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Old 05-09-2006, 01:43 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

Farm1 wrote:
"Jen" wrote in message
"George.com" wrote in message


in NZ we can get it through farm merchants in bulk lots (10/20/30
kg bags).
Works out cheap though the bag last ages. I guess Aus farm
merchants would sell it as well.



Why would anyone need such big bags? What else is it used for?


Boron deficient soil. It's an important trace element but you'd need
a lot of land and to be growing lots of cabbages in boron deficient
soil.


And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations for a week
though, there's some big rain coming in.

--
ant
Don't try to email me;
I'm borrowing the spammer du jour's addy



  #32   Report Post  
Old 05-09-2006, 03:28 PM posted to aus.gardens
Jen Jen is offline
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Default Getting Borax


"ant" wrote in message
...
Farm1 wrote:
"Jen" wrote in message
"George.com" wrote in message


in NZ we can get it through farm merchants in bulk lots (10/20/30
kg bags).
Works out cheap though the bag last ages. I guess Aus farm
merchants would sell it as well.


Why would anyone need such big bags? What else is it used for?


Boron deficient soil. It's an important trace element but you'd need
a lot of land and to be growing lots of cabbages in boron deficient
soil.


And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations for a week
though, there's some big rain coming in.


Surely that would be enough to annihilate the whole race of ants. Unless of
course you have giant mutant ants of some sort.

Jen


  #33   Report Post  
Old 06-09-2006, 05:04 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

"ant" wrote in message
...
Farm1 wrote:
"Jen" wrote in message
"George.com" wrote in message


in NZ we can get it through farm merchants in bulk lots

(10/20/30
kg bags).
Works out cheap though the bag last ages. I guess Aus farm
merchants would sell it as well.


Why would anyone need such big bags? What else is it used for?


Boron deficient soil. It's an important trace element but you'd

need
a lot of land and to be growing lots of cabbages in boron

deficient
soil.


And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations for

a week
though, there's some big rain coming in.


You won't need anything near 10-30 kg to deal with ants. If you use
that much then you'll have effectively poisoned your soil.


  #34   Report Post  
Old 06-09-2006, 05:06 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

"Jen" wrote in message
"ant" wrote in message
Farm1 wrote:
"Jen" wrote in message
"George.com" wrote in message

in NZ we can get it through farm merchants in bulk lots

(10/20/30
kg bags).
Works out cheap though the bag last ages. I guess Aus farm
merchants would sell it as well.


Why would anyone need such big bags? What else is it used for?

Boron deficient soil. It's an important trace element but you'd

need
a lot of land and to be growing lots of cabbages in boron

deficient
soil.


And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations

for a week
though, there's some big rain coming in.


Surely that would be enough to annihilate the whole race of ants.

Unless of
course you have giant mutant ants of some sort.


Hmmmmm. Given his name, is he wanting to wipe out the relatives?
:-))))))


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Old 06-09-2006, 01:05 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message
...
Farm1 wrote:
"Jen" wrote in message
"George.com" wrote in message

in NZ we can get it through farm merchants in bulk lots
(10/20/30 kg bags).
Works out cheap though the bag last ages. I guess Aus farm
merchants would sell it as well.


Why would anyone need such big bags? What else is it used for?

Boron deficient soil. It's an important trace element but you'd
need a lot of land and to be growing lots of cabbages in boron
deficient soil.


And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations for
a week though, there's some big rain coming in.


You won't need anything near 10-30 kg to deal with ants. If you use
that much then you'll have effectively poisoned your soil.


10kg would be too much for 16 acres?

--
ant
Don't try to email me;
I'm borrowing the spammer du jour's addy




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Old 07-09-2006, 12:34 AM posted to aus.gardens
SG1 SG1 is offline
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Default Getting Borax


"ant" wrote in message
...
Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message
...
Farm1 wrote:
"Jen" wrote in message
"George.com" wrote in message

in NZ we can get it through farm merchants in bulk lots
(10/20/30 kg bags).
Works out cheap though the bag last ages. I guess Aus farm
merchants would sell it as well.


Why would anyone need such big bags? What else is it used for?

Boron deficient soil. It's an important trace element but you'd
need a lot of land and to be growing lots of cabbages in boron
deficient soil.

And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations for
a week though, there's some big rain coming in.


You won't need anything near 10-30 kg to deal with ants. If you use
that much then you'll have effectively poisoned your soil.


10kg would be too much for 16 acres?

--

The idea is to get rid of the nests that cause a problem, NOT scar the
earth. Ants are there for a purpose, great scavengers & cleaner-uppers. You
actually need them
Jim


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Old 07-09-2006, 09:37 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

"ant" wrote in message
Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message


And getting those mongrel ants. I'll have to suspend operations

for
a week though, there's some big rain coming in.


You won't need anything near 10-30 kg to deal with ants. If you

use
that much then you'll have effectively poisoned your soil.


10kg would be too much for 16 acres?


Have you done any searches on how much boron you use in an ant killing
station? My understanding is that it is something like tablespoon of
boron to about a half cup of icing sugar. If you use too much borax
on the basis of more is better then that is not so. The ants are not
attracted to the borax but to the icing sugar and they will not take
the bait unless it appeals to them. I know that with boron deficiency
in cabbages, the rate of application is a teaspoon/gallon of water.
That is a tiny amount of Borax and is for an identified deficiency.
Even for apple trees that produce "corky" fruit the remedy is only 4oz
for a mature tree - again a tiny amount.

Boron is a very minutely needed trace element and I would be very
cautious with how much you used and where. My reaction would be to
try to get rid of the problem bringing the ants and to try to use
white oil or some similar mild form of bug control rather than to risk
killing every ant on the place and poisoning your soil. And I'd be
using it only close tot he house if that is where your main problems
of ant infestation and because of incursion into the house.Start small
is always I think a better policy till you see what will occur.


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Old 07-09-2006, 11:40 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

SG1 wrote:

The idea is to get rid of the nests that cause a problem, NOT scar the
earth. Ants are there for a purpose, great scavengers &
cleaner-uppers. You actually need them


They're wrecking my trees. Maybe I won't kill all of them though,
occasionally a large echidna appears but he doesn't seem to be eating very
many.


--
ant
Don't try to email me;
I'm borrowing the spammer du jour's addy


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Old 08-09-2006, 12:49 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax


ant wrote:
SG1 wrote:

The idea is to get rid of the nests that cause a problem, NOT scar the
earth. Ants are there for a purpose, great scavengers &
cleaner-uppers. You actually need them


They're wrecking my trees. Maybe I won't kill all of them though,
occasionally a large echidna appears but he doesn't seem to be eating very
many.


--
ant
Don't try to email me;
I'm borrowing the spammer du jour's addy


What are they doing that makes you think it is the ants that are
wrecking your trees and what sort of trees are being effected?

The ants may be just a symptom and not the cause of the damage to your
trees.

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Old 08-09-2006, 01:06 AM posted to aus.gardens
Jen Jen is offline
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Default Getting Borax


"GreenieLeBrun" wrote in message
ups.com...

ant wrote:
SG1 wrote:

The idea is to get rid of the nests that cause a problem, NOT scar the
earth. Ants are there for a purpose, great scavengers &
cleaner-uppers. You actually need them


They're wrecking my trees. Maybe I won't kill all of them though,
occasionally a large echidna appears but he doesn't seem to be eating
very
many.



How do ants wreck trees? Just wondering.

Jen




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Old 09-09-2006, 04:50 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

Sigh. Again. Many of the trees I've planted (several hundred so far) over
the past 13 years or so are covered in scale/sticky/sooty stuff, and every
struggling tree is covered in ants. If a tree looks "clean", but later has
ants walking all over it, it invariably ends up with this disease on it, and
suffers a set back. I never knew what the connection was with ants, but knew
that ants meant the tree was in for it.

Some trees that were doing well, now are dead.

This area seems to have a lot of ants, and I think there are termites here
too.



--
ant
Don't try to email me;
I'm borrowing the spammer du jour's addy


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Old 09-09-2006, 09:17 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

"ant" wrote in message
Sigh. Again. Many of the trees I've planted (several hundred so far)

over
the past 13 years or so are covered in scale/sticky/sooty stuff, and

every
struggling tree is covered in ants. If a tree looks "clean", but

later has
ants walking all over it, it invariably ends up with this disease on

it, and
suffers a set back. I never knew what the connection was with ants,

but knew
that ants meant the tree was in for it.


I can understand why you are sighing as I'm sitting here doing the
same thing.

I'd like to know, after you nuke all the ants on your property and get
rid of them, do you think the scale and sooty mould will automatically
disappear?

Some trees that were doing well, now are dead.


That isn't surprising as you clearly have a problem, but is it the
ants or are there other underlying problems?

This area seems to have a lot of ants, and I think there are

termites here
too.


Not long ago you told me of a property down the hill below you and
which you overlook. I'm fairly sure I know that place (is it on a
corner with a dam at the bottom of the hill and asmall bareish paddock
right on the corner?) If it is that place then I'd have to say that
it shines like a beacon in an otherwise relatively barren landscape.

You wrote about how well the trees there had done and the care the
owners took to grow those trees and just how well their trees had
grown. Do the ants and termites in your area stay within the bounds
of your property or does the "area" having lots of ants mean that the
ants occur beyond your property line? Does the well treed property
have ants? If they don't have ants and termites there now, did they
ever? What care do they give to their trees that you don't (or can't)
give to yours? Did they nuke all the ants or did they do something
else that made the trees grow so that they look so strong and healthy?
Do they have bird life that you don't? Do they feed and water their
trees? Do they grow different trees to you? In short, why can they
do it but you can't?

You say "many" of your trees have scale. Is it one species that does
or is it a mix of all the trees?


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Old 10-09-2006, 01:25 AM posted to aus.gardens
Jen Jen is offline
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Default Getting Borax


"ant" wrote in message
...
Sigh. Again. Many of the trees I've planted (several hundred so far) over
the past 13 years or so are covered in scale/sticky/sooty stuff, and every
struggling tree is covered in ants. If a tree looks "clean", but later has
ants walking all over it, it invariably ends up with this disease on it,
and suffers a set back. I never knew what the connection was with ants,
but knew that ants meant the tree was in for it.



I know the discussion here has been about the ants bringing scale and aphids
to plants. But I think with that much of a problem, surely just getting rid
of the ants isn't going to do that much good. There must be other problems
causing all these bugs. Maybe the trees have a problem that they can't
stand up to the bugs.

Jen


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Old 11-09-2006, 12:56 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax


ant wrote:
Sigh. Again. Many of the trees I've planted (several hundred so far) over
the past 13 years or so are covered in scale/sticky/sooty stuff, and every
struggling tree is covered in ants. If a tree looks "clean", but later has
ants walking all over it, it invariably ends up with this disease on it, and
suffers a set back. I never knew what the connection was with ants, but knew
that ants meant the tree was in for it.

Some trees that were doing well, now are dead.

This area seems to have a lot of ants, and I think there are termites here
too.



--
ant
Don't try to email me;
I'm borrowing the spammer du jour's addy


The ants are not the cause of your problem. They are feeding on the
sweet exudate from the scale inscects. The sooty mould is also a result
of the sugary exudate. Control the scale and the ants and mould will go
away.

How do you control the scale? There are a number of ways. Oil emusions
(white oil, pest oil etc.) are very effective.

http://www.rbgsyd.nsw.gov.au/informa.../scale_insects

http://www.greenharvest.com.au/fact_.../fs_scale.html

Killing the ants will NOT solve your problem.

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Old 18-09-2006, 12:50 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default Getting Borax

I personally use the product I found at
http://www.natural-ant-killer.com. It will not harm your plants or
trees and it is 100% effective.

In fact you will find that your trees will flourish because the
solution works as a fertilizer. It does this because it contains a
natural surfactant that breaks down the molecules of water which will
penetrate the waxy coating of the ants and instantly drown them.

At the same time, it works as a fertilizer because the smaller
molecules get down deeper in the soil.

I have to say it is the best thing I have found on the market and I
will never, ever use anything else!

?



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