Jim
Absolutely! That IS the best SOLUTION. List members can and SHOULD do that. Regards Anil Kaushik Bonsai Club (India) Chandigarh "The City Beautiful" If only we WOULD ignore them -- but we don't. Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Nature encourages no looseness, pardons no errors. Ralph Waldo Emerson ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
On 26 Feb 2005 at 1:29, Wayne C. Morris wrote:
Well, I decided to take a quick look at the first and immediately discovered: "There is currently a moratorium on converting unmoderated newsgroups to moderated newsgroups, and proposals of that type will not be accepted." So, it was a thought. :-( jim I'm not terribly familiar with the process, but I dug up a few links to get you started... This page describes the process: http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/faqs/big-eight.html Here's a handbook for would-be moderators: http://www.landfield.com/usenet/moderators/handbook/ Here's a FAQ: http://www.swcp.com/~dmckeon/mod-faq.html And here's a page describing some of the problems & pitfalls: http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/faqs/mod-pitfalls.html ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
I am for ignoring the problem - somehow I just know which posts don't have
anything to do with Bonsai and somehow I avoid reading them. We spend too much time arguing about the problem and not enough effort ignoring the idiots. ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
I couldn't agree more. From local forsale newsgroups to programmers
newsgroups, the people here are nice and the spam is at a minimum. If you check Ziff Davis and other online/offline newsletters and magazines, spam is increasing exponentially. It is simply getting worse and worse. I see very little here compared to elsewhere. In the last issue, much was caused simply from cross-posting. Set the mailing list to block cross-posts and then just us in RAB will get the crap. I didn't see any posts from RAB members personally...just cross posts in that last go-round. Bonsai engenders almost no crossposting at all and would block maybe one in several hundred valid posts...which would still get to RAB and if us RAB guys answered it, it would make it to the mailing list. If Jim wanted to clue me in on the service we use to send to a mailing list from a newsgroup, I might could help implement that. My (informed) $0.02 worth. Like some of these other RAB posts mention, we are used to it and it really isn't that bad...comparitively speaking to what's going on lately. If you take alt.autos.ford, probably 30% of the new threads are crap. John still in Houston "Nina" wrote in message oups.com... Every once in a while I consider joining another group; I listen to the other group (Jazz, art, whatever) for a while and realize how GREAT this group is- we are literate, we stay on topic, and we are nice. Our problems with spammers and idiots are minor. I like the community of my dear friends on the maillist, but I'd like to reach out to newbies and lurkers on RAB without having to hang out there. My time is limited and I have a dial-up connection! Nina |
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Hi Jim
why not send every monday an automatic mail suggesting memebers not to loose time in idle talk ar answering to banter/OT topics .. after all most of people are "supposed to be adult* here and might understand .. In the french and some Italians site every monday the chart of the NG is automatically published . why not to do something here as well ? my and only 2 cents to this topic Theo Jim Lewis wrote: On 26 Feb 2005 at 1:29, Wayne C. Morris wrote: Well, I decided to take a quick look at the first and immediately discovered: "There is currently a moratorium on converting unmoderated newsgroups to moderated newsgroups, and proposals of that type will not be accepted." So, it was a thought. :-( jim I'm not terribly familiar with the process, but I dug up a few links to get you started... This page describes the process: http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/faqs/big-eight.html Here's a handbook for would-be moderators: http://www.landfield.com/usenet/moderators/handbook/ Here's a FAQ: http://www.swcp.com/~dmckeon/mod-faq.html And here's a page describing some of the problems & pitfalls: http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/faqs/mod-pitfalls.html ************************************************ ******************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************ ******************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ -- MSN messanger / or ICQ 25 666 169 4 Private Mail : «»«»«» Just for today... don't worry .....be happy «»«»«» |
Dear Shelly
Immediately place offenders on a filter list, i usually use del key without wasting any time to read or reply. , i have no knowledge of RAB. keep up the difficult job of list owner. ovais Pakistan Bonsai Society ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
Bonsai lurker wrote:
On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 19:01:32 +0100, Eltee wrote: Your isp can ban people from inappropriate posting on USENET, if, the group is classified as a moderated group. I don't know if this one is but surely one of the mods knows. If it is moderated, you can then report the spammers for posting off topic and harrassing posts. The reputable ones, especially the large USENET providers will warn their customers. Not 100% effective but it deters most nuisance posters. I'd hate to rain on your parade but your "Not 100% effective" could as well be "Not 10% effective". And that's not the worst news. The worst news is that with just a little header hack one can bypass any moderation on any newsgroup. Not even a hack, mind you. Just the right header. And ... one more thing, dear lurker: A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is it such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? That's not spam you're dealing with, Carl. There's a big difference. And your ISP knows it. Besides, your ISP can't ban anybody from posting to Usenet NGs. Usenet is a distributed network. It would take _all_ the ISPs (in the world!) to completely ban somebody. |
Bonsai lurker wrote:
On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 19:01:32 +0100, Eltee wrote: Your isp can ban people from inappropriate posting on USENET, if, the group is classified as a moderated group. I don't know if this one is but surely one of the mods knows. If it is moderated, you can then report the spammers for posting off topic and harrassing posts. The reputable ones, especially the large USENET providers will warn their customers. Not 100% effective but it deters most nuisance posters. I'd hate to rain on your parade but your "Not 100% effective" could as well be "Not 10% effective". And that's not the worst news. The worst news is that with just a little header hack one can bypass any moderation on any newsgroup. Not even a hack, mind you. Just the right header. And ... one more thing, dear lurker: A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is it such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? That's not spam you're dealing with, Carl. There's a big difference. And your ISP knows it. Besides, your ISP can't ban anybody from posting to Usenet NGs. Usenet is a distributed network. It would take _all_ the ISPs (in the world!) to completely ban somebody. |
I would like to see some moderation of the junk that is associated with this
list. One of the main problem is that many list members appear to reply to many of this type of post, or is this just other spammers making it look like this. Has any body thought to banning members who reply to spam. I am willing to agree to any measure that would cut some, most , all of the rubbish out. Lynette Sydney Australia ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shelly Hurd" To: Sent: Saturday, 26 February 2005 3:23 Subject: [IBC] Admin - R.A.B. - Long LIST. Which would you prefer. For the purpose of open discussion, please post ALL replies to the list. Shelly Hurd - List Owner/Manager ************************************************** ************************** **** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ************************** **** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
Hi all,
I'm new to the list, and haven't seen any spam yet. I was expecting my first post to be about bonsai, but since this came up, I'll throw in my two pennies :) On Sunday 27 February 2005 21:41, lynette g smith wrote: I would like to see some moderation of the junk that is associated with this list. One of the main problem is that many list members appear to reply to many of this type of post, or is this just other spammers making it look like this. Has any body thought to banning members who reply to spam. I am willing to agree to any measure that would cut some, most , all of the rubbish out. Lynette Hmm... greedy organisations/people deliberately sabotaging a community for their own ends is definitely not fun. Spam really bugs me, personally -- probably more than a lot of members. However, sometimes it is genuinely hard for certain folks to tell the difference, so I couldn't support banning people for being taken advantage of. Personally, I filter all my mail with spamassassin anyway. I get maybe 200 to 300 spams a day, but most of them are automatically filtered out. So in fact, I only see about 10 to 20 of those spams, and then it's a simple matter of moving them to the spam box to train the filter better for the future. If anyone is suffering a lot of spam, whether from here or elsewhere, I'd definitely recommend spamassassin or a mail client that can filter spam, such as Mozilla Thunderbird (http://www.mozilla.org). I think the usual control measures are to limit posting to the list to registered list subscribers, and often to filter messages through spamassassin BEFORE sending them out to everyone. Probably easier said than arranged, though. -- Lee. ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
Hi all,
I'm new to the list, and haven't seen any spam yet. I was expecting my first post to be about bonsai, but since this came up, I'll throw in my two pennies :) On Sunday 27 February 2005 21:41, lynette g smith wrote: I would like to see some moderation of the junk that is associated with this list. One of the main problem is that many list members appear to reply to many of this type of post, or is this just other spammers making it look like this. Has any body thought to banning members who reply to spam. I am willing to agree to any measure that would cut some, most , all of the rubbish out. Lynette Hmm... greedy organisations/people deliberately sabotaging a community for their own ends is definitely not fun. Spam really bugs me, personally -- probably more than a lot of members. However, sometimes it is genuinely hard for certain folks to tell the difference, so I couldn't support banning people for being taken advantage of. Personally, I filter all my mail with spamassassin anyway. I get maybe 200 to 300 spams a day, but most of them are automatically filtered out. So in fact, I only see about 10 to 20 of those spams, and then it's a simple matter of moving them to the spam box to train the filter better for the future. If anyone is suffering a lot of spam, whether from here or elsewhere, I'd definitely recommend spamassassin or a mail client that can filter spam, such as Mozilla Thunderbird (http://www.mozilla.org). I think the usual control measures are to limit posting to the list to registered list subscribers, and often to filter messages through spamassassin BEFORE sending them out to everyone. Probably easier said than arranged, though. -- Lee. ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
Shelly, this issue has come up fairly recently. I do not remember how I
found the list but feel it is a valuable adjunct to my continued education in bonsai. I don't know how important the link to RAB is, that is for others to decide. My reasons for sending this are twofold: First, we as individual users of the list (either directly or through the digest) control what is in the archives. If we ignore the spam then it takes very little space in the archives and could be edited out if necessary (no, I'm not volunteering). All members of the List need to be more responsible about replying to spam through the list. If in doubt, reply directly to the original sender so your e-mails do not contribute to the clutter in the archive. I know that I've recently skipped over the recent spate of off-topic postings which have been making their way through the list. If others had done the same, I'd have fewer postings to skip and the archives would be less filled. Second, if the archives are of concern (and they should be) then we should all clip our return comments, such as this, to the original e-mail. If we all do these two simple things, then the spam/off-topic problem will become so minor as to be ignorable. So my post here is a plea for a bit of personal restraint and responsibility. Jay Beckenbach - Melrose, FL - Zone 8b/9a - -----Original Message----- From: Shelly Hurd ] Subject: Admin - R.A.B. - Long In the past two weeks we have seen an increasing number of argumentative / off topic posts / and increasing numbers of spam posts all received through rec.arts.bonsai. These posts not only waste my time, they waste yours, and fill our archives with what can only be politely described as garbage. We/I have three alternatives: ..... ---------- CLIP ---------- ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
On 28 Feb 2005 at 10:53, Beckenbach, Jay wrote:
First, we as individual users of the list (either directly or through the digest) control what is in the archives. If we ignore the spam then it takes very little space in the archives and could be edited out if necessary Well, it is possible to edit out individual messages, but it is a tedious and VERY complicated process, and one that the slightest error can (and will) mess up the entire archive indexing scheme. As former list manager, I would not recommend it to Shelly. snip Second, if the archives are of concern (and they should be) then we should all clip our return comments, such as this, to the original e-mail. If we all do these two simple things, then the spam/off-topic problem will become so minor as to be ignorable. So my post here is a plea for a bit of personal restraint and responsibility. Well, over I dunno how many years, I tried to educate members -- and probably got many of them mad at me -- during my tenure as list manager. There are a number of IBCers who appear to be uneducable, many of them, it seems, on RAB where we can do little about it, and virtually ALL the offenders are non-dues- paying users of the list and website. You all know who you are; you've received everything from pleas to threats to get you to snip messages and ignore junk, but you don't do it. Education is LSoft's recommended approach, but it doesn't seem to work very well on the IBC. One of the problems, of course, is that we are continuously getting new members. Another is that "netiquette" (like etiquette in the real world) seems to be one of the more UNimportant things in people's lives these days. Too many folks just don't care how (or if) they offend someone else -- on the internet or on Main Street. For those who have never heard the tern "netiquette," go here -- and OBEY: http://www.albion.com/netiquette/corerules.html Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Ex everything. ************************************************** ****************************** ++++Sponsored, in part, by Gregory Brenden++++ ************************************************** ****************************** -- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ -- +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++ |
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