|
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Carl 1 Lucky Texan" wrote in message . .. Charlie wrote: Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America’s thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. Yeah, growing food for cars MAY be immoral. Makes sense doesn't it. Convert food stocks, grown on arable land easily devoted to a variety of uses, to fuel. Use almost as much energy to make the fuel as the fuel actually yields. Yep, makes sense to me. making bio-diesel from sewerage waste. Will not meet our current fuel usage but can go some way to meeting current demand, uses a waste (shit) to make a fuel and does not lock up arable land (grows on sewerage ponds). Moreover it cleans the water. http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/SC060...TOKEN=67777452 grain production vs consumption http://www.fas.usda.gov/grain/circul...06/graint2.gif rob |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Full article at:
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America’s thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Charlie wrote:
Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America’s thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. Yeah, growing food for cars MAY be immoral. Carl -- to reply, change ( .not) to ( .net) |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Charlie wrote in message
... Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America's thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. And farmer's income and our cars are of primary importance of course. Our mouths and stomachs take second fiddle. Point taken. Question. Where are the bees? Another part of the equation eventually driving us to starvation. Think bigger than just the things mentioned. Who and what and why stands to gain from this? Dave |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article .net,
"Dave" wrote: Charlie wrote in message ... Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America's thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. And farmer's income and our cars are of primary importance of course. Our mouths and stomachs take second fiddle. Point taken. Question. Where are the bees? Another part of the equation eventually driving us to starvation. Think bigger than just the things mentioned. Who and what and why stands to gain from this? Dave Corn is petroleum intensive. See book "Omnivore's Dilemma". - Bill Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly) |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Charlie expounded:
Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America’s thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. Is the US government still paying farmers to *not* grow crops? -- Ann, gardening in Zone 6a South of Boston, Massachusetts e-mail address is not checked ****************************** |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Ann" wrote in message
... Charlie expounded: Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America's thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. Is the US government still paying farmers to *not* grow crops? -- Ann, gardening in Zone 6a South of Boston, Massachusetts e-mail address is not checked ****************************** Yes. Something that escapes lawmakers and the judicial system is that the U.S. paid farmers to grow tobacco in early 60s in the form of a farming subsidy. I won't forget it. Dave |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article 1,
"Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote: Charlie was forced to post this in: rec.gardens http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Excerpt from article: "Almost a quarter of this year’s US corn crop is expected to be turned into fuel. Drought in Australia has added to the food prices spike, which is feeding through to world inflation." I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael Bikes and well designed mass transit would help. Meanwhile anyone know what a window quilt is ? http://www.windowquilt.com/ Bill who has a few about his home but has two cars in the drive way. May go back to one like 1967. -- S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade http://www.ocutech.com/ High tech Vison aid This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article 1,
"Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote: Charlie was forced to post this in: rec.gardens http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Excerpt from article: "Almost a quarter of this year’s US corn crop is expected to be turned into fuel. Drought in Australia has added to the food prices spike, which is feeding through to world inflation." I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael But it still takes "fuel" to feed the horse. G Can't win can we? Wonder what the mpb (mile per bushel) for horses is? I still don't understand why biofuel is being manufactured from food instead of waste! There are tons and tons of weeds and corn STALKS that can be used instead. Wheat straw, millet, milo and sorghum straw (hell any stalks left over from ANY grain crops) as well as the non-edible tops from root crops. All it really takes is digestible cellulose. What am I missing here? A bit of BS perhaps? Speaking of BS, methane can also be compressed and used as a liquid fuel and heaven knows there is enough sh** being produced! -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article
..net, William Wagner wrote: Bikes and well designed mass transit would help. Meanwhile anyone know what a window quilt is ? http://www.windowquilt.com/ Rednecks use aluminum foil... G -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Omelet" wrote in message ... In article 1, "Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote: Charlie was forced to post this in: rec.gardens http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Excerpt from article: "Almost a quarter of this year's US corn crop is expected to be turned into fuel. Drought in Australia has added to the food prices spike, which is feeding through to world inflation." I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael But it still takes "fuel" to feed the horse. G Can't win can we? Wonder what the mpb (mile per bushel) for horses is? I still don't understand why biofuel is being manufactured from food instead of waste! There are tons and tons of weeds and corn STALKS that can be used instead. Wheat straw, millet, milo and sorghum straw (hell any stalks left over from ANY grain crops) as well as the non-edible tops from root crops. I am involved with a client that is breaking in to the biofuel world. They have perfected a process that turns meat-processing sludge (they are working primarily with chicken plant sludge which is basically everything that is left over at the end of the production run) into the appropriate amino acid base for a biofuel blend. This sludge is run through a *cleaning* process which has a yield rate of roughly 80% usable material to garbage and then it is refined which drops the final yield another 10%. The end product is then blended with diesel at varying rates depending on the needs of the final consumer. It's an up and coming industry and they are very secretive about the processes, etc so I don't have any idea what kind of energy use is required to render the final product, but was told that the rendering process does require more work than does Palm or Corn (the 2 most prolific oil bases currently used) , but that overall, their cost per gallon is quite a bit less due the to cost of raw material and transportation vs the other 2. (Most of the Palm oil is shipped in from Africa and there is not as great a density in farms producing corn for fuel as compared to the relatively high density iseen n the poultry processing areas. KW All it really takes is digestible cellulose. What am I missing here? A bit of BS perhaps? Speaking of BS, methane can also be compressed and used as a liquid fuel and heaven knows there is enough sh** being produced! -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
AMEN!!!!
Of course, that would work for me cause we already have the wagon and horses......... "Michael "Dog3" Lonergan" wrote in message I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael -- This is how it works in my house. Click the pic to enlarge it: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=42ko0mf -remove "foodie" to email |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Omelet wrote in
: In article 1, "Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote: Charlie was forced to post this in: rec.gardens http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Excerpt from article: "Almost a quarter of this year’s US corn crop is expected to be turned into fuel. Drought in Australia has added to the food prices spike, which is feeding through to world inflation." I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael But it still takes "fuel" to feed the horse. G You put them on the lawn. (I do that with all three of mine.) What they produce from trimming the lawn gets fed back to the garden in time. Don't think that a good buggy and harness and horse cost any less than a car, though, those days are pretty much gone. And my big boy produces more than his share of methane -- and it's usually when I'm grooming his tail. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Rachael Simpson" wrote in
: AMEN!!!! Of course, that would work for me cause we already have the wagon and horses......... In our town horses are still considered transportation. I kid you not. :) |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article ,
Ann wrote: Charlie expounded: Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America’s thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. Is the US government still paying farmers to *not* grow crops? Charlie, It appears that the "New Deal" for farmers was laid to rest in the 70s after it had been whittled at for a generation. The original deal was where the government would loan the farmer money to hold the crop off the market until prices went higher. If they didn't go higher, the government kept the crop and they called it even. The reasoning being that it was in the nations interest to lay away food for bad time and to support the farmers who grew it. In the 1970s the above got changed to price supports. The government decided what a fair price was and paid the farmer the difference. Thing is as the government determined price has dropped, farmers raise more to cover expenses, causing in turn a lowering if price supports. By now the farmer gets about 4 cents to the dollar for their crop, uh, commodity. The main benefactors of the commodity price collapse for corn is Archer Daniel Midlands and, Cargill. The price collapse realy started in the 50s with the introduction of chemical fertilizers. Previously, farmers had used crop rotation and manure to invigorate their land. Now there is no need for crop rotation, meaning more corn and lower prices. According to Michael Pollard's book,"Omnivore's Delimma" http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/r...1_pollan.shtml it takes a little over 1 petroleum calorie to produce 1 calorie of edible corn (pg. 46, 1st paragraph). There is the possibility of using the entire plant by converting the cellulose back to sugar but I don't know what energy investment that would entail. Funny thing though, before using crop rotation and farm manure, you got 2 food calories out for everyone put in and the environment was a hell of a lot healthier. How you making out with your clay? - Bill Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly) P.S. Jan I wish I had known that this book was continuation from Pollard's previous book, "The Botany of Desire". Damn, this is turning into a serious amount of summer reading. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 09:52:11 -0700, Bill Rose
wrote: Charlie, It appears that the "New Deal" for farmers was laid to rest in the 70s after it had been whittled at for a generation. The original deal was where the government would loan the farmer money to hold the crop off the market until prices went higher. If they didn't go higher, the government kept the crop and they called it even. The reasoning being that it was in the nations interest to lay away food for bad time and to support the farmers who grew it. In the 1970s the above got changed to price supports. The government decided what a fair price was and paid the farmer the difference. Thing is as the government determined price has dropped, farmers raise more to cover expenses, causing in turn a lowering if price supports. By now the farmer gets about 4 cents to the dollar for their crop, uh, commodity. The main benefactors of the commodity price collapse for corn is Archer Daniel Midlands and, Cargill. The price collapse realy started in the 50s with the introduction of chemical fertilizers. Previously, farmers had used crop rotation and manure to invigorate their land. Now there is no need for crop rotation, meaning more corn and lower prices. And until this point, much af what was produced on the farm remained on the farm. I can't recall the percentage of produce that left the farm, but it was fairly low. Nearly every forty or eighty had a farm and family. Most, if not all of the family food was produced and processed on the farm. Stock was taken to a local or regional processing plant and was processed and distributed to local stores. Stores sold local eggs and produce, in season. You see what we have now. People were trying to make a living and life for their families and communities, not trying to become quadrazillionaires. I well remember the taste of real pork and beef, real eggs and real milk. Ever notice how pork and chicken kinda taste the same nowadays? Back in the fifties and sixties, the local farmers also provided good summer jobs for us kids. Before Monsanto, we walked bean fields, cutting out the weeds. We made hay all summer. Now there is little work for our young, even less meaningful work. Gardening can be return to this, a reconnection with the natural world and the natural rhythms of life. To the quietness of nature and mind the working the dirt can bring. According to Michael Pollard's book,"Omnivore's Delimma" http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/r...1_pollan.shtml it takes a little over 1 petroleum calorie to produce 1 calorie of edible corn (pg. 46, 1st paragraph). There is the possibility of using the entire plant by converting the cellulose back to sugar but I don't know what energy investment that would entail. Funny thing though, before using crop rotation and farm manure, you got 2 food calories out for everyone put in and the environment was a hell of a lot healthier. How you making out with your clay? Ha! Always one to make me think, aincha? I am holding off to see some results on my friends pastures and research a bit more. - Bill Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly) Care Brudda Charlie |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 14:51:21 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan"
wrote: I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. After I left the bright lights and tall buildings behind, I spent several years going broke by helping the local farmers and doing other odd work, like cleaning chimneys (like that wasn't hazardous). This was in the area in which I grew up. One older farmer I regularly helped work cattle, still kept a team of Belgians and would always work about ten acres of corn with them along with giving the neighbors sleigh rides in the winter. It was *so* peaceful watching them and hearing only the squeaking of harness and implements. Nothing to drown out the sound of everything else in the vicinity. For sure, it would have been hard work, but I think that was better than today's alternative. And healthier. Care, and thanks for bringing this to mind Charlie |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article ,
"KW" keith_warrennospamatallteldotnet wrote: I am involved with a client that is breaking in to the biofuel world. They have perfected a process that turns meat-processing sludge (they are working primarily with chicken plant sludge which is basically everything that is left over at the end of the production run) into the appropriate amino acid base for a biofuel blend. This sludge is run through a *cleaning* process which has a yield rate of roughly 80% usable material to garbage and then it is refined which drops the final yield another 10%. The end product is then blended with diesel at varying rates depending on the needs of the final consumer. It's an up and coming industry and they are very secretive about the processes, etc so I don't have any idea what kind of energy use is required to render the final product, but was told that the rendering process does require more work than does Palm or Corn (the 2 most prolific oil bases currently used) , but that overall, their cost per gallon is quite a bit less due the to cost of raw material and transportation vs the other 2. (Most of the Palm oil is shipped in from Africa and there is not as great a density in farms producing corn for fuel as compared to the relatively high density iseen n the poultry processing areas. KW Chicken plant sludge? We call that sausage. There is nothing left over. Nothing but the horrid smell of a charnel house. Even the feathers are feed to cows for protein. The way this works is that cattle and chickens are basically corn, because corn is cheap. The corn in turn is based on petroleum (fertilizer, insecticides and fuel for the tractor) that is owned by people who hate us because we are trying to take it away from them (and have been since [1953?], when we sent Kermit Roosevelt (CIA) to Iran to over throw the legally elected government of Dr. Mohammed Mosaddeq and install our ruthless puppet the Shah. [ and people wonder why they don't like us]). I presume that this isn't a pitch and, that you are just trying to pass along information, for which I appreciate the thought, BUT you don't make biodiesel from amino acids. You make protein from amino acids and, fuel from carbohydrates, like sugar or, hydrocarbons, like oil. Your friend might want to get his money back. Bush SAYS he is pushing for fuel cells. - Bill Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly) |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 11:33:58 -0700, Bill Rose
wrote: Chicken plant sludge? We call that sausage. There is nothing left over. Nothing but the horrid smell of a charnel house. Even the feathers are feed to cows for protein. Looks like the price of beef is going to skyrocket, if'ns we feed both the corn and chickenshit/feathers to our cars. Holy shit, horrid doesn't even describe it. I've driven by these places, in southern MO and northern ARK. In our end of the state someone is always fighting with, and usually losing to, the pork producers and the state. Premium Farms has emptied a large part of a neighboring county with the stench and pollution. I shit you not, if you even walk in one of those buildings for a few seconds, the reek is nigh on impossible to remove from your skin and clothing. I don't give a crap what they claim and "verify", they are destroying large areas of the environment, let alone the independent producers, of which there are few left. Money talks and pigshit reeks. There would be a whole lot less fast food eaten if people could drive by and see and smell these places. Tyson? Hormel? Patooie. Your friend might want to get his money back. Bush SAYS he is pushing for fuel cells. *snork* Charlie |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote in
6.121: FragileWarrior was forced to post this in: rec.gardens Omelet wrote in : In article 1, "Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote: Charlie was forced to post this in: rec.gardens http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Excerpt from article: "Almost a quarter of this year’s US corn crop is expected to be turned into fuel. Drought in Australia has added to the food prices spike, which is feeding through to world inflation." I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael But it still takes "fuel" to feed the horse. G You put them on the lawn. (I do that with all three of mine.) What they produce from trimming the lawn gets fed back to the garden in time. Don't think that a good buggy and harness and horse cost any less than a car, though, those days are pretty much gone. And my big boy produces more than his share of methane -- and it's usually when I'm grooming his tail. I just got back from riding Jonsey. He hates the indoor ring but it's just too wet to jump outside. Same old routine. He dances around and plops a few big dollops and then tries to throw me. He is definitely an outside boy. He has yet to emit any methane while I'm gooming him but I'm not about to give him any ideas. Michael D'argo has always saved his best... er... ERUPTIONS...:) for the farriers. He does it to be funny, I swear. It's his own personal commentary on things. And he always has a look on his face like the little boy who farts loudly in church -- totally embarrased but obviously he couldn't control it, Mom. Really, it was just an accident. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 16:32:10 +0000 (UTC), FragileWarrior
wrote: "Rachael Simpson" wrote in : AMEN!!!! Of course, that would work for me cause we already have the wagon and horses......... In our town horses are still considered transportation. I kid you not. :) Must be those of Swiss-German descent? Several groups have come to our area as well. It's like really kinda weird when met, like a step back in time. Drive Carefully Charlie |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Charlie wrote in :
On Wed, 30 May 2007 16:32:10 +0000 (UTC), FragileWarrior wrote: "Rachael Simpson" wrote in : AMEN!!!! Of course, that would work for me cause we already have the wagon and horses......... In our town horses are still considered transportation. I kid you not. :) Must be those of Swiss-German descent? Hell no. These are Indiana born and raised for generations and generations. Several groups have come to our area as well. It's like really kinda weird when met, like a step back in time. Nope. It's just a small town in Indiana. I'm in the heart of town. There's the post office, town hall, our only restaurant and four grain silos. Oh, yeah, and the tornado siren. There are no stop signs/lights on Main Street. I keep my horses in the heart of town and I can ride them right to the door of the post office if I feel like it. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"FragileWarrior" wrote in message ... Charlie wrote in : On Wed, 30 May 2007 16:32:10 +0000 (UTC), FragileWarrior wrote: In our town horses are still considered transportation. I kid you not. :) Must be those of Swiss-German descent? Hell no. These are Indiana born and raised for generations and generations. Several groups have come to our area as well. It's like really kinda weird when met, like a step back in time. Nope. It's just a small town in Indiana. I'm in the heart of town. There's the post office, town hall, our only restaurant and four grain silos. Oh, yeah, and the tornado siren. There are no stop signs/lights on Main Street. I keep my horses in the heart of town and I can ride them right to the door of the post office if I feel like it. Can't take the wagon out much around here - all the big rigs would run over us! Can ride the horses though. My husband has been known to "ride" thru the local Hardee's drive thru. Gets lots of laughs about that. There is a town here in NC called Love Valley. No cars are allowed there - horses & mules only! |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Bill Rose expounded:
In article , Ann wrote: Charlie expounded: Full article at: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Battle for Biofuels Drives World Food Prices Higher America’s thirst for environmentally friendly biofuels is driving up food prices around the world as farmers scramble to devote more land to corn. Is the US government still paying farmers to *not* grow crops? Charlie, Thank you, Bill, but....I am not Charlie :o) (I asked the question, not Charlie) -- Ann, gardening in Zone 6a South of Boston, Massachusetts e-mail address is not checked ****************************** |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article
, Bill Rose wrote: In article , Ann wrote: Charlie expounded: [...] - Bill Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly) P.S. Jan I wish I had known that this book was continuation from Pollard's previous book, "The Botany of Desire". Damn, this is turning into a serious amount of summer reading. Bill: I haven't read the second book yet. The first one is a pretty fast read, but I read fast... The chapter about tulips is fascinating, as well as the reason why Johnny Appleseed planted apples all over the place. To folks who haven't read the book, he was planting apple trees to produce apples to make hard cider. A man after my own heart. Jan -- Bedouin proverb: If you have no troubles, buy a goat. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 23:45:07 +0000 (UTC), FragileWarrior
wrote: Must be those of Swiss-German descent? Hell no. These are Indiana born and raised for generations and generations. Several groups have come to our area as well. It's like really kinda weird when met, like a step back in time. Nope. It's just a small town in Indiana. I'm in the heart of town. There's the post office, town hall, our only restaurant and four grain silos. Oh, yeah, and the tornado siren. There are no stop signs/lights on Main Street. I keep my horses in the heart of town and I can ride them right to the door of the post office if I feel like it. I'll be damned. In Indiana? Nothing like a small town. Sounds like the town I grew up in, sans horses in town. My sons both live about ten miles away, in a town of 250 or so (raised them boys right, we did! They don't care much for the bright lights and fast pace either) The town council went and got uppity, thinking, I guess that they were a suburb of our town of about 10 grand, and passed an ordinance banning any livestock. Elder son has an acre and a half in town and was considering a Jersey and chickens. Screwed now. Charlie, Dodgin' the occasional buggy |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article , Charlie wrote:
On Wed, 30 May 2007 09:52:11 -0700, Bill Rose wrote: [...] Stock was taken to a local or regional processing plant and was processed and distributed to local stores. Stores sold local eggs and produce, in season. You see what we have now. People were trying to make a living and life for their families and communities, not trying to become quadrazillionaires. Some of us are still doing that. There are three gals right here in my little neighborhood who sell our eggs. About 50 dozen eggs a week, between the three of us, and we can't meet our market demand. A couple of gals sell raw milk, but do it very quietly, because it's not legal in this state to sell it. Another neighbor is a truck farmer and a founding mother of our local Farmers Market, which has grown exponentially in 5 years. And all of my Old Believer Russian neighbors grow a huge amount of the food they need for the year. Literally tons of spuds; cabbage; carrots; broccoli; lots of beets (for borscht), etc. (Lots of food crops thrive in our cool Alaskan summers.) They all have greenhouses -- typical size is ~20'x30', although one neighbor just built a new one that's at least 40' long. (I'm very jealous...) Those families average 12 children each. The kids help with the garden, the milk cows, the chickens (meat & egg), the horses, goats and other assorted & sundry animals. The kids also go out commercial fishing with their dads & uncles, and they go hunting in the fall for moose & caribou. The kids grow up with a real understanding of where their food comes from and how to make it all happen. Back in the fifties and sixties, the local farmers also provided good summer jobs for us kids. Before Monsanto, we walked bean fields, cutting out the weeds. We made hay all summer. We can't get "American" kids to work on the ranch, doing haying. The Russian kids are happy for the work. I've never heard a single whimper or whine, bucking square bales. Funny thing though, before using crop rotation and farm manure, you got 2 food calories out for everyone put in and the environment was a hell of a lot healthier. We sell our composted cow manure like crazy this time of year. The organic truck farmers and my Russian neighbors buy it. We started selling the cow poop simply because we're always broke in May. I needed money to pay the light bill & the phone bill. Now we sell I don't know how many tons of it every spring : ) Jan in Alaska Zone 3 and time to plant-out, right after this full moon (we have snow in the forecast for tomorrow night) -- Bedouin proverb: If you have no troubles, buy a goat. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article
, Bill Rose wrote: Bush SAYS he is pushing for fuel cells. - Bill I'll believe that when I see it... I think he's just playing lip service if you know what I mean. -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 20:52:51 -0500, Omelet
wrote: In article , Bill Rose wrote: Bush SAYS he is pushing for fuel cells. - Bill I'll believe that when I see it... I think he's just playing lip service if you know what I mean. Hmmmm.....thought that was the the Arkansawyer that played that. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 15:34:28 -0900, Jan Flora wrote:
In article , Charlie wrote: On Wed, 30 May 2007 09:52:11 -0700, Bill Rose wrote: [...] Stock was taken to a local or regional processing plant and was processed and distributed to local stores. Stores sold local eggs and produce, in season. You see what we have now. People were trying to make a living and life for their families and communities, not trying to become quadrazillionaires. Some of us are still doing that. There are three gals right here in my little neighborhood who sell our eggs. About 50 dozen eggs a week, between the three of us, and we can't meet our market demand. A couple of gals sell raw milk, but do it very quietly, because it's not legal in this state to sell it. Another neighbor is a truck farmer and a founding mother of our local Farmers Market, which has grown exponentially in 5 years. And all of my Old Believer Russian neighbors grow a huge amount of the food they need for the year. Literally tons of spuds; cabbage; carrots; broccoli; lots of beets (for borscht), etc. (Lots of food crops thrive in our cool Alaskan summers.) They all have greenhouses -- typical size is ~20'x30', although one neighbor just built a new one that's at least 40' long. (I'm very jealous...) Those families average 12 children each. The kids help with the garden, the milk cows, the chickens (meat & egg), the horses, goats and other assorted & sundry animals. The kids also go out commercial fishing with their dads & uncles, and they go hunting in the fall for moose & caribou. The kids grow up with a real understanding of where their food comes from and how to make it all happen. Back in the fifties and sixties, the local farmers also provided good summer jobs for us kids. Before Monsanto, we walked bean fields, cutting out the weeds. We made hay all summer. We can't get "American" kids to work on the ranch, doing haying. The Russian kids are happy for the work. I've never heard a single whimper or whine, bucking square bales. Funny thing though, before using crop rotation and farm manure, you got 2 food calories out for everyone put in and the environment was a hell of a lot healthier. We sell our composted cow manure like crazy this time of year. The organic truck farmers and my Russian neighbors buy it. We started selling the cow poop simply because we're always broke in May. I needed money to pay the light bill & the phone bill. Now we sell I don't know how many tons of it every spring : ) Jan in Alaska Zone 3 and time to plant-out, right after this full moon (we have snow in the forecast for tomorrow night) Whoa.....are you alive? Is this post originating from heaven? Hello, is this god speaking? Is this a vision of the afterlife? Seriously now..... Charlie, to whom the angel spoke |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
On Wed, 30 May 2007 14:51:21 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan"
wrote: Charlie was forced to post this in: rec.gardens http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/27/1485/ Excerpt from article: "Almost a quarter of this year’s US corn crop is expected to be turned into fuel. Drought in Australia has added to the food prices spike, which is feeding through to world inflation." I swear to Gawd I'd be much happier if we went back to the horse and buggy days. Michael I could not agree more. I bet those were much easier times to live. Now we have cereal aisles with ten thousand different cereals. When I was a kid there was Kellogs Frosted Flakes, Fruit Loops, Shredded Wheat and Farina! Well, more than that, but certainly not an aisle full of postured, product placement. It's mind boggling. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote in
.121: FragileWarrior was forced to post this in: rec.gardens I just got back from riding Jonsey. He hates the indoor ring but it's just too wet to jump outside. Same old routine. He dances around and plops a few big dollops and then tries to throw me. He is definitely an outside boy. He has yet to emit any methane while I'm gooming him but I'm not about to give him any ideas. Michael D'argo has always saved his best... er... ERUPTIONS...:) for the farriers. He does it to be funny, I swear. It's his own personal commentary on things. And he always has a look on his face like the little boy who farts loudly in church -- totally embarrased but obviously he couldn't control it, Mom. Really, it was just an accident. Jonsey was such a quiet, sweet fellow when I first started riding him. Now he's full of the devil. Seems like right after I made the decision to buy him, the spoiled child routine started. I suppose he somehow senses he has a permanent, good family and wants the spoils he's missed. He never looks embarrased when he does something ungentlemanly like. He looks defiant ;) Somehow I've got to get him to realize he no longer has to race for his oats. Once he settles down he can sail over fences like no other horse I've ever had but if I don't warm him up first I find myself hurtling over fences at what seems like 100mph. Michael I hope you're wearing a helmet, my friend. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article , Charlie wrote:
On Wed, 30 May 2007 20:52:51 -0500, Omelet wrote: In article , Bill Rose wrote: Bush SAYS he is pushing for fuel cells. - Bill I'll believe that when I see it... I think he's just playing lip service if you know what I mean. Hmmmm.....thought that was the the Arkansawyer that played that. Huh????? -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Omelet" wrote in message ... In article , Charlie wrote: On Wed, 30 May 2007 20:52:51 -0500, Omelet wrote: In article , Bill Rose wrote: Bush SAYS he is pushing for fuel cells. - Bill I'll believe that when I see it... I think he's just playing lip service if you know what I mean. Hmmmm.....thought that was the the Arkansawyer that played that. Huh????? -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson Hi Om, I believe charlie was referencing (jokingly) the bill & monica scandel, uh, show! charlie can correct me if i'm wrong though....... Rae |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article ,
"Rachael Simpson" wrote: I'll believe that when I see it... I think he's just playing lip service if you know what I mean. Hmmmm.....thought that was the the Arkansawyer that played that. Huh????? Hi Om, I believe charlie was referencing (jokingly) the bill & monica scandel, uh, show! charlie can correct me if i'm wrong though....... Rae Makes sense now, sorry! ;-) Just color that a "duh" moment for me! lol -- Peace, Om Remove _ to validate e-mails. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
"Michael \"Dog3\" Lonergan" wrote in
6.121: I hope you're wearing a helmet, my friend. Always. And no jewelry either. Michael The first time I popped a helmet I had to return it for a new one and write a story about what had happened so they could study it. I settled for drawing a cartoon of Evil D'argo (complete with tiny, devil, horse-horns) laughing maniacally as he sucked in his gut and spun his saddle -- and me -- off on steep slope. I think I may even have had bounce lines to show my trajectory down the hillside. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
the problem is, all carbon based fuels release CO2 when burned.
what we need is to break the hydrogen oxygen bond in water and then burn the hydrogen back to water. plants do this, they use solar energy to knock the hydrogen off the water, use the energy of the electrons to form a covalent bond (organic) that stores the energy (using CO2). That is really clean energy. Ingrid ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List at http://weloveteaching.com/puregold/ sign up: http://groups.google.com/groups/dir?...s=Group+lookup www.drsolo.com Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I receive no compensation for running the Puregold list or Puregold website. I do not run nor receive any money from the ads at the old Puregold site. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Zone 5 next to Lake Michigan |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
In article ,
FragileWarrior wrote: Charlie wrote in : On Wed, 30 May 2007 16:32:10 +0000 (UTC), FragileWarrior wrote: "Rachael Simpson" wrote in : AMEN!!!! Of course, that would work for me cause we already have the wagon and horses......... In our town horses are still considered transportation. I kid you not. :) Must be those of Swiss-German descent? Hell no. These are Indiana born and raised for generations and generations. Several groups have come to our area as well. It's like really kinda weird when met, like a step back in time. Nope. It's just a small town in Indiana. I'm in the heart of town. There's the post office, town hall, our only restaurant and four grain silos. Oh, yeah, and the tornado siren. There are no stop signs/lights on Main Street. I keep my horses in the heart of town and I can ride them right to the door of the post office if I feel like it. If you run across anyone named "Flora" in Indiana, they're probably kin to me. My g.g. Uncle John Flora founded the town of Flora, Indiana. My family back there is Mennonite. (And Swiss-German.) Grandpa Flora grew up horse farming back there. I come by these tendencies to garden, farm and raise livestock honestly : ) Jan in Alaska -- Bedouin proverb: If you have no troubles, buy a goat. |
Home Gardening Becomes Even More Imperative
Jan Flora wrote in
: In article , FragileWarrior wrote: Charlie wrote in : On Wed, 30 May 2007 16:32:10 +0000 (UTC), FragileWarrior wrote: "Rachael Simpson" wrote in : AMEN!!!! Of course, that would work for me cause we already have the wagon and horses......... In our town horses are still considered transportation. I kid you not. :) Must be those of Swiss-German descent? Hell no. These are Indiana born and raised for generations and generations. Several groups have come to our area as well. It's like really kinda weird when met, like a step back in time. Nope. It's just a small town in Indiana. I'm in the heart of town. There's the post office, town hall, our only restaurant and four grain silos. Oh, yeah, and the tornado siren. There are no stop signs/lights on Main Street. I keep my horses in the heart of town and I can ride them right to the door of the post office if I feel like it. If you run across anyone named "Flora" in Indiana, they're probably kin to me. My g.g. Uncle John Flora founded the town of Flora, Indiana. My family back there is Mennonite. (And Swiss-German.) Cool. I'm not from Indiana and have only been here five year so I'll have to look up where that is. Grandpa Flora grew up horse farming back there. I come by these tendencies to garden, farm and raise livestock honestly : ) Not bad heritage, is it? I'm a farmer at heart but grew up in a city. I keep trying to talk farmers into letting me run their heavy equipment under the guise of "helping them" but, really, I just want to be a farmer driving a big ol' John Deere. |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:07 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
GardenBanter