Hey folks...just wanted to let people know...not ALL collecting trips are
fruitful !!! after seeing a stand of larch locally in a swamp 3 years ago ,
I finally found the landowner ,obtained permission and set out to looking for
worthy yamadori this morning. After taking nearly a half hour to get a couple
hundred yards into the swamp through extra thick tangles of god knows
what...I discovered that the only larch in here were the ones visible from
the road..all between 30 to 60' average height. Absolutely no saplings or
anything under these heights !!! Needless to say I was quite disapointed !
Oh...I almost forgot...I also found out my boots both leak profusely !!!
Anyway...believe it or not I really did enjoy myself...unbeleivable moss on
everything...kind of like what you see in an old growth forest...and it's
nice to be where no person ever goes...solitude yet close to home. so...can
anyone tell me why there were no younger trees anywhere to be found ? I truly
expected to find at least SOME collectable trees !...thanks for
reading...BobO

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the area is just too rough for the kids. and i'll bet the basic conditions have
changed becuase of construction or development thus the conditions aren't condusive
to furthrer spreading of the species.

In areas where I collect Larch seedlings/pre-bonsai they are almost
always in rocky sloping spots that are very well drained yet receive
relatively high rainfall. I can spend a whole day looking before I find
just the right spot. Spotting small Larch with no leaves is a skill that
also needs to be fairly well developed before you can guarantee success.
Try getting down on hands and knees and working slowly looking for
telltale rounded buds.

You're right though, half of the point is enjoying the looking ;-) We
scout accessible areas and find good potential collecting sites before
getting permission to collect.

Good luck

Kev Bailey


-----Original Message-----
From: Internet Bonsai Club ] On Behalf
Of Robert O'Brien
Sent: 31 March 2003 02:33
To:
Subject: [IBC] collecting ? : (

Hey folks...just wanted to let people know...not ALL collecting trips
are
fruitful !!! after seeing a stand of larch locally in a swamp 3 years
ago ,
I finally found the landowner ,obtained permission and set out to
looking for
worthy yamadori this morning. After taking nearly a half hour to get a
couple
hundred yards into the swamp through extra thick tangles of god knows
what...I discovered that the only larch in here were the ones visible
from
the road..all between 30 to 60' average height. Absolutely no saplings
or
anything under these heights !!! Needless to say I was quite disapointed
!
Oh...I almost forgot...I also found out my boots both leak profusely !!!
Anyway...believe it or not I really did enjoy myself...unbeleivable moss
on
everything...kind of like what you see in an old growth forest...and
it's
nice to be where no person ever goes...solitude yet close to home.
so...can
anyone tell me why there were no younger trees anywhere to be found ? I
truly
expected to find at least SOME collectable trees !...thanks for
reading...BobO

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********
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--
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail
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Thanks Kevin...yeah...being in a swamp...slopes and well draining were out of
the question...and locally this is the only stand of larch I have ever seen.
I suppose that it's possible I missed some...but they grow on little islands
not much more than 3-5' around so it wasn't too hard to get a clean picture
of ground around 'em. And the absence of in between trees really puzzles
me...anyway-thanks a bunch BobO

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In a message dated 3/31/03 2:48:10 AM,
writes:

collect Larch

It is interesting that Kevin is in Wales, UK and I think Bob is in
Australia. Could they be talking about two different trees?

Billy on the Florida Space Coast

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I discovered that the only larch in here were the ones visible from the
road..all between 30 to 60' average height. Absolutely no saplings or anything
under these heights !
can anyone tell me why there were no younger trees anywhere to be found ?

This is common. The conditions which promote seed germination and the growth of
young trees are not the same as those which promote the continued success of
mature specimens. In general, seedlings require sun. As they grow, there is
more and more shade. In a mature forest, it is too shady for any more seedlings
of the same species. Look for young trees at the edge of the woods, in
clearings, or where mature trees have died or been chopped down. Forests grow
in succession. In the most sun, you will find birches, poplars, and junk trees.
In partial shade you will find the maples and flowering trees, like dogwood.
Deeper in the woods are the oaks and beeches. The final stage, what is called
the climax forest, is the shadiest. In the Northeast US, it is the beech and
hemlock forest. If you wanted yamadori beeches or hemlocks, you would look at
the edge, where there are mature maples, or by the roadside, where the
seedlings get some sun.
Iris,
Central NY, Zone 5a, Sunset Zone 40
"If we see light at the end of the tunnel, It's the light of the oncoming
train."
Robert Lowell (1917-1977)

It's possible, Billy but unlikely. Larches are Larches as far as I know.
Of course there are species and varieties but their needs are fairly
similar. To be a little more specific, the ones I have experience of are
Larix decidua -European, Larix kaempferi - Japanese, Larix eurolepis -
Dunkeld Larch.

We often see Larches growing in boggy areas, where the forestry people
have planted them. They sometimes do reasonably well there but I've
never seen seedlings beneath them.

If Bob is in Aus my guess is that any Larch are likely to be introduced
L decidua.

Cheers

Kev B

collect Larch

It is interesting that Kevin is in Wales, UK and I think Bob is in
Australia. Could they be talking about two different trees?

Billy on the Florida Space Coast



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While Larches aren't an option in the tropics, I sympathise on the treeless
collecting trip. I try to take the view that at 35 I have at least 40 more
years of doing bonsai, so I can afford to be selective about what I collect.
Besides, as you said; sometimes it's nice to just be outdoors by yourself
enjoying the morning.

Regards,

Leslie St. John
Barbados
West Indies



"Robert O'Brien" wrote in message
...
Hey folks...just wanted to let people know...not ALL collecting trips are
fruitful !!! after seeing a stand of larch locally in a swamp 3 years ago
,
I finally found the landowner ,obtained permission and set out to looking
for
worthy yamadori this morning. After taking nearly a half hour to get a
couple
hundred yards into the swamp through extra thick tangles of god knows
what...I discovered that the only larch in here were the ones visible from
the road..all between 30 to 60' average height. Absolutely no saplings or
anything under these heights !!! Needless to say I was quite disapointed !
Oh...I almost forgot...I also found out my boots both leak profusely !!!
Anyway...believe it or not I really did enjoy myself...unbeleivable moss
on
everything...kind of like what you see in an old growth forest...and it's
nice to be where no person ever goes...solitude yet close to home.
so...can
anyone tell me why there were no younger trees anywhere to be found ? I
truly
expected to find at least SOME collectable trees !...thanks for
reading...BobO


************************************************** **************************
****
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****
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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

SAINT wrote:

While Larches aren't an option in the tropics, I sympathise on the treeless
collecting trip. I try to take the view that at 35 I have at least 40 more
years of doing bonsai, so I can afford to be selective about what I collect.
Besides, as you said; sometimes it's nice to just be outdoors by yourself
enjoying the morning.

Regards,

Leslie St. John
Barbados
West Indies


The way I have been looking at collecting is with a long view. At 45, hoping I
live to at least 80, where my father is, I'll have at least 35 more years. So, I'm
collecting larger material now while I'm young enough to lug it out of the woods.
It isn't easy, especially with the larger stuff, but I look at it as a way of
earning the tree. If I have to lug it out I'll think twice about whether it is
worth it. I can worry about repotting the larger stuff down the road. This spring
has been a banner year for collecting--I now have 6 honeysuckles that are fairly
large, one of which has a trunk girth of 16 inches. Not circumference-diameter.
I'm going to pot it today if the mist clears up. I also found an apple growing on
ledge on a church member's farm that is approximately 160 years old. Some odds and
ends too. I suspect that I will collect less as the years go on. Hard to say at
this point.

I've got such good collecting areas it's nearly impossible to come home without
something, and leave a lot of good stuff in the ground for next year. There was
even enough to share with some IBC members last Saturday.

Craig Cowing
NY
Zone 5b/6a

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Has anyone ever tried top collect a scrub oak from the sand hills of NC ? You
can see many very small and knarled little trees on the sand dunes. I've often
thought od collecting one little tree i see from the road every time i drive
by. It's on top of a dune and looks like a oak tree that should be huge but
it's small dwarfed almost alein.

Moon
remove nospam from e-mail to send to me, I grow trees in aquariums like bonsai.
I breed dwarf crayfish, great for planted community tanks. If you can get me a
shovelnose sturgeon fingerling (Scaphirhynchus platorynchus) no wild caught
please, contact me

Has anyone ever tried top collect a scrub oak from the sand
hills of NC ? You
can see many very small and knarled little trees on the sand
dunes. I've often
thought od collecting one little tree i see from the road every
time i drive
by. It's on top of a dune and looks like a oak tree that should
be huge but
it's small dwarfed almost alein.


These trees grow on top of sand dunes because nothing else will
and they can. They send roots down entirely through the dune in
search of water in perched aquifers, so roots are thick and
long -- VERY long. This makes successful collecting unlikely.
I'd recommend enjoying it where it is.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Our life is
frittered away by detail . . . . Simplify! Simplify. -- Henry
David Thoreau - Walden

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isn't collecting on sand dunes illegal? forbidden? environmentally
disasterous? any or all of these things. i live in ohio so i don't know
the laws of the beach. where i vacation (carolinas, florida) picking or
digging any dunes plants is illegal. i guess the dunes a very delicately
balanced system and changing the balance really destroys the dunes which
help prevent erosion of beach areas. you lucky coast residents, is this
right or is it ok in some areas?


art

In a message dated 4/5/2003 9:40:26 AM Eastern Standard Time,
writes:

Isn't collecting on sand dunes illegal? forbidden? environmentally
disastrous? any or all of these things.

All the land belongs to someone. It is either City, County, State or
Federal property or private property and permission to collect is always
required, sand dunes or not. In Florida disturbing plants on the dune is
serious and prosecuted in the courts.
Billy on the Florida Space Coast

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Jim Lewis wrote:

Has anyone ever tried top collect a scrub oak from the sand
hills of NC ? You
can see many very small and knarled little trees on the sand
dunes. I've often
thought od collecting one little tree i see from the road every
time i drive
by. It's on top of a dune and looks like a oak tree that should
be huge but
it's small dwarfed almost alein.


These trees grow on top of sand dunes because nothing else will
and they can. They send roots down entirely through the dune in
search of water in perched aquifers, so roots are thick and
long -- VERY long. This makes successful collecting unlikely.
I'd recommend enjoying it where it is.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Our life is
frittered away by detail . . . . Simplify! Simplify. -- Henry
David Thoreau - Walden

Also, those long roots help hold the dunes in place, thus preventing erosion. I'd
be willing to bet these trees are protected.

Craig Cowing
NY
Zone 5b/6a

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If these are like the sand hills near Kitty Hawk, they are NOT dunes, but
Sand Hills, across the highway from the dunes, about 100 feet high. You'd
stillneed permission, though
..
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Cowing"



Also, those long roots help hold the dunes in place, thus preventing
erosion. I'd
be willing to bet these trees are protected.

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