Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on,
so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants are
introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom last
fall.)



TIA.

"jJim McLaughlin" wrote in message
. ..
Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on,
so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants
are introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom
last fall.)



TIA.


Weed-Be-Gone will only kill broad leafed weeds it will not kill grass so
if you have grass also use Round-Up.

--
Travis in Shoreline Washington

Cover the area with 4 - 6mm clear poly (the stuff they use for vapor barrier
under a slab). It will bake/frey whatever vegitation that is under the poly
and will kill any fungal disease that might be in the area. Much better IMHO
than using chemicals.


"Travis M." wrote:

"jJim McLaughlin" wrote in message
...
Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on,
so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants
are introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom
last fall.)



TIA.


Weed-Be-Gone will only kill broad leafed weeds it will not kill grass so
if you have grass also use Round-Up.

"jJim McLaughlin" wrote in message
. ..
Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly and
then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on, so
I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants are
introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom last
fall.)


No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a
neighborhood kid to hand weed the area. Or, your heart may end up being the
least of your troubles. If you don't know any kids to ask, call the nearest
high school and find out if they have a way of connecting kids who want jobs
with people offering work.

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"jJim McLaughlin" wrote in message
. ..
Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering
on, so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants
are introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom
last fall.)


No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire
a neighborhood kid to hand weed the area. Or, your heart may end up
being the least of your troubles. If you don't know any kids to ask,
call the nearest high school and find out if they have a way of
connecting kids who want jobs with people offering work.


I have used www.craigslist.org to find help with odd jobs.

--
Travis in Shoreline Washington

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:




No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a

If you mean humans used as pesticide "test animals" sure they have.
Several not too distant studies are around on different products. EPA
had quit accepting such data only as recent as 1998 for regulatory
purposes on pesticides. So it's ethical to admit such studies on
chemicals used as pharmaceuticals which may only effect a small part of
the population and unethical for the same type of studies on another
chemical that by it's usage may effect a much larger percentage of the
population because it is called a pesticide.


Lar

On Fri, 27 Apr 2007 08:30:49 -0500, Lar wrote:

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:




No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a

If you mean humans used as pesticide "test animals" sure they have.
Several not too distant studies are around on different products. EPA
had quit accepting such data only as recent

RECENTLY

as 1998 for regulatory
purposes on pesticides. So it's ethical to admit such studies on
chemicals used as pharmaceuticals which may only effect

AFFECT

a small part of
the population and unethical for the same type of studies on another
chemical that by it's

ITS

usage may effect

AFFECT

a much larger percentage of the
population because it is called a pesticide.


Lar

Sorry - I had one of those attacks. Helpless when the
grammar grips me.

On Apr 27, 9:30 am, Lar wrote:
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a

If you mean humans used as pesticide "test animals" sure they have.

That's why we haven't stopped illegal alien migrant farm workers from
coming in.

On May 15, 11:49 am, z wrote:
On Apr 27, 9:30 am, Lar wrote:

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a

If you mean humans used as pesticide "test animals" sure they have.

That's why we haven't stopped illegal alien migrant farm workers from
coming in.

Farming is an industry like coal mining or diamond mining that is
economically based on the exploitation of labor like beasts of
burden. New methods and chemicals may reduce labor, but also expose
workers to higher risks. New mechanical tools may also reduce labor
and health risks, but sometimes the benefit is questionable. An
interesting controversy has been recently exposed over the use of a
bedweeder tractor or flat bed weeder where workers pull weeds while
laying down on cots. This story from a Spanish newspaper is discussed
on ergonica.com/hand_weeder_science.htm. But that's another story...

Be kind to workers who handle your food and they will also be kind to
you.

-----
At peace with weeds....

On 16 May 2007 10:06:39 -0700, raycruzer wrote:

On May 15, 11:49 am, z wrote:
On Apr 27, 9:30 am, Lar wrote:

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a

If you mean humans used as pesticide "test animals" sure they have.

That's why we haven't stopped illegal alien migrant farm workers from
coming in.

Farming is an industry like coal mining or diamond mining that is
economically based on the exploitation of labor like beasts of
burden. New methods and chemicals may reduce labor, but also expose
workers to higher risks. New mechanical tools may also reduce labor
and health risks, but sometimes the benefit is questionable. An
interesting controversy has been recently exposed over the use of a
bedweeder tractor or flat bed weeder where workers pull weeds while
laying down on cots. This story from a Spanish newspaper is discussed
on ergonica.com/hand_weeder_science.htm. But that's another story...

Be kind to workers who handle your food and they will also be kind to
you.

You characterize farming as "based on the exploitation of labor like
beasts of burden." That ignores the many, many farming areas that
have been totally mechanized. Corn, wheat and grain farming use no
"beasts of burden" human or otherwise.

You site one example in Spain and use it to condemn an entire
industry.

Shame on you.

John

jJim McLaughlin wrote:
Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on,
so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants are
introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Roundup (active ingredient glyphosate) is a complete
herbicide. It kills, or is intended to kill,
everything to which you apply it.

Weed-B-Gon from Ortho is intended to kill weeds in
lawns while not harming the grass. Its active
ingredient (Triclopyr) is a selective systemic
herbicide that affects woody and broadleaf plants.

You can find probably more information that you ever
wanted on both of the chemicals at the Extoxnet site:
http://extoxnet.orst.edu/pips/glyphosa.htm (for
glyphosate) and
http://extoxnet.orst.edu/pips/triclopy.htm (for triclopyr).


Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom last
fall.)



TIA.

jJim McLaughlin wrote:
Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on,
so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants are
introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom last
fall.)



TIA.


Assuming the ground is not compacted too bad, I would spray it with
Round-Up, plant my garden *without* tilling, and use the compost for
mulch. 62 cubic feet sounds like a lot, but it will cover your area a
little less than 2 inches.

I wouldn't till it because that will awaken dormant weed seeds that are
just waiting for the ground to be disturbed. Let the earthworms till it
for you. (or till it next year after you've gardened it for a year and
kept it weeded by hand)

Bob

zxcvbob wrote:
jJim McLaughlin wrote:

Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly
and then replant by
15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on,
so I have more weeds
than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted
grass clippings and dried
brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants
are introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom
last fall.)



TIA.



Assuming the ground is not compacted too bad,

Its not, it was tilled back last October, bu never got the cover down.
Soil is still real wet as is typical of our springs.
I used to add 4 fifty pound sand sacks each year too help drainage, and
aid the compost in
breaking up the clay, but that may not be an option this year.


The three 10 gallon buckets of ash from the wood stoves over a winter's
heating season
are already out there.

I would spray it with
Round-Up, plant my garden *without* tilling, and use the compost for
mulch. 62 cubic feet sounds like a lot, but it will cover your area a
little less than 2 inches.

The compost operation is three 4' x 4 ' x 4' chicken wire bins, rotated
and tossed a lot.
Its amazing how full one looks when its all "cooked" and ready, and how
little there is when it is spread.



I wouldn't till it because that will awaken dormant weed seeds that are
just waiting for the ground to be disturbed. Let the earthworms till it
for you. (or till it next year after you've gardened it for a year and
kept it weeded by hand)

Both the garden plot and the compost are teaming with worms. I like worms.
(Neighbors think I'm wierd.)

If the grand kids were here (Oregon) instead of Virginia, they'd be
learning that
the "funnest" use of worms is fishingn not farming.

My concern re the Roundup is that as I understand it it is not a soil
sterilant, and
thats the way I want it to be, i.e. kill the crap and not sterilize the
soil.

G*dda*n morning glory blows in from across back fence neighbor's yard
and I hate it,
hate it, hate it, do you hear!

(Did I tell you some eighbors think I'm wierd?) BFG

Thanks for ideas.



Bob

On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 14:47:53 -0700, jJim McLaughlin
wrote:

snipped early discussion
I wouldn't till it because that will awaken dormant weed seeds that are
just waiting for the ground to be disturbed. Let the earthworms till it
for you. (or till it next year after you've gardened it for a year and
kept it weeded by hand)

Both the garden plot and the compost are teaming with worms. I like worms.
(Neighbors think I'm wierd.)

If the grand kids were here (Oregon) instead of Virginia, they'd be
learning that
the "funnest" use of worms is fishingn not farming.

My concern re the Roundup is that as I understand it it is not a soil
sterilant, and
thats the way I want it to be, i.e. kill the crap and not sterilize the
soil.

G*dda*n morning glory blows in from across back fence neighbor's yard
and I hate it,
hate it, hate it, do you hear!

(Did I tell you some eighbors think I'm wierd?) BFG


You are dealing with 3 different situations and looking for one
solution. It does not exist.

Roundup will kill all growing vegetation, regardless of weed, grass or
veggie.

Weed-B-Gone will kill all broadleaf growing vegetation but will not
affect grasses.

Neither of those will affect ungerminated weed seeds in the ground
waiting their time. You need a pre-emergent herbicide (Dacthol or
Dactrinol for instance) to do that but it will also kill any veggie
seeds that you plant for the next month or so.

So, you makes your choices and pays your price.

Be sure to read the label of whatever you choose and follow its
instructions to the letter. Do that and there is little danger to
those who consume the produce contrary to the beliefs of those who
consume insect larvae in their veggies and fruits.

John

John Bachman wrote:

SNIPS


Nice post. Thanks.

I'm not worried about ungerminated weed seeds.

Those I can deal with on an ongoing basis.


Do that and there is little danger to
those who consume the produce contrary to the beliefs of those who
consume insect larvae in their veggies and fruits.


ROTFLMAO.

So true.

Good comment.

John