::: ::: Garden Centres, etc. :: :: But make sure you compare like with like when looking at prices. :: The stuff is being marketed at various concentrations. :: Yep! B&Q do their own glyphosate weedkiller ready to use...it's a really weak solution though....I don't know of anyone who does it the same concentration as 'Roundup' itself. |
Martin wrote:
:: On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:18:33 GMT, "Phil L" :: wrote: :: ::: Franz Heymann wrote: ::::: "Steve Harris" wrote in message ::::: ... :::::: In article , :::::: (Steve) wrote: :::::: ::::::: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? :::::: :::::: Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. :::::: ::::::: And where from? :::::: :::::: Garden Centres, etc. ::::: ::::: But make sure you compare like with like when looking at prices. ::::: The stuff is being marketed at various concentrations. ::::: ::: Yep! ::: B&Q do their own glyphosate weedkiller ready to use...it's a ::: really weak solution though....I don't know of anyone who does it ::: the same concentration as 'Roundup' itself. :: :: Does the B&Q concentration work? :: Not as good as the 'real' thing...I've found that dandelions (the bane of my life!) needed two applications of the b&q stuff, but only one good dose of roundup - it worked out cheaper to buy roundup in the long run. |
Hey, didn't meen to spark an argument!!
But thanks lads. I'll go for Roundup and leave it a good while to dissipate. Steve. "Martin" wrote in message ... On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:48:11 GMT, "Phil L" wrote: Martin wrote: :: On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:18:33 GMT, "Phil L" :: wrote: :: ::: Franz Heymann wrote: ::::: "Steve Harris" wrote in message ::::: ... :::::: In article , :::::: (Steve) wrote: :::::: ::::::: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? :::::: :::::: Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. :::::: ::::::: And where from? :::::: :::::: Garden Centres, etc. ::::: ::::: But make sure you compare like with like when looking at prices. ::::: The stuff is being marketed at various concentrations. ::::: ::: Yep! ::: B&Q do their own glyphosate weedkiller ready to use...it's a ::: really weak solution though....I don't know of anyone who does it ::: the same concentration as 'Roundup' itself. :: :: Does the B&Q concentration work? :: Not as good as the 'real' thing...I've found that dandelions (the bane of my life!) needed two applications of the b&q stuff, but only one good dose of roundup - it worked out cheaper to buy roundup in the long run. Thanks, that's what I suspected. -- Martin |
Steve wrote:
:: Hey, didn't meen to spark an argument!! :: :: But thanks lads. I'll go for Roundup and leave it a good while to :: dissipate. :: :: Steve. TBH, I only use it on dandelions and occasionally thistles, everything else I have is easy to get out by hand. Roundup is useful for, dandelions, thistles and docks, all of which have deep roots, any part which is left in will produce another plant. if you have these weeds, I wouldn't bother with it: Nettles: easy to get out and their roots are bright yellow...Alan gave some excellent pointers on how to make the tops into a 'nettle manure'...details he http://www.nugget.demon.co.uk/MetaFAQ/nettle.html Brambles: Fairly easy to cut back and dig out the roots manually. Grasses: as above, or turn the sods upside down now to let them rot down over winter. other 'flimsy' weeds like chickweed etc can just be turned in. |
"Steve" wrote in message .uk... Hey, didn't meen to spark an argument!! But thanks lads. I'll go for Roundup and leave it a good while to dissipate. Steve. "Martin" wrote in message ... On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:48:11 GMT, "Phil L" wrote: Martin wrote: :: On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:18:33 GMT, "Phil L" :: wrote: :: ::: Franz Heymann wrote: ::::: "Steve Harris" wrote in message ::::: ... :::::: In article , :::::: (Steve) wrote: :::::: ::::::: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? :::::: :::::: Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. :::::: ::::::: And where from? :::::: :::::: Garden Centres, etc. ::::: ::::: But make sure you compare like with like when looking at prices. ::::: The stuff is being marketed at various concentrations. ::::: ::: Yep! ::: B&Q do their own glyphosate weedkiller ready to use...it's a ::: really weak solution though....I don't know of anyone who does it ::: the same concentration as 'Roundup' itself. :: :: Does the B&Q concentration work? :: Not as good as the 'real' thing...I've found that dandelions (the bane of my life!) needed two applications of the b&q stuff, but only one good dose of roundup - it worked out cheaper to buy roundup in the long run. Thanks, that's what I suspected. -- Martin Agent Orange works well but does leave a lousy aftertaste. (And damages offspring) |
In article , IntarsiaCo
writes I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers. Could you be more specific? Vinegar is a non-selective herbicide. Is it acceptable to "organic" producers? Vinegar is not a poison. -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. |
In article , Martin
writes Organic producers uses organically acceptable poisons in some cases. I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers. Could you be more specific? I said poisons not herbicidal poisons. This thread is about weed killers. In chemical form that is herbicides. -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. |
"Alan Gould" wrote in message ... In article , IntarsiaCo writes I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers. Could you be more specific? Vinegar is a non-selective herbicide. Is it acceptable to "organic" producers? Vinegar is not a poison. Try again. Franz |
"Martin" wrote in message ... On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:18:33 GMT, "Phil L" wrote: Franz Heymann wrote: :: "Steve Harris" wrote in message :: ... ::: In article , ::: (Steve) wrote: ::: :::: Is there a generic eqivalent I might buy? ::: ::: Look for weedkillers mentioning glyphosphate as an ingredient. ::: :::: And where from? ::: ::: Garden Centres, etc. :: :: But make sure you compare like with like when looking at prices. :: The stuff is being marketed at various concentrations. :: Yep! B&Q do their own glyphosate weedkiller ready to use...it's a really weak solution though....I don't know of anyone who does it the same concentration as 'Roundup' itself. Does the B&Q concentration work? Yes, probably. But what you need to compare is the price per unit volume of liquid multiplied by the concentration. Alternatively, if the bottles display the soil area covered, compare the price per unit area. Franz |
"Steve" wrote in message .uk... Hey, didn't meen to spark an argument!! But thanks lads. I'll go for Roundup and leave it a good while to dissipate. [snip] Wait till you see what an argument in urg actually is. {:-)) I think we are all exploring the topic to really find out if the running out of the patent on Monsanto's roundup is, or is not, actually putting cheaper products on the market. So far it is dubious. Franz |
The message
from Alan Gould contains these words: In article , IntarsiaCo writes I don't know any herbicidal poisons acceptable to organic producers. Could you be more specific? Vinegar is a non-selective herbicide. Is it acceptable to "organic" producers? Vinegar is not a poison. Yes it is. Too much water is a poison. -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
The message
from "Phil L" contains these words: other 'flimsy' weeds like chickweed etc can just be turned in. Or in the case of chickweed, incorporated into salads... -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
Vinegar is not a poison.
It is if you are a weed. The active ingredient is definately a poison. Is it an acceptable herbicide for the "organic" producer? |
In article , IntarsiaCo
writes Vinegar is not a poison. It is if you are a weed. The active ingredient is definately a poison. Is it an acceptable herbicide for the "organic" producer? Vinegar is not mentioned in the guidelines for organic weed control. If it is a poisonous herbicide as you say, then it is not acceptable, along with all spray type chemical weed-killers. -- Alan & Joan Gould - North Lincs. |
In article ,
Alan Gould wrote: In article , IntarsiaCo writes Vinegar is not a poison. It is if you are a weed. The active ingredient is definately a poison. Is it an acceptable herbicide for the "organic" producer? Vinegar is not mentioned in the guidelines for organic weed control. If it is a poisonous herbicide as you say, then it is not acceptable, along with all spray type chemical weed-killers. Such as extract of macerated walnut leaves? Regarding vinegar and walnut leaf extract as "not organic" is most definitely making a religion out of what is, at least basically, a scientific approach. Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
"Franz Heymann" wrote in message ... "Steve" wrote in message .uk... Hey, didn't meen to spark an argument!! But thanks lads. I'll go for Roundup and leave it a good while to dissipate. [snip] Wait till you see what an argument in urg actually is. {:-)) I think we are all exploring the topic to really find out if the running out of the patent on Monsanto's roundup is, or is not, actually putting cheaper products on the market. So far it is dubious. There have been lots of generic roundups available cheaper for a while. Roundup has changed to Roundup Ultra, with a changed surfactant, I believe. -- Anton |
"anton" wrote in message ... "Franz Heymann" wrote in message ... "Steve" wrote in message .uk... Hey, didn't meen to spark an argument!! But thanks lads. I'll go for Roundup and leave it a good while to dissipate. [snip] Wait till you see what an argument in urg actually is. {:-)) I think we are all exploring the topic to really find out if the running out of the patent on Monsanto's roundup is, or is not, actually putting cheaper products on the market. So far it is dubious. There have been lots of generic roundups available cheaper for a while. The only ones I have come across which were significantly cheaper, were so only because they were less concentrated than Roundup. If you would quote the name of one of these cheaper ones, I would definitely keep a look out for it. Roundup has changed to Roundup Ultra, with a changed surfactant, I believe. Franz |
"Franz Heymann" wrote in message ... "anton" wrote in message ... "Franz Heymann" wrote in message ... There have been lots of generic roundups available cheaper for a while. The only ones I have come across which were significantly cheaper, were so only because they were less concentrated than Roundup. If you would quote the name of one of these cheaper ones, I would definitely keep a look out for it. Nufarm 'Clinic' herbicide, for instance- from memory, about £25 for 5litres with about 30-odd percent glyphosate, 40-odd percent glyphosate salt, 50-odd percent solids including surfactant. Ag. suppliers will all have a generic roundup, but you might need to buy 5 litres. -- Anton |
"anton" wrote in message ... "Franz Heymann" wrote in message ... "anton" wrote in message ... "Franz Heymann" wrote in message ... There have been lots of generic roundups available cheaper for a while. The only ones I have come across which were significantly cheaper, were so only because they were less concentrated than Roundup. If you would quote the name of one of these cheaper ones, I would definitely keep a look out for it. Nufarm 'Clinic' herbicide, for instance- from memory, about £25 for 5litres with about 30-odd percent glyphosate, 40-odd percent glyphosate salt, 50-odd percent solids including surfactant. Ag. suppliers will all have a generic roundup, but you might need to buy 5 litres. Many thanks. I'll look in at a convenirnt ag shop. Franz |
Vinegar is not mentioned in the guidelines for organic weed control.
If it is a poisonous herbicide as you say, then it is not acceptable, along with all spray type chemical weed-killers. Who made up these silly guidelines? Are they meant to be followed blindly? |
In article , Martin writes: | On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 13:09:19 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades | wrote: | | Alan--do you ever think about what happens to "commercial" potatoes plants | before the crop is harvested. | | They are sprayed with very strong sulphuric acid - IIRC, 85% | | To remove the leaves before picking or what? | | Since there is a weak solution of sulphuric and hydrochloric acid | falling out of the sky daily, does it really make any difference if | the spuds are sprayed with 85% mix? Well, it probably doesn't make much difference to the ecology, but I very much doubt that they do use that. The local farmers grow potatoes, I often see farm equipment being moved along the roads, and I have never seen any equipment of a type that could handle that. 85% sulphuric acid cuts through steel or flesh in a very short space of time - not as fast as Aqua Regia, but fast. Are you sure that it isn't some other acid? Even hydrochloric is MUCH easier and safer to handle. Regards, Nick Maclaren. |
The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words: Well, it probably doesn't make much difference to the ecology, but I very much doubt that they do use that. The local farmers grow potatoes, I often see farm equipment being moved along the roads, and I have never seen any equipment of a type that could handle that. 85% sulphuric acid cuts through steel or flesh in a very short space of time - not as fast as Aqua Regia, but fast. Are you sure that it isn't some other acid? Even hydrochloric is MUCH easier and safer to handle. Regards, I am sure, and I was horrified when I discovered it was being used on large fields of spuds in which there were numbers of partridges and pheasants, not to mention wildlife. Partridges and pheasants especially may sit tight while farm machinery passes by or over them, and - well, I leave the rest up to your imagination. I think the practice should be made illegal. It is mainly large contractors who rent huge areas of land, plant their own seed potatoes and harvest them with their own tackle, not small farmers who would need specialist machinery. Most of them (as do some of our local potato growers) let the haulm die down naturally. -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
In article ,
(Phil L) wrote: it worked out cheaper to buy roundup in the long run. If you study the packaging carefully, you will note: - Dilution before use is the norm - The glyphosate content You will find several offerings cheaper than Roundup (more glyphosate per pound) Steve Harris - Cheltenham - Real address steve AT netservs DOT com A useful bit of gardening software at http://www.netservs.com/garden/ |
The message
from Martin contains these words: AFAIR from childhood, the leaves etc. had died back by the time potato harvesting/spud picking began. Have things changed so much? Is the acid treatment reserved for crops of new potatoes Yes, and no. Harvest your maincrop early and you get a better price, and if the weather becomes wet, a better yield. The idea is for the tubers to remain in the ground for a week or two so the skins harden, which improves their keeping properties. -- Rusty Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar. http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ |
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