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#16
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
"LeighMo" wrote in message ... I wish you would consider setting up a larger tank now. If she succeeds in keeping those goldfish alive in a tank that small for long, she'll be doing better than many grown-up goldfish experts. Sigh, you're right, of course...suggestion noted for careful consideration billy |
#18
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Yes. Aragonite is for sal****er tanks. Washing won't help, because it's the sand itself that dissolves, making the water alkaline. Use silica sand instead. Or us african Cichlid keepers.... I use crushed coral and silica in my planted tank..its great..I think the coral dissolving helps add trace elements for the plants... Rich |
#19
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
10 gallon tanks arent too bad to light though...because theyre so shallow... 11"
deep, minus 2 inches of gravel....30 watts of fluoro does me fine. "S. Oung" wrote: LeighMo wrote: Can it be possible to have a planted tank which is 10gals or less(2.5gal)? Yes, it's possible, but it's difficult. See Amano's second book. It features small planted aquariums, many under a gallon! But it's a lot of work. You have to choose plants and fish very carefully. You may also find that you need a lot more light per gallon than you would in a larger tank. [snip] Leigh Tell me more, I'm interested: why do smaller tanks need more light/gallon? Because crowded plants shade each other more? remove "deathtospam." to deactivate spam trap |
#20
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
I use crushed coral and silica in my planted tank..its great..I think the
coral dissolving helps add trace elements for the plants... Using some aragonite can be helpful if you have very soft water, or want to keep Rift Lake cichlids. But most people find using 100% coral sand or aragonite in a freshwater tank does crazy things to the pH. Especially in a small tank. I really don't recommend it for beginners. Leigh http://www.fortunecity.com/lavender/halloween/881/ |
#21
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
"WD" wrote in message
news:Zddva.559631$Zo.120780@sccrnsc03... I have a couple larger tanks in the garage that could be set up in a matter of hours. If she keeps them alive long enough for them to outgrow the five, I'll get her a big'un I feel just awful for your car, forced to live out in the driveway while your unused tanks take up space in your garage. If you're in the Toronto area, let me do your car a favour, and take those tanks for you, so they're out of the garage. You don't even have to say "thank you" when I'm done... Cheers; Duncan |
#22
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
It sure is possible. Easier than larger tanks too! IMO. You can see
on my web site i-aquaria.com I have two small tanks setup as planted aquaria. One is an Eclipse 3 and the other is a 10 gallon. Both grow plants very well and both are low light tanks. But I also maintain numerous old glodfish bowls with tons of plants in them and they get nothing but sunlight.... The trick is patience.... You have to experiment and be patient. You will not have an Amano looking tank first time out (If you do you're very lucky). I used sand in my Eclipse and a Flourite/gravel mix in my ten.... So experiment and see what works best for you. Regards, Ed @ i-aquaria dot com On Sat, 10 May 2003 03:42:38 GMT, JuanMa wrote: Greetings. Can it be possible to have a planted tank which is 10gals or less(2.5gal)? What kind of lighting and chemicals should I use to keep the plants healthy and thriving? Can aragonite sand be used in such a tank(how much)? What can I use to keep the plants in their place? What about compatible fish for the planted tank? The 2.5gal tank I haven't bought it yet. I have a 10gal, but no lighting yet. What kind of light should I use if I go with the 2.5gal? Can one of those daylight fluorescent bulbs fit in the 2.5gal hood? Would it produce enough light for the plants, or should I go DIY PC? If I don't find any ideal type of sand, what could be the alternatives? What plants do you recommend that I should start with? I was thinking for livestock if I go with the 2.5gal. some fancy guppies or neon tetras or two angels. If I go with the 10gal. the livestock will be a little more varied, but not too much. I was told that aragonite sand can make the water too alkaline? will it make it so, even if I wash the sand? TIA |
#23
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
I tend to find that it balaces my tank out at about 8 pH...theres no maintenance
of it..its rock solid...you dont have to worry about it fluctuating. LeighMo wrote: I use crushed coral and silica in my planted tank..its great..I think the coral dissolving helps add trace elements for the plants... Using some aragonite can be helpful if you have very soft water, or want to keep Rift Lake cichlids. But most people find using 100% coral sand or aragonite in a freshwater tank does crazy things to the pH. Especially in a small tank. I really don't recommend it for beginners. Leigh http://www.fortunecity.com/lavender/halloween/881/ |
#24
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Hello! I've found a lot of things people say about smaller tanks being 'difficult' a myth. I have two six gallon planted tanks. Nano and microtanks are fun. www.aquabotanic.com has a Wet Thumbs micro tank planted bulletin board you may be interested in. There are several 2.5 planted tanks. Can it be possible to have a planted tank which is 10gals or less(2.5gal)? Of course! IMO, I have found them to be rewarding and not all that hard. I've traded my large tanks for small ones over the years. Here is one of mine: http://www.psych.upenn.edu/~sherrym/fish.html What kind of lighting and chemicals should I use to keep the plants healthy and thriving? It all depends on the kind of plants and your water conditions. Do you want high light or a low light tank? Study up and see what plants interest you. Smaller tanks usually need less light per gallon usually because they are more shallow. What about compatible fish for the planted tank? Most killifish are excellent. I would avoid livebearers due to sudden population increases. I've used lemon tetras, mini cories and cherry barbs with great success. Angels would not work. You can also just have some amano or glass shrimp. If I don't find any ideal type of sand, what could be the alternatives? I use pure Flourite. What plants do you recommend that I should start with? Depends on how much light you can get. Hard to kills like crypts, anubias, java ferns and inexpensive stem plants like hygro and coonstail. Start with a LOT of plants to out compete algae. The only problem will be selecting small plants, but it can be done! |
#25
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Yes, it's possible, but it's difficult. See Amano's second book. It features small planted aquariums, many under a gallon! Why is it difficult? Mine are easy. But it's a lot of work. You have to choose plants and fish very carefully. You also need to do so in a large tank. You may also find that you need a lot more light per gallon than you would in a larger tank. I'm sorry, I don't agree. Unless you have a very tall 2.5 gallon tank, you need less light in shallow aquaria. I grow low light plants and medium light stem plants with 8 watts to 6 gallons. Your choices will be very limited with such a small tank. Amano uses rasboras and neon tetras in his smallest tanks. Amano shrimp and otocinclus for algae control. But I'd be really hesitant to keep fish in such a small tank. A pair of killies would be great in a 2.5 gallon as well as a few of the above fish mentioned. And if you are new, I really, really recommend you go with the 10 gallon tank. The larger the tank, the easier it is to maintain. A small tank is very unforgiving of mistakes. I have found that mini tanks are just as 'forgiving' as my old 75 and 45 gallon tanks. I also do fun things to mess with my water chemistry with peated DI water, etc. Many people inject c02 in 2.5 gallons! I simply have not seen any proof that smaller tanks that are maintained well and with intelligence are any harder then a big tank. Frankly I find them less demanding. |
#26
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Why is it difficult? Mine are easy.
Small tanks are much less forgiving. Anything that changes, changes a lot faster. Evaporation alone can be PITA with a small tank. But it's a lot of work. You have to choose plants and fish very carefully. You also need to do so in a large tank. Not *as* carefully. Many common plants and fish simply won't fit in a tiny tank. You have a lot more freedom with a larger tank. He wants to keep angelfish. That is not going to work with a 2.5 gallon tank. I'm sorry, I don't agree. Unless you have a very tall 2.5 gallon tank, you need less light in shallow aquaria. I grow low light plants and medium light stem plants with 8 watts to 6 gallons. You have over a watt per gallon. That's plenty for low-light plants, especially given the short height of a small tank. Where the higher lighting requirements come in are for high-tech, high-light, Amano-style tanks. Which is what he seemed to want. (He said he wanted to be able to grow anything he wanted.) I have found that mini tanks are just as 'forgiving' as my old 75 and 45 gallon tanks. I have not found that to be the case. I kept a 5 gallon tank for awhile, but eventually gave it away. It was just too much work. Many people inject c02 in 2.5 gallons! I didn't say otherwise. However, it's more difficult to keep the pH stable in a small tank. I simply have not seen any proof that smaller tanks that are maintained well and with intelligence are any harder then a big tank. The key words being "well and with intelligence." All I said was that I don't recommend them for a beginner. You sound as if you're quite experienced with tanks of all sizes. But this person is a beginner. Remember what it's like to be a beginner? You buy fish and plants and chemicals you see at the pet store, just because they look cool, and put them all in your tank. You do water changes religiously for the first month or two, then might go months without doing one. You buy more fish than the tank can reasonably support, just because you have to have them. Etc. The larger a tank is, the more forgiving it is of beginner mistakes, simply because it's a larger reservoir. Water quality can't change as fast in a large reservoir as in a small one, and so larger tanks will "absorb" mistakes that would overwhelm a small tank. I've seen many small tanks that are just gorgoeus. Even reef tanks. But for beginners, the conventional wisdom is to get as large a tank as you have room for and can afford, and IME, it's very good advice. Leigh http://www.fortunecity.com/lavender/halloween/881/ |
#27
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Yesterday I visited Ocean Aquarium in San Francisco again. Among the 50-70
planted tanks there (every tank in the store is planted!) are about 10 under 10 gallons. About 5 are the tiny 1-2 gallon glass types. He plants them with appropriate scale plants, just a tad of lighting, and small fish like Endlers livebearers. Spectacular! |
#28
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Actually, I have seen planted tank with a lot of angels, but for my
personal experience, I had difficulty keeping them together with other tank mates. My oto likes to harass them by clinging on to their scales... My experience with serpae tetra is not too good either. They tend to intomidate the neons and cardinals in my tank. I would go for cardinals, neons, yamato shrimps, SAE and badis badis. They are excellent tankmates. cheers Sherry Michael Weller wrote in message .. . Hello! I've found a lot of things people say about smaller tanks being 'difficult' a myth. I have two six gallon planted tanks. Nano and microtanks are fun. www.aquabotanic.com has a Wet Thumbs micro tank planted bulletin board you may be interested in. There are several 2.5 planted tanks. Can it be possible to have a planted tank which is 10gals or less(2.5gal)? Of course! IMO, I have found them to be rewarding and not all that hard. I've traded my large tanks for small ones over the years. Here is one of mine: http://www.psych.upenn.edu/~sherrym/fish.html What kind of lighting and chemicals should I use to keep the plants healthy and thriving? It all depends on the kind of plants and your water conditions. Do you want high light or a low light tank? Study up and see what plants interest you. Smaller tanks usually need less light per gallon usually because they are more shallow. What about compatible fish for the planted tank? Most killifish are excellent. I would avoid livebearers due to sudden population increases. I've used lemon tetras, mini cories and cherry barbs with great success. Angels would not work. You can also just have some amano or glass shrimp. If I don't find any ideal type of sand, what could be the alternatives? I use pure Flourite. What plants do you recommend that I should start with? Depends on how much light you can get. Hard to kills like crypts, anubias, java ferns and inexpensive stem plants like hygro and coonstail. Start with a LOT of plants to out compete algae. The only problem will be selecting small plants, but it can be done! |
#29
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Why is it difficult? Mine are easy. Small tanks are much less forgiving. Anything that changes, changes a lot faster. Evaporation alone can be PITA with a small tank. Like I said, I've always heard this, but have never found it true in practice. I maintain my small tanks on the same schedule as my old large tanks. But it's a lot of work. You have to choose plants and fish very carefully. You also need to do so in a large tank. Not *as* carefully. Many common plants and fish simply won't fit in a tiny tank. You have a lot more freedom with a larger tank. He wants to keep angelfish. That is not going to work with a 2.5 gallon tank. Well sure, and I told him that was a bad idea. But I see just as many people trying to put an oscar or a goldfish in a 20 gallon too. It's all the same problem if the the tank is 55 gallons or 5- education. You have over a watt per gallon. That's plenty for low-light plants, especially given the short height of a small tank. Where the higher lighting requirements come in are for high-tech, high-light, Amano-style tanks. Which is what he seemed to want. (He said he wanted to be able to grow anything he wanted.) I've never heard that said before, and I can't even fathom the logic in that. If I have a 20 gallon tank that has 3 wpg, I should not need more light in a 5 gallon tank to grow the same plants. especially since it's likely the tank is deeper in the larger tank. Can you explain this one more to me? I have not found that to be the case. I kept a 5 gallon tank for awhile, but eventually gave it away. It was just too much work. Just curious, what kind of setup did you have? I didn't say otherwise. However, it's more difficult to keep the pH stable in a small tank. I never had that problem either. Hopefully if your injecting co2 you know about the KH and ph formula. The same rules apply, and hopefully you are monitoring and going slow at first. I fiddle with my ph with a lower KH then most people advise and I don't get fluxes in 24 hours over ..2. Oddly enough, the exact same rate of change I got in my 45 gallon tank. You sound as if you're quite experienced with tanks of all sizes. But this person is a beginner. Remember what it's like to be a beginner? You buy fish and plants and chemicals you see at the pet store, just because they look cool, and put them all in your tank. You do water changes religiously for the first month or two, then might go months without doing one. You buy more fish than the tank can reasonably support, just because you have to have them. Etc. The larger a tank is, the more forgiving it is of beginner mistakes, simply because it's a larger reservoir. Water quality can't change as fast in a large reservoir as in a small one, and so larger tanks will "absorb" mistakes that would overwhelm a small tank. True enough, but he asked if it was possible. He's here asking questions before he buys, so kudos already. My opinion of what he can do has increased tenfold then your average newbie. I also don't see a ten gallon tank absorbing very many beginners mistakes. If he was debating between a 60 and a 2.5 gallon, I'd understand that. |
#30
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10gal. or smaller planted tank?
Small tanks are much less forgiving. Anything that changes, changes a lot
faster. Evaporation alone can be PITA with a small tank. Like I said, I've always heard this, but have never found it true in practice. I maintain my small tanks on the same schedule as my old large tanks. Not me. I live up north, and I have central heating. Very dry in winter. The 5 gallon tank suffered so much evaporation in the winter that I had to remember to top off the tank every other day or so, or the water level would drop so low the filter would stop running. Well sure, and I told him that was a bad idea. But I see just as many people trying to put an oscar or a goldfish in a 20 gallon too. It's all the same problem if the the tank is 55 gallons or 5- education. But obviously, the larger the tank, the more room for error. Which was my point. I've never heard that said before, and I can't even fathom the logic in that. If I have a 20 gallon tank that has 3 wpg, I should not need more light in a 5 gallon tank to grow the same plants. especially since it's likely the tank is deeper in the larger tank. Can you explain this one more to me? See this article: http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/Tech/Lighting/ Basically, it's a lighting survey that shows that the watt per gallon rule breaks down for very large tanks (over 100 gallons) and very small tanks (under 5 gallons). As for the reason...I don't know for sure, but I suspect it's due to the nature of flourescent lights, and a certain obvious flaw in the wpg rule. The longer a flourescent bulb is, the more efficient it is. So you get more light per watt from a 4' bulb than from a shorter one. And the wpg rule ignores the fact that height is more important than the other dimensions. And height really doesn't change much as a tank gets larger. Length is the dimension that changes the most. But the wpg rule treats all dimensions as equal. Obviously, a tank that was 2'x2x6' tall would need more light than one that's 6'x2'x2'. But the wpg rule would say they're the same volume, and so need the same amount of light. Just curious, what kind of setup did you have? I had it set up in various ways. When I had a Betta in it, there was no filtration. I tried it with a sponge filter for shrimp, and with a UGF for various small critters. I even had it set up as a brackish tank for a pair of baby puffers for awhile. I never had that problem either. Hopefully if your injecting co2 you know about the KH and ph formula. The same rules apply, and hopefully you are monitoring and going slow at first With DIY CO2, it's hard to overdose the tank if you have a 20 gallon. You can OD and kill all the fish with DIY CO2 on a 2 gallon tank. True enough, but he asked if it was possible. And I didn't say it wasn't possible. I just tried to encourage him to go with the larger tank. I also don't see a ten gallon tank absorbing very many beginners mistakes. Larger would be better, but a 10 gallon is better than 2-1/2 gallons. Following the beginner's rule of an inch of fish per gallon, he'd have to limit himself to 2 fish. Very difficult for a beginner. With a ten gallon, he could get himself ten small fish, and even if he went overboard, and got a few extra, or some larger fish, he'd probably be okay. Leigh http://www.fortunecity.com/lavender/halloween/881/ |
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