This web site has eight pages comparing the nutrient content of many water
soluble fertilizers.

WARNING - it is put up by Dyna-Gro and not surprisingly their products come
out ahead in completeness.

http://www.dyna-gro.com/fert_comparison.pdf

Billy on the Florida Space Coast

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Billy M. Rhodes wrote:
This web site has eight pages comparing the nutrient content of many water
soluble fertilizers.

WARNING - it is put up by Dyna-Gro and not surprisingly their products come
out ahead in completeness.

http://www.dyna-gro.com/fert_comparison.pdf

So why would you trust the info? One fertilizer (of the same
type) is much like another.

By law, the same info is printed on the side of every bottle
of every fertilizer sold in the USA. It's easier to
comparison shop right in the store.

Again, plants don't give a hoot about brand names, and don't
care (too much) about the delivery system, either.
Exception: Timed release fertilizers. A real no-no in pots
if you like to control what your plants get and when they
get it.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Nature
encourages no looseness, pardons no errors. Ralph Waldo Emerson

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In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:41:12 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:

So why would you trust the info? One fertilizer (of the same
type) is much like another.


I posted it because it came up on another list. There they were looking at a
specific brand that had been recommended by another grower.
I would trust it as far as it goes, but since Dyna-Gro was the only one with
a complete list of trace elements, it could be that they left some competition
off the list that had the same formula.
No argument about the equality of fertilizers but many of the common brands
lack trace elements you may or may not need.
For landscape use, Florida is pushing the idea of using only the nutrients
you need, rather than using a balanced N-P-K. If you don't need the P-K why add
it to the runoff.
Of course, try to find a source of fertilizer that has no or limited amounts
of P-K. Most home owners can't.
For $3 you can send a soil sample to Gainesville and get back a pH report.
For $7 the report also lists P, K, and Ca. They are pushing the $7 report at
least in Brevard County.
Billy on the Florida Space Coast

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wrote:
In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:41:12 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


So why would you trust the info? One fertilizer (of the same
type) is much like another.



I posted it because it came up on another list. There they were looking at a
specific brand that had been recommended by another grower.
I would trust it as far as it goes, but since Dyna-Gro was the only one with
a complete list of trace elements, it could be that they left some competition
off the list that had the same formula.
No argument about the equality of fertilizers but many of the common brands
lack trace elements you may or may not need.
For landscape use, Florida is pushing the idea of using only the nutrients
you need, rather than using a balanced N-P-K. If you don't need the P-K why add
it to the runoff.
Of course, try to find a source of fertilizer that has no or limited amounts
of P-K. Most home owners can't.
For $3 you can send a soil sample to Gainesville and get back a pH report.
For $7 the report also lists P, K, and Ca. They are pushing the $7 report at
least in Brevard County.
Billy on the Florida Space Coast



Around here, the Extension Office recommends 15-0-15 for
landscape use as our soils are naturally high in P and P is
the primary runoff nutrient. Nurseries are even starting to
stock it (though they keep on stocking the 20-30-20 [and
other] stuff, too).

Pot plants, of course, need the X-X-X balance. I don't
worry about the amount of trace elements in the fertilizer I
buy since I get bottles of chelated elements (plus) and add
it to all my fish emulsion and seaweed fertilizer which
don't have trace elements -- at least not in amounts
suficient to go on the label.

I trust very little that the fertilizer manufacturers say --
even application rates, since they are always tilted to over
application because it means you buy more fertilizer.
(Still, for the average home gardener, it is best to follow
them; otherwise the homeoener would massively overapply
under the theory that "more is better" [especially on lawns]
It isn't.)

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Nature
encourages no looseness, pardons no errors. Ralph Waldo Emerson

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In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:41:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
writes:

Exception: Timed release fertilizers. A real no-no in pots
if you like to control what your plants get and when they
get it.



Jim raises an excellent point: fertilizing bonsai is ALL about controlling
what they receive, when they receive it, and for what purpose.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano
members.aol.com/iasnob

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In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:41:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
writes:

Exception: Timed release fertilizers. A real no-no in pots
if you like to control what your plants get and when they
get it.

*****************
For many years I have heard that timed release fertilizer is a bad
choice for bonsai, but my experience suggests otherwise. I use time
release fertilizer all the time, with excellent results (images of some
of my trees can be seen at www.jimgremel.com/bonsaigallery.html).

The primary advantage, for me, is that my trees get fertilized every
time they are watered. I use drip irrigation because the minerals in my
well water coat & discolor the foliage, bark & pots when I use overhead
water. It is surprising (to me, anyway) how well the time release
fertilizer works, considering that it doesn't get as wet as it would
from either overhead or hand watering.

I fertilize most of my trees all the time. I withhold the fertilizer
from some deciduous trees in Spring until the foliage has hardened off
to promote short internodes. For pines, the release from the Spring
application of fertilizer has tapered off by the it is time to
decandle, so I can scrape off most of the remaining pellets & wait a
couple of months before adding more (or leave them & allow the tree a
trickle of food).

I recommend reading & listening as much as possible, but then just
trying things that you think might work. What you know, or what I know,
to be the facts may be just firmly held opinions - probably correct,
but there may be better ways. For example, I purchased two brands of
time release fertilizer. They had the same NPK percentages, but one
also had micronutrients, so it had to be better, right? Wrong, the one
without micronutrients (I just checked the bag, it has NPK + calcium &
sulfer) performed way better. I still have about 400# of the
underperforming brand & am trying to figure out how to augment it to
boost its performance.

The best of the two brands? Apex 19-5-12 Bloom, a 3 month timed
release. I buy it in 50# bags from a nursery supply company in Half
Moon Bay, California.

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Jim Gremel wrote:
In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:41:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
writes:

Exception: Timed release fertilizers. A real no-no in pots
if you like to control what your plants get and when they
get it.

*****************
For many years I have heard that timed release fertilizer is a bad
choice for bonsai, but my experience suggests otherwise. I use time
release fertilizer all the time, with excellent results (images of some
of my trees can be seen at www.jimgremel.com/bonsaigallery.html).

To each his (or her) own. _I_ like to know how much
fertilizer my trees get and when they get it over the course
of a growing season. You have no idea whether your
timed-release fert pops none, one, or 40 capsules when you
water -- and for most, it's not _water_ that triggers
release. It is temperature. If the spoon-ful you dump into
your plants has 40% 85+ degree capsules and 15% 65 degree,
then you never have an 85 degree day for several weeks, you
are not getting any fert to your tree.

I don't plan to use it on any of my finished trees. My
gosh-the-these-might-amount-to-something-some-day-but-don't-bet-on-it
trees are lucky to get fertilized at all and if I happen to
have some time release fert around I might remember to give
them some -- or not.

I have to think the difference between the two fertilizers
was in the material (or the trigger mechanism) of the
capsules, and not the fert. Trees just don't care how they
get NPK, just so they get it.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - People,
when Columbus discovered this country, it was plum full of
nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you (that) the
berries are just about all gone. -- Uncle Dave Macon, musician

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Not so fast, Jim. I know nurserymen who swear by the capsules ( and none
who swear at them). It takes an average of 4 months to dissolve them - a
whole growing season in the North, and you don't have to remember when to
feed the trees.
The only possible fault with them is that they may produce soft growth too
late in the season; but I haven't had that problem. Certainly you should
not have to worry about this in FL. I have to admit that I cheat a bit by
using liquid fert. early in the season to give my trees a shot in the arm;
but after July 1, no more.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Lewis"
To:
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 3:13 PM
Subject: [IBC] Fertilizer Comparison Chart


Jim Gremel wrote:
In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:41:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
writes:

Exception: Timed release fertilizers. A real no-no in pots
if you like to control what your plants get and when they
get it.

*****************
For many years I have heard that timed release fertilizer is a bad choice
for bonsai, but my experience suggests otherwise. I use time release
fertilizer all the time, with excellent results (images of some of my
trees can be seen at www.jimgremel.com/bonsaigallery.html).

To each his (or her) own. _I_ like to know how much fertilizer my trees
get and when they get it over the course of a growing season. You have no
idea whether your timed-release fert pops none, one, or 40 capsules when
you water -- and for most, it's not _water_ that triggers release. It is
temperature. If the spoon-ful you dump into your plants has 40% 85+
degree capsules and 15% 65 degree, then you never have an 85 degree day
for several weeks, you are not getting any fert to your tree.

I don't plan to use it on any of my finished trees. My
gosh-the-these-might-amount-to-something-some-day-but-don't-bet-on-it
trees are lucky to get fertilized at all and if I happen to have some time
release fert around I might remember to give them some -- or not.

I have to think the difference between the two fertilizers was in the
material (or the trigger mechanism) of the capsules, and not the fert.
Trees just don't care how they get NPK, just so they get it.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - People, when Columbus
discovered this country, it was plum full of nuts and berries. And I'm
right here to tell you (that) the berries are just about all gone. --
Uncle Dave Macon, musician

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Marty Haber wrote:
Not so fast, Jim. I know nurserymen who swear by the capsules ( and
none who swear at them). It takes an average of 4 months to dissolve
them - a whole growing season in the North, and you don't have to
remember when to feed the trees.
The only possible fault with them is that they may produce soft growth
too late in the season; but I haven't had that problem. Certainly you
should not have to worry about this in FL. I have to admit that I cheat
a bit by using liquid fert. early in the season to give my trees a shot
in the arm; but after July 1, no more.

As I said, Marty, everyone can do as they wish. But unless
you have a "timed-release" fertilizer that releases 10 g of
NPK on Tuesday, 10 g of NPK on Thursday, etc. it's a crap
shoot as to what your trees get and when they get it. You
may get 10g on Tuesday, 40g on Thursday, 0g on Monday, 100g
of Friday.

For me, that is NOT satisfactory.

Jim Lewis - - Hit THINK before you hit SEND

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