#1   Report Post  
Old 01-03-2004, 11:46 PM
Registered User
 
First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Mar 2004
Posts: 1
Default Grafting Apricots

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the web in the UK?

Will
  #2   Report Post  
Old 02-03-2004, 03:32 AM
Steve
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

I have trouble with pollination of my apricots too. They bloom so
early that the weather often turns cold and the bees don't fly. I
have the added problem of no honey bees in the whole area.

I have grown apricot trees from the seed of my own trees. I have
grafted some of those to better varieties.

Fruit trees are often grafted to control size. They were grafting
fruit trees long before anyone ever thought of dwarfing root stocks
though. It is very hard to get cuttings of most fruit trees to root.
That means if you want a certain variety, grafting is the only way
to go.

I know nothing of root stock suppliers in the UK. Maybe someone else
will offer information.

Steve in the Adirondacks of northern NY, where the apricots should
bloom in about 2 months.



WillA wrote:
Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk


  #3   Report Post  
Old 02-03-2004, 03:32 AM
Steve
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

I have trouble with pollination of my apricots too. They bloom so
early that the weather often turns cold and the bees don't fly. I
have the added problem of no honey bees in the whole area.

I have grown apricot trees from the seed of my own trees. I have
grafted some of those to better varieties.

Fruit trees are often grafted to control size. They were grafting
fruit trees long before anyone ever thought of dwarfing root stocks
though. It is very hard to get cuttings of most fruit trees to root.
That means if you want a certain variety, grafting is the only way
to go.

I know nothing of root stock suppliers in the UK. Maybe someone else
will offer information.

Steve in the Adirondacks of northern NY, where the apricots should
bloom in about 2 months.



WillA wrote:
Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk


  #4   Report Post  
Old 02-03-2004, 03:49 AM
Steve
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

I have trouble with pollination of my apricots too. They bloom so
early that the weather often turns cold and the bees don't fly. I
have the added problem of no honey bees in the whole area.

I have grown apricot trees from the seed of my own trees. I have
grafted some of those to better varieties.

Fruit trees are often grafted to control size. They were grafting
fruit trees long before anyone ever thought of dwarfing root stocks
though. It is very hard to get cuttings of most fruit trees to root.
That means if you want a certain variety, grafting is the only way
to go.

I know nothing of root stock suppliers in the UK. Maybe someone else
will offer information.

Steve in the Adirondacks of northern NY, where the apricots should
bloom in about 2 months.



WillA wrote:
Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk


  #5   Report Post  
Old 02-03-2004, 11:57 AM
Sherwin Dubren
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from. If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk



  #6   Report Post  
Old 02-03-2004, 12:28 PM
Sherwin Dubren
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from. If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk

  #7   Report Post  
Old 02-03-2004, 02:23 PM
Janice
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 08:13:47 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from.


Also, some are "sports" which are variations that occur on a tree
where one branch is somehow different from all the rest of the tree
and in those cases the only way of propagating it is by grafting.

But overall, one of the main reasons beyond the keeping the genetics
the same is that it's just faster to produce new trees of size by bud
grafting, Taking an older rootstock plant that's growing well, and
grafting the bud of another tree onto the trunk of the rootstock
plant, and then waiting for the bud to "take" and show its viability
by growing is faster than growing a whole new tree from a seed. Once
the bud grows out enough they top of the host rootstock plant is cut
off just above the point where the bud was grafted on, and the growth
from that bud becomes the whole tree. Any growth below the bud graft
is cut off. The graft point is kept high enough that the grafted part
of the plant is discouraged from developing its own root system,
particularly in graftings that are to control the size of the
resulting plant.

I had an elberta tree that became so sun scalded I was sure it would
just die, so I had it cut down. I regret that now because of a
seedling peach tree that came up from a fallen peach from the original
tree. I'm 99.999% sure that it was self pollinated as there were no
other peach trees anywhere close by then, or now. The resulting tree
grew tortured because I was not actively gardening due to bad knees,
and back, otherwise I would have dug it out. But since I didn't dig
it out, it grew without much additional water and became badly sun
scalded, so much so that the tree bent near horizontal for a couple
feet then continued growing upward. The tree managed to heal itself
amazingly enough and has been producing peaches every year. The
peaches are ok, but nowhere near as good as the original tree even
though it was self pollinated most likely, it's still different enough
to not be the desired way of reproducing something consistently. It
lacks the characteristic bitterness toward the pit of the parent, as
well as not being quite as sweet as the parent. It's better than
store bought, just nowhere as good as it's mama. ;-)

Janice

If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk


  #8   Report Post  
Old 03-03-2004, 06:19 AM
Sherwin Dubren
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

Just to add a bit to what Janice said,
The bud graft only works around August. If you want to do a graft in
the
Spring time, you want to do something like a 'Whip-and-Tongue'. I try
to make
my new trees in the Spring. One advantage of the Whip-and-Tongue is
that you
start with a piece of scion that can have two or tree buds on it. This
gives
you a better chance of success than a single bud graft. I like to use
bud
grafting to add varieties to an existing tree to produce multiple fruit
types
on a single tree. I would not downplay the genetics part of grafting.
It could
be quite disappointing to grow a tree from seed, only to find out years
later
that the resulting fruit is far from what you expected (usually a lot
worse).
Sports do occur, but they are not as common as you make them out to be.
Also,
not all sports are an improvement on the original fruit.

Also, I am going to give Will some sources here in the USA for the
St.Julian A
rootstock. He can possibly get them shipped by air to his location. I
cannot
necessarily recommend these places, but they are listed in the Fruit,
Nut, and
Berry Inventory Book as having the St. Julian A rootstock.

Bay Laurel Nursery - www.BayLaurelNursery.com, email:


NRSP5/IR-2 Virus-Test Fruit Tree Collection - email:

www.nrsp5.wsu.edu

One Green World - www.onegreenworld.com

Let me know if you still have problems.

Sherwin Dubren



Janice wrote:

On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 08:13:47 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from.


Also, some are "sports" which are variations that occur on a tree
where one branch is somehow different from all the rest of the tree
and in those cases the only way of propagating it is by grafting.

But overall, one of the main reasons beyond the keeping the genetics
the same is that it's just faster to produce new trees of size by bud
grafting, Taking an older rootstock plant that's growing well, and
grafting the bud of another tree onto the trunk of the rootstock
plant, and then waiting for the bud to "take" and show its viability
by growing is faster than growing a whole new tree from a seed. Once
the bud grows out enough they top of the host rootstock plant is cut
off just above the point where the bud was grafted on, and the growth
from that bud becomes the whole tree. Any growth below the bud graft
is cut off. The graft point is kept high enough that the grafted part
of the plant is discouraged from developing its own root system,
particularly in graftings that are to control the size of the
resulting plant.

I had an elberta tree that became so sun scalded I was sure it would
just die, so I had it cut down. I regret that now because of a
seedling peach tree that came up from a fallen peach from the original
tree. I'm 99.999% sure that it was self pollinated as there were no
other peach trees anywhere close by then, or now. The resulting tree
grew tortured because I was not actively gardening due to bad knees,
and back, otherwise I would have dug it out. But since I didn't dig
it out, it grew without much additional water and became badly sun
scalded, so much so that the tree bent near horizontal for a couple
feet then continued growing upward. The tree managed to heal itself
amazingly enough and has been producing peaches every year. The
peaches are ok, but nowhere near as good as the original tree even
though it was self pollinated most likely, it's still different enough
to not be the desired way of reproducing something consistently. It
lacks the characteristic bitterness toward the pit of the parent, as
well as not being quite as sweet as the parent. It's better than
store bought, just nowhere as good as it's mama. ;-)

Janice

If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk

  #9   Report Post  
Old 03-03-2004, 09:51 AM
Janice
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 06:07:07 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Just to add a bit to what Janice said,
The bud graft only works around August. If you want to do a graft in
the
Spring time, you want to do something like a 'Whip-and-Tongue'. I try
to make
my new trees in the Spring. One advantage of the Whip-and-Tongue is
that you
start with a piece of scion that can have two or tree buds on it. This
gives
you a better chance of success than a single bud graft. I like to use
bud
grafting to add varieties to an existing tree to produce multiple fruit
types
on a single tree. I would not downplay the genetics part of grafting.
It could
be quite disappointing to grow a tree from seed, only to find out years
later
that the resulting fruit is far from what you expected (usually a lot
worse).
Sports do occur, but they are not as common as you make them out to be.


Didn't know I made them out to be any particular degree of occurrence,
just that they do occur, Red Bartlett pears I think was one. Didn't
mean just in fruit trees that sports occur.. in fruit trees.. not that
often, but they occur in ornamentals, and trees. Saw a program where
they went out and looked for conifers that had naturally occurring
sports or anomalies, where a branch suddenly forms dwarf forms, when
they are then collected and used to make more dwarf conifers for sale
in nurseries. Then there are others where a variegated branch shows
up on a plant and it's nabbed and propagated by whatever means works
to provide a new variety. Was the new yellow green kind of sickly
looking bleeding heart a sport or a bred true from seed plant? I
can't remember what the bit I saw about it said.

Anyway, you by far know more about grafting than I do. I only have
picked up a bit by reading stuff here and there over the years, and
I've forgotten more than I know now. I just didn't want you to think
I was implying there were all sorts of sports in fruits alone. I was
meaning sports are taken advantage of wherever and whenever they occur
and are appealing to someone.

Janice

Also,
not all sports are an improvement on the original fruit.

Also, I am going to give Will some sources here in the USA for the
St.Julian A
rootstock. He can possibly get them shipped by air to his location. I
cannot
necessarily recommend these places, but they are listed in the Fruit,
Nut, and
Berry Inventory Book as having the St. Julian A rootstock.

Bay Laurel Nursery - www.BayLaurelNursery.com, email:


NRSP5/IR-2 Virus-Test Fruit Tree Collection - email:

www.nrsp5.wsu.edu

One Green World - www.onegreenworld.com

Let me know if you still have problems.

Sherwin Dubren



Janice wrote:

On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 08:13:47 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from.


Also, some are "sports" which are variations that occur on a tree
where one branch is somehow different from all the rest of the tree
and in those cases the only way of propagating it is by grafting.

But overall, one of the main reasons beyond the keeping the genetics
the same is that it's just faster to produce new trees of size by bud
grafting, Taking an older rootstock plant that's growing well, and
grafting the bud of another tree onto the trunk of the rootstock
plant, and then waiting for the bud to "take" and show its viability
by growing is faster than growing a whole new tree from a seed. Once
the bud grows out enough they top of the host rootstock plant is cut
off just above the point where the bud was grafted on, and the growth
from that bud becomes the whole tree. Any growth below the bud graft
is cut off. The graft point is kept high enough that the grafted part
of the plant is discouraged from developing its own root system,
particularly in graftings that are to control the size of the
resulting plant.

I had an elberta tree that became so sun scalded I was sure it would
just die, so I had it cut down. I regret that now because of a
seedling peach tree that came up from a fallen peach from the original
tree. I'm 99.999% sure that it was self pollinated as there were no
other peach trees anywhere close by then, or now. The resulting tree
grew tortured because I was not actively gardening due to bad knees,
and back, otherwise I would have dug it out. But since I didn't dig
it out, it grew without much additional water and became badly sun
scalded, so much so that the tree bent near horizontal for a couple
feet then continued growing upward. The tree managed to heal itself
amazingly enough and has been producing peaches every year. The
peaches are ok, but nowhere near as good as the original tree even
though it was self pollinated most likely, it's still different enough
to not be the desired way of reproducing something consistently. It
lacks the characteristic bitterness toward the pit of the parent, as
well as not being quite as sweet as the parent. It's better than
store bought, just nowhere as good as it's mama. ;-)

Janice

If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk


  #10   Report Post  
Old 03-03-2004, 10:02 AM
Janice
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 06:07:07 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Just to add a bit to what Janice said,
The bud graft only works around August. If you want to do a graft in
the
Spring time, you want to do something like a 'Whip-and-Tongue'. I try
to make
my new trees in the Spring. One advantage of the Whip-and-Tongue is
that you
start with a piece of scion that can have two or tree buds on it. This
gives
you a better chance of success than a single bud graft. I like to use
bud
grafting to add varieties to an existing tree to produce multiple fruit
types
on a single tree. I would not downplay the genetics part of grafting.
It could
be quite disappointing to grow a tree from seed, only to find out years
later
that the resulting fruit is far from what you expected (usually a lot
worse).
Sports do occur, but they are not as common as you make them out to be.


Didn't know I made them out to be any particular degree of occurrence,
just that they do occur, Red Bartlett pears I think was one. Didn't
mean just in fruit trees that sports occur.. in fruit trees.. not that
often, but they occur in ornamentals, and trees. Saw a program where
they went out and looked for conifers that had naturally occurring
sports or anomalies, where a branch suddenly forms dwarf forms, when
they are then collected and used to make more dwarf conifers for sale
in nurseries. Then there are others where a variegated branch shows
up on a plant and it's nabbed and propagated by whatever means works
to provide a new variety. Was the new yellow green kind of sickly
looking bleeding heart a sport or a bred true from seed plant? I
can't remember what the bit I saw about it said.

Anyway, you by far know more about grafting than I do. I only have
picked up a bit by reading stuff here and there over the years, and
I've forgotten more than I know now. I just didn't want you to think
I was implying there were all sorts of sports in fruits alone. I was
meaning sports are taken advantage of wherever and whenever they occur
and are appealing to someone.

Janice

Also,
not all sports are an improvement on the original fruit.

Also, I am going to give Will some sources here in the USA for the
St.Julian A
rootstock. He can possibly get them shipped by air to his location. I
cannot
necessarily recommend these places, but they are listed in the Fruit,
Nut, and
Berry Inventory Book as having the St. Julian A rootstock.

Bay Laurel Nursery - www.BayLaurelNursery.com, email:


NRSP5/IR-2 Virus-Test Fruit Tree Collection - email:

www.nrsp5.wsu.edu

One Green World - www.onegreenworld.com

Let me know if you still have problems.

Sherwin Dubren



Janice wrote:

On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 08:13:47 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from.


Also, some are "sports" which are variations that occur on a tree
where one branch is somehow different from all the rest of the tree
and in those cases the only way of propagating it is by grafting.

But overall, one of the main reasons beyond the keeping the genetics
the same is that it's just faster to produce new trees of size by bud
grafting, Taking an older rootstock plant that's growing well, and
grafting the bud of another tree onto the trunk of the rootstock
plant, and then waiting for the bud to "take" and show its viability
by growing is faster than growing a whole new tree from a seed. Once
the bud grows out enough they top of the host rootstock plant is cut
off just above the point where the bud was grafted on, and the growth
from that bud becomes the whole tree. Any growth below the bud graft
is cut off. The graft point is kept high enough that the grafted part
of the plant is discouraged from developing its own root system,
particularly in graftings that are to control the size of the
resulting plant.

I had an elberta tree that became so sun scalded I was sure it would
just die, so I had it cut down. I regret that now because of a
seedling peach tree that came up from a fallen peach from the original
tree. I'm 99.999% sure that it was self pollinated as there were no
other peach trees anywhere close by then, or now. The resulting tree
grew tortured because I was not actively gardening due to bad knees,
and back, otherwise I would have dug it out. But since I didn't dig
it out, it grew without much additional water and became badly sun
scalded, so much so that the tree bent near horizontal for a couple
feet then continued growing upward. The tree managed to heal itself
amazingly enough and has been producing peaches every year. The
peaches are ok, but nowhere near as good as the original tree even
though it was self pollinated most likely, it's still different enough
to not be the desired way of reproducing something consistently. It
lacks the characteristic bitterness toward the pit of the parent, as
well as not being quite as sweet as the parent. It's better than
store bought, just nowhere as good as it's mama. ;-)

Janice

If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk




  #11   Report Post  
Old 03-03-2004, 10:12 AM
Janice
 
Posts: n/a
Default Grafting Apricots

On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 06:07:07 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Just to add a bit to what Janice said,
The bud graft only works around August. If you want to do a graft in
the
Spring time, you want to do something like a 'Whip-and-Tongue'. I try
to make
my new trees in the Spring. One advantage of the Whip-and-Tongue is
that you
start with a piece of scion that can have two or tree buds on it. This
gives
you a better chance of success than a single bud graft. I like to use
bud
grafting to add varieties to an existing tree to produce multiple fruit
types
on a single tree. I would not downplay the genetics part of grafting.
It could
be quite disappointing to grow a tree from seed, only to find out years
later
that the resulting fruit is far from what you expected (usually a lot
worse).
Sports do occur, but they are not as common as you make them out to be.


Didn't know I made them out to be any particular degree of occurrence,
just that they do occur, Red Bartlett pears I think was one. Didn't
mean just in fruit trees that sports occur.. in fruit trees.. not that
often, but they occur in ornamentals, and trees. Saw a program where
they went out and looked for conifers that had naturally occurring
sports or anomalies, where a branch suddenly forms dwarf forms, when
they are then collected and used to make more dwarf conifers for sale
in nurseries. Then there are others where a variegated branch shows
up on a plant and it's nabbed and propagated by whatever means works
to provide a new variety. Was the new yellow green kind of sickly
looking bleeding heart a sport or a bred true from seed plant? I
can't remember what the bit I saw about it said.

Anyway, you by far know more about grafting than I do. I only have
picked up a bit by reading stuff here and there over the years, and
I've forgotten more than I know now. I just didn't want you to think
I was implying there were all sorts of sports in fruits alone. I was
meaning sports are taken advantage of wherever and whenever they occur
and are appealing to someone.

Janice

Also,
not all sports are an improvement on the original fruit.

Also, I am going to give Will some sources here in the USA for the
St.Julian A
rootstock. He can possibly get them shipped by air to his location. I
cannot
necessarily recommend these places, but they are listed in the Fruit,
Nut, and
Berry Inventory Book as having the St. Julian A rootstock.

Bay Laurel Nursery - www.BayLaurelNursery.com, email:


NRSP5/IR-2 Virus-Test Fruit Tree Collection - email:

www.nrsp5.wsu.edu

One Green World - www.onegreenworld.com

Let me know if you still have problems.

Sherwin Dubren



Janice wrote:

On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 08:13:47 GMT, Sherwin Dubren
wrote:

Hi Will,
I also have a Moorpark Apricot here in a suburb of Chicago. It is on
dwarf rootstock. In the past 5 seasons of growth, I have had two good
crops,
including last years and three years ago. I also do hand pollination,
although
last year I think I over did it.
The reason for grafting is to preserve the genetic character of the
original tree.
Planting a seed mixes the genetics of the original tree with those of
the tree from
which the pollen came from.


Also, some are "sports" which are variations that occur on a tree
where one branch is somehow different from all the rest of the tree
and in those cases the only way of propagating it is by grafting.

But overall, one of the main reasons beyond the keeping the genetics
the same is that it's just faster to produce new trees of size by bud
grafting, Taking an older rootstock plant that's growing well, and
grafting the bud of another tree onto the trunk of the rootstock
plant, and then waiting for the bud to "take" and show its viability
by growing is faster than growing a whole new tree from a seed. Once
the bud grows out enough they top of the host rootstock plant is cut
off just above the point where the bud was grafted on, and the growth
from that bud becomes the whole tree. Any growth below the bud graft
is cut off. The graft point is kept high enough that the grafted part
of the plant is discouraged from developing its own root system,
particularly in graftings that are to control the size of the
resulting plant.

I had an elberta tree that became so sun scalded I was sure it would
just die, so I had it cut down. I regret that now because of a
seedling peach tree that came up from a fallen peach from the original
tree. I'm 99.999% sure that it was self pollinated as there were no
other peach trees anywhere close by then, or now. The resulting tree
grew tortured because I was not actively gardening due to bad knees,
and back, otherwise I would have dug it out. But since I didn't dig
it out, it grew without much additional water and became badly sun
scalded, so much so that the tree bent near horizontal for a couple
feet then continued growing upward. The tree managed to heal itself
amazingly enough and has been producing peaches every year. The
peaches are ok, but nowhere near as good as the original tree even
though it was self pollinated most likely, it's still different enough
to not be the desired way of reproducing something consistently. It
lacks the characteristic bitterness toward the pit of the parent, as
well as not being quite as sweet as the parent. It's better than
store bought, just nowhere as good as it's mama. ;-)

Janice

If you can control this pollination by hand
pollinating
or being sure that no other tree of another variety is supplying pollen,
than the seed
will probably bear true to the original tree. Self pollinating trees
like your Apricot
have a greater chance of growing the original tree from seed. Size of
the tree is controlled
by the rootstock upon which you graft your scion wood. I don't know
about St. Julien rootstock
in the UK. We have a Fruit, Nut, and Berry Inventory Book, here in the
States. Perhaps there
is a similar book in the UK, which should list all available rootstocks.

Sherwin Dubren


WillA wrote:

Hi,

I have an Apriocot tree(Morrpark) it is currently flowering so I am
trying to pollinate it using camel hair brush etc.... where are the
insects when you need them?

I am rather hoping fruit will be produced. If they are I would like to
try and propegate grow from seed to tree. It may seem a bit premature
but I would like to try grafting and have a few of questiions

Why are fruit trees often grafted, is it to control size?

Why does there seem to be no suppliers of St Julien A rootstock on the
web in the UK?

Will
--
WillA
------------------------------------------------------------------------
posted via www.GardenBanter.co.uk


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