On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:59:53 -0000, " R M. Watkin"
wrote:

Hi All,
4 star petrol is being taken off the market in the U.K. there is a subsitute
to add to the fuel to cover this problem. do you have this problem in the
U.S.A. if so have you solved it ?. I have all so heard that due the emisions
problem the U.S.A. is about to phase out 2 stroke engines. is this true ?.
and if it is so were does this leave people with 2 stroke engines in good
working order. Mantis tillers e.t.c, thank tou for your help, and I hope
this is not off topic.

Richard M. Watkin.


The only leaded gasoline sold in the US that I am aware of is a type
of aviation fuel called LL100 (LL=low lead). It is formulated for
older aircraft engines that were originally run on leaded gasoline.

There are fewer and fewer 2 stroke engines being sold; as you
suggested because of their emission problems. They are well on their
way to disappearing in boat motors, recreational vehicles motors, lawn
mowers and similar places where simplicity, light weight, and ease of
repair were virtues.

4 stroke engines are inherently more complex. It may be somewhat like
what has happened with automobile engines. We have traded a simple,
easily maintained design that required more maintenance for more
complex designs that are more reliable and just about impossible for
and ordinary human to repair.

I don't even bother with the higher octane now. I never had an engine
get into trouble with the new fuel and I don't know anyone who did.


Some of the high performance engines of the era, the big Ford V8 was one, had
poppet valves that rotated slighly with each movement. Touted as a self
grinding effect. I knew of several of those that went down with Sunoco
Sunlight. Never had any effect on heavy engines like old tractors and Briggs
type engines.

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:59:53 -0000, " R M. Watkin"
wrote:

Hi All,
4 star petrol is being taken off the market in the U.K. there is a subsitute
to add to the fuel to cover this problem. do you have this problem in the
U.S.A. if so have you solved it ?. I have all so heard that due the emisions
problem the U.S.A. is about to phase out 2 stroke engines. is this true ?.
and if it is so were does this leave people with 2 stroke engines in good
working order. Mantis tillers e.t.c, thank tou for your help, and I hope
this is not off topic.

Richard M. Watkin.


The only leaded gasoline sold in the US that I am aware of is a type
of aviation fuel called LL100 (LL=low lead). It is formulated for
older aircraft engines that were originally run on leaded gasoline.

There are fewer and fewer 2 stroke engines being sold; as you
suggested because of their emission problems. They are well on their
way to disappearing in boat motors, recreational vehicles motors, lawn
mowers and similar places where simplicity, light weight, and ease of
repair were virtues.

4 stroke engines are inherently more complex. It may be somewhat like
what has happened with automobile engines. We have traded a simple,
easily maintained design that required more maintenance for more
complex designs that are more reliable and just about impossible for
and ordinary human to repair.

R M. Watkin wrote:

Hi All,

thank you all for your response to my question. it seems to me any one about
to buy a 2 stroke engine, should think very carefully as they may left with
a usless piece of equipment. there are still 2 stroke engines for sale in
U.K. even though government must know they are to be phased out. any one
reading this in the U.K. be warned this govenment will leave you in the
lurch, as they did when you had to scrap your car with the unleaded affair

Richard M.Watkin.

I really don't see it as a problem. We've had unleaded gas (petrol)
here in the US for a loooooooooooooooooong time and I see no end in
sight for 2 strokes. They definately serve a niche market. I also
don't see a problem with oil either. Even if they got rid of "2
stroke" oil, I'd just use regular oil. We used it in a Poulan chainsaw
for quite a while when we were in a remote area cutting and ran out of
2 cycle oil and it ran just fine.

--
Steve

Men are from Earth. Women are from Earth. Deal with it.

"B.Server" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:59:53 -0000, " R M. Watkin"
wrote:

Hi All,
4 star petrol is being taken off the market in the U.K. there is a
subsitute
to add to the fuel to cover this problem. do you have this problem in the
U.S.A. if so have you solved it ?. I have all so heard that due the
emisions
problem the U.S.A. is about to phase out 2 stroke engines. is this true
?.
and if it is so were does this leave people with 2 stroke engines in good
working order. Mantis tillers e.t.c, thank tou for your help, and I hope
this is not off topic.

Richard M. Watkin.


The only leaded gasoline sold in the US that I am aware of is a type
of aviation fuel called LL100 (LL=low lead). It is formulated for
older aircraft engines that were originally run on leaded gasoline.

There are fewer and fewer 2 stroke engines being sold; as you
suggested because of their emission problems. They are well on their
way to disappearing in boat motors, recreational vehicles motors, lawn
mowers and similar places where simplicity, light weight, and ease of
repair were virtues.

4 stroke engines are inherently more complex. It may be somewhat like
what has happened with automobile engines. We have traded a simple,
easily maintained design that required more maintenance for more
complex designs that are more reliable and just about impossible for
and ordinary human to repair.

The biggest reason there are so many 2 stroke engines is the terrific
power to weight advantage over the run of the mill 4 stroke. Imagine the
weight of a weed wacker if it were to have say a Briggs and Stratton engine
on it.
As for the leaded fuel, the advent of sodium filled valves and stellite
valve seats has removed one need for the lead in the fuel. Top end
lubrication (valves and seats) was only a side benefit leaded fuel with the
largest being the CHEAP octane boost it gave fuels. Much of the fuel on the
market today has the same octane rating as did leaded fuels with the
difference being the cost of processing. As with everything in life the is
an associated cost, on one hand is clean air and lead free environment and
on the other higher fuel cost.

Mack

Bob Provencher wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message
t...


As far as 2 stroke engines having valves... well they must. Isn't it the
valves that let in the fuel/air mixture and let the exhaust back out?


Yeah I've heard that one as well. They do have valves, they're just not the
same kind you have in a 4 stroke. They have reed valves which are one way
valves that open on the upstroke as pressure inside the cylinder is reduced.



the clasic (old) 2 stroke design did not have valves.
the new ones though do have valves to get improved performance
at the fuel burning process.
i do not thinnk that a two stroke engine will have any problem to
operate with any oil type as long as it has the right density
so that it will provide the correct lubricant effect.
after the lubrication of the oil the oil is burned with the rest of the
fuel.
i believe that even filtered waste oil from kitchens could be suitable
(as a lubricant) for two stroke engines.
some years i saw an article about a guy who used fried potatoes oil for
his petrol car as fuel (not even as lubricant) with excellent results.
--



--------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Apostolakis
e-mail:
Web Site: http://agriroot.aua.gr/~nickapos
--------------------------------------------------------------

Bob Provencher wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message
t...


As far as 2 stroke engines having valves... well they must. Isn't it the
valves that let in the fuel/air mixture and let the exhaust back out?


Yeah I've heard that one as well. They do have valves, they're just not the
same kind you have in a 4 stroke. They have reed valves which are one way
valves that open on the upstroke as pressure inside the cylinder is reduced.



the clasic (old) 2 stroke design did not have valves.
the new ones though do have valves to get improved performance
at the fuel burning process.
i do not thinnk that a two stroke engine will have any problem to
operate with any oil type as long as it has the right density
so that it will provide the correct lubricant effect.
after the lubrication of the oil the oil is burned with the rest of the
fuel.
i believe that even filtered waste oil from kitchens could be suitable
(as a lubricant) for two stroke engines.
some years i saw an article about a guy who used fried potatoes oil for
his petrol car as fuel (not even as lubricant) with excellent results.
--



--------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Apostolakis
e-mail:
Web Site: http://agriroot.aua.gr/~nickapos
--------------------------------------------------------------

Bob Provencher wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message
t...


As far as 2 stroke engines having valves... well they must. Isn't it the
valves that let in the fuel/air mixture and let the exhaust back out?


Yeah I've heard that one as well. They do have valves, they're just not the
same kind you have in a 4 stroke. They have reed valves which are one way
valves that open on the upstroke as pressure inside the cylinder is reduced.



the clasic (old) 2 stroke design did not have valves.
the new ones though do have valves to get improved performance
at the fuel burning process.
i do not thinnk that a two stroke engine will have any problem to
operate with any oil type as long as it has the right density
so that it will provide the correct lubricant effect.
after the lubrication of the oil the oil is burned with the rest of the
fuel.
i believe that even filtered waste oil from kitchens could be suitable
(as a lubricant) for two stroke engines.
some years i saw an article about a guy who used fried potatoes oil for
his petrol car as fuel (not even as lubricant) with excellent results.
--



--------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Apostolakis
e-mail:
Web Site: http://agriroot.aua.gr/~nickapos
--------------------------------------------------------------