"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties. My wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall manure had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants. This is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas where I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi...h-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake. The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used for
gardening. Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores, those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will introduce
disease.

"David Hare-Scott" wrote in message
...
Dioclese wrote:

Chicken manure is okay if you leave it exposed to the weather for one
season, and use it where the soil is high on the alkaline side.

Some of the nutrients in fresh chicken manure are quite volatile and
others are very soluble in water. Leaving it out exposed will release
these into the environment, which will indeed reduce the chance of burning
plants due to excess. However these useful substances will be wasted,
unless you want the grass downhill from the heap to be nice and green. A
better solution is to mix it in with compost where at least some of the
nutrients will be absorbed, or dig it in when preparing a bed and leave it
a couple of weeks before planting.

I am not sure why you are saying to use it where the soil is too alkaline.
I cannot see that you would be adding enough to alter the pH of soil very
much (especially clay-based soil) and I would expect it to raise rather
than lower pH.

David

My parents turned virtually all-caliche soil to something viable for St.
Augustine grass that thrived on it by using the rotation method I mentioned.
Exposed to weather/sun chicken feces tends to stay put unless there's a
downpour from my own observations. The chickens tend to spread the fresher
stuff around as well while ranging. (ever get any animal poop between your
toes?). Beneath the soil surface, earthworms abound on the stuff and break
up the soil. Earthworms don't normally inhabit this type of caliche. The
type of caliche they had was the virtually bright while and color, and you
could draw on the sidewalk with it. At least that' what we saw.
Regardless, I can't argue the results with "science" as the results speak
for themselves.
--
Dave

CDOs are how we got here.
A modified version, new taxes in the future, is how Congress will get us
out?

Dioclese wrote:
"David Hare-Scott" wrote in message
...
Dioclese wrote:

Chicken manure is okay if you leave it exposed to the weather for
one season, and use it where the soil is high on the alkaline side.

Some of the nutrients in fresh chicken manure are quite volatile and
others are very soluble in water. Leaving it out exposed will
release these into the environment, which will indeed reduce the
chance of burning plants due to excess. However these useful
substances will be wasted, unless you want the grass downhill from
the heap to be nice and green. A better solution is to mix it in
with compost where at least some of the nutrients will be absorbed,
or dig it in when preparing a bed and leave it a couple of weeks
before planting. I am not sure why you are saying to use it where the
soil is too
alkaline. I cannot see that you would be adding enough to alter the
pH of soil very much (especially clay-based soil) and I would expect
it to raise rather than lower pH.

David

My parents turned virtually all-caliche soil to something viable for
St. Augustine grass that thrived on it by using the rotation method I
mentioned. Exposed to weather/sun chicken feces tends to stay put
unless there's a downpour from my own observations. The chickens
tend to spread the fresher stuff around as well while ranging. (ever
get any animal poop between your toes?). Beneath the soil surface,
earthworms abound on the stuff and break up the soil. Earthworms
don't normally inhabit this type of caliche. The type of caliche
they had was the virtually bright while and color, and you could draw
on the sidewalk with it. At least that' what we saw. Regardless, I
can't argue the results with "science" as the results speak for
themselves.

I would not dispute the result that you observed - in science evidence
always trumps theory. It may be though that the method added organic matter
and nutrients which over time improved the texture and growing properties of
the soil not a change in pH. But not having worked with caliche that is
just a theory :-)

David

In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties. My wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall manure had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants. This is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas where I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi.../12/02/Campus/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake. The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ecdesigns/aug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
€ Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc). The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have direct
contact potential with soil.
€ For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
€ Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
€ Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties. My
wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall manure
had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants. This is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas where
I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi.../12/02/Campus/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake. The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ecdesigns/aug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
? Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc). The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have direct
contact potential with soil.
? For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
? Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
? Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?

I sit horse crap in a plastic compost bin anywhere from 9 to 18 months &
bung on the garden late winter, early spring. It has been well sorted by
worms in that time. Works fine for me.

rob

"David Hare-Scott" wrote in message
gardengal wrote:
On Mar 2, 6:06 pm, "SteveB" wrote:
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties. My
wife seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at
least good mulch if tilled in.

Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall manure
had high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants.
This is pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as
stall manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take the
money I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas where
I am going to put lawn?

All ruminant animal manures are very good organic sources of plant
nutrients. But with very few exceptions, they should never be used
fresh. They need to be aged at least 6 months or preferrably, properly
composted.

I think this is going too far, I use horse after a week or two with no ill
effects, it isn't really very strong.

And I've used it fresh and steaming straight from the horse's bum.

It really is just all about 'where' you use it. If it's still steaming, ya
don't put it on seedlings, but a fully grown bush doesn't care two hoots
about how fresh it is as long as the steaming poop isn't laid on 6 inches
deep and right up to the trunk of the bush.

This will allow the high concentrations of ammonium (urine)

I am not trying to be cantankerous but there isn't any urine in ruminant
manure. They do it separately unlike birds. There may be urine in straw
that has been used as bedding but that is another matter.

I read something about the difference between cow and bull poop once.
Apparently cow poop is 'richer' (for want of a better description) than bull
poop because of the differing physiology of the animals. Cows can pee right
onto their plop, whereas bulls/steers can't. Made sense to me having
watched then doing their business quite often - only trouble is, I can't
recall now what ingredient it was in the cow poop that made it 'richer' but
it would make sense if it was more ammonia maybe. and how do people
likeyou and I segregate our poops. Do I go round asking the bulls/steers to
put tags on their poops or to only poop in a particular spot?

to volatize and dissipate and reduce most weed and pathogen issues.

There is not much volatile material in ruminant manure and why waste it?
To get rid of weed seeds you would need to compost it or turn it so that
the seeds are killed by heat or germinate and die in the heap.

I'm with you. Put the nutrients where they should be and don't waste them
in a pile becoming 'well rotted manure' (a ridiculous phrase that).

"FarmI" wrote

I read something about the difference between cow and bull poop once.
Apparently cow poop is 'richer' (for want of a better description) than
bull poop because of the differing physiology of the animals. Cows can
pee right onto their plop, whereas bulls/steers can't. Made sense to me
having watched then doing their business quite often - only trouble is, I
can't recall now what ingredient it was in the cow poop that made it
'richer' but it would make sense if it was more ammonia maybe. and how
do people likeyou and I segregate our poops. Do I go round asking the
bulls/steers to put tags on their poops or to only poop in a particular
spot?


You can always give it a little taste. LOL

In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"FarmI" wrote

I read something about the difference between cow and bull poop once.
Apparently cow poop is 'richer' (for want of a better description) than
bull poop because of the differing physiology of the animals. Cows can
pee right onto their plop, whereas bulls/steers can't. Made sense to me
having watched then doing their business quite often - only trouble is, I
can't recall now what ingredient it was in the cow poop that made it
'richer' but it would make sense if it was more ammonia maybe. and how
do people likeyou and I segregate our poops. Do I go round asking the
bulls/steers to put tags on their poops or to only poop in a particular
spot?


You can always give it a little taste. LOL

How would you characterize the difference in taste and texture? LOL
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"FarmI" wrote

I read something about the difference between cow and bull poop once.
Apparently cow poop is 'richer' (for want of a better description) than
bull poop because of the differing physiology of the animals. Cows can
pee right onto their plop, whereas bulls/steers can't. Made sense to
me
having watched then doing their business quite often - only trouble is,
I
can't recall now what ingredient it was in the cow poop that made it
'richer' but it would make sense if it was more ammonia maybe. and
how
do people likeyou and I segregate our poops. Do I go round asking the
bulls/steers to put tags on their poops or to only poop in a particular
spot?


You can always give it a little taste. LOL

How would you characterize the difference in taste and texture? LOL

Hmm, I was never one to swallow bullshit. heheh

In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"FarmI" wrote

I read something about the difference between cow and bull poop once.
Apparently cow poop is 'richer' (for want of a better description) than
bull poop because of the differing physiology of the animals. Cows can
pee right onto their plop, whereas bulls/steers can't. Made sense to
me
having watched then doing their business quite often - only trouble is,
I
can't recall now what ingredient it was in the cow poop that made it
'richer' but it would make sense if it was more ammonia maybe. and
how
do people likeyou and I segregate our poops. Do I go round asking the
bulls/steers to put tags on their poops or to only poop in a particular
spot?


You can always give it a little taste. LOL

How would you characterize the difference in taste and texture? LOL

Hmm, I was never one to swallow bullshit. heheh

I guess I could ask then, why is it in your mouth?
--

Billy
There are no lobbyists for cover crops and crop rotation. Why?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties. My
wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall manure
had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants. This is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas where
I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi...003/12/02/Camp
us/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake. The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ecdesigns/aug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
? Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc). The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have direct
contact potential with soil.
? For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
? Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
? Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?

I sit horse crap in a plastic compost bin anywhere from 9 to 18 months &
bung on the garden late winter, early spring. It has been well sorted by
worms in that time. Works fine for me.

rob

Good for you and the worms ;O)
--

Billy
There are no lobbyists for cover crops and crop rotation. Why?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties.
My
wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least
good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there
any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall
manure
had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants. This
is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take
the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas
where
I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout
wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi...003/12/02/Camp
us/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake. The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that
kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release
characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ecdesigns/aug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch
them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
? Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc). The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have direct
contact potential with soil.
? For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
? Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
? Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?

I sit horse crap in a plastic compost bin anywhere from 9 to 18 months &
bung on the garden late winter, early spring. It has been well sorted by
worms in that time. Works fine for me.

rob

Good for you and the worms ;O)

and if my cider turns out crap, it'll become liquid manure next spring

rob

In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties.
My
wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least
good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are there
any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall
manure
had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants. This
is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take
the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas
where
I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout
wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi...s/2003/12/02/C
amp
us/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake. The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that
kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release
characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ecdesigns/aug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch
them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
? Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc). The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have direct
contact potential with soil.
? For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
? Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
? Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?

I sit horse crap in a plastic compost bin anywhere from 9 to 18 months &
bung on the garden late winter, early spring. It has been well sorted by
worms in that time. Works fine for me.

rob

Good for you and the worms ;O)

and if my cider turns out crap, it'll become liquid manure next spring

rob

Ah, hold on there cowboy. There must be some way you can distill it to
make apple brandy, like in Normandy ;O)
--

Billy
There are no lobbyists for cover crops and crop rotation. Why?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties.
My
wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least
good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are
there
any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall
manure
had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants.
This
is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as
stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take
the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas
where
I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout
wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi...s/2003/12/02/C
amp
us/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake.
The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that
kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used
for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will
introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed
by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure
requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because
of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release
characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ecdesigns/aug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch
them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
? Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop
that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc).
The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have
direct
contact potential with soil.
? For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure
to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into
the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
? Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure
that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
? Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in
your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?

I sit horse crap in a plastic compost bin anywhere from 9 to 18 months
&
bung on the garden late winter, early spring. It has been well sorted
by
worms in that time. Works fine for me.

rob

Good for you and the worms ;O)

and if my cider turns out crap, it'll become liquid manure next spring

rob

Ah, hold on there cowboy. There must be some way you can distill it to
make apple brandy, like in Normandy ;O)

or vinegar

rob

In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"George.com" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
.
..
In article ,
"brooklyn1" wrote:

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:47:33 -0600, "Dioclese" NONE wrote:

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I live in the middle of pasture land. Lots of free cow patties.
My
wife
seems to think that this would make good fertilizer, or at least
good
mulch
if tilled in.
Other than using fresh dung for the production of food, are
there
any
downsides to using manure? I believe I once read that stall
manure
had
high levels of urea, and would not be good to put on plants.
This
is
pasture manure, so it would not have as high urine level as
stall
manure.

Yeah, I know I can go buy fertilizer, too. But I can also take
the
money
I save and go fishing a few times.

Tips and caveats on manure use? Good/bad for flowers or areas
where
I
am
going to put lawn?

Thanks.

Steve


I've been told that cow manure is full of seed ready to sprout
wherever
you
use it. Horse manure is a better solution.


Just the opposite. Cows have two stomachs,

Cows actually have one stomach but it has four compartments.

http://media.www.thelantern.com/medi...news/2003/12/0
2/C
amp
us/
A.Window.To.The.World.Of.A.Cows.Stomach-569718.shtml

horses have one. I used
horse manure (mushroom compost) over fescue lawns--big mistake.
The
piles were steaming hot, but still introduced a lot of weeds.

When manure is properly composted it will attain temperatures that
kill
seeds. Manure should always be fully composted before being used
for
gardening.

Do not use manure from carnivores and omnivores,

those need to
be processed by specific means (as raw sewage) or they will
introduce
disease.

Background
http://www.ecochem.com/t_manure_fert.html
Generally, poultry manure is highest in nitrogen content, followed
by
hog (an omnivore),
steer, sheep, dairy, and horse manure. Feedlot, steer manure
requires
fairly high rates to meet first-year nitrogen requirements because
of
its lower nitrogen percent and gradual nitrogen release
characteristics.

Worse case scenario, gardening over a leach line.
http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en.../specdesigns/a
ug9
3pr2.html
Do not plant root crops over drain lines. Leafy vegetables could be
contaminated by rain splashing soil onto the plant, so either mulch
them
to eliminate splashing or don't grow them. Fruiting crops should be
safe; train any vining ones, such as cucumbers or tomatoes, onto a
support so the fruit is off the ground.

Down and dirty.
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/2510.htm
If you do intend to use raw manure as a soil amendment or fertilizer
source on your garden, follow these guidelines:
? Apply raw manure at least 120 days before harvesting a crop
that
has the potential for soil contact (leafy greens, root crops, etc).
The
USDA National Organic Program (NOP) standards allow a 90-day period
between manure application and harvest for crops that don¹t have
direct
contact potential with soil.
? For some gardeners in Maine, the best time to apply raw manure
to
your garden may be in the fall after harvest; incorporate it into
the
soil and plant a cover crop to hold nutrients over the winter. This
should be done before October 1 for good cover crop establishment.
? Never use raw manure as a sidedress to growing plants. Manure
that
is incorporated and distributed throughout the soil has a much lower
risk of passing pathogens to the growing crop.
? Consider the source if you still want to use raw manures in
your
garden. Are the animals in the herd or flock healthy? Is there a
parasite problem that requires regular deworming? Does the farm use
antibiotics as a regular component of their feeding program?

Ain't Google wonderful?

I sit horse crap in a plastic compost bin anywhere from 9 to 18 months
&
bung on the garden late winter, early spring. It has been well sorted
by
worms in that time. Works fine for me.

rob

Good for you and the worms ;O)

and if my cider turns out crap, it'll become liquid manure next spring

rob

Ah, hold on there cowboy. There must be some way you can distill it to
make apple brandy, like in Normandy ;O)

or vinegar

rob

Uh-huh. Vinegar, though, won't deliver the Dionysian promise of freeing
the body from the tyranny of the mind.

The only thing that I use apple vinegar for is "chicken and dumplings".

http://www.moonshine-still.com/page2.htm
--

Billy
There are no lobbyists for cover crops and crop rotation. Why?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net