On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:
On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:
My wife is the daughter of a depression baby, and has a sometimes bad
habit of keeping things she should throw away.

We planted some Bush contender string beans last year, nice
germination time, and great growers and producers right into frost.

We had seeds left over, which she kept in a plastic ziploc in the
garden shed, temps sometimes very hot, and then through a freezing
winter.

This year, it seems they to be taking a long time to germinate. Is
there a good estimate of how long seeds are good for? I would say to
buy just enough for what you need each year, but perhaps you find a
strain that you really like, and don't know if they will carry that at
the seed store next year.

And tips on storage from season to season would be appreciated.

Seed companies just keep their bulk seed in the warehouse/bulk storage
facilities, where it stays dry and safe from wide temperature swings.
The following year they'll perform germination testing and if necessary
add fresher seeds to bring the germination rate up to what is stated on
their package labeling. All seed companies do this, which is why the
label says, "Packed for calendar year", instead of "grown for" or
"harvested in" calendar year.

For home gardeners dealing with small amounts, the seed company I worked
for suggested storing the left-over seed packets in clean, dry glass
jars indoors to ensure the seeds were kept dry.

Whew! Sounds like I'm doing the right thing. I store my seeds in my
large walk in pantry in the middle of the house where the temperature
stays not too hot and not too cool. I store my saved seeds in recycled
glass pill bottles or, for purchased seed, in the original packets in
metal boxes.

Properly stored - i.e. kept dry and safe from temperature swings - most
vegetable seeds will retain most of their germinating ability for at
least a couple more years.

And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that
I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather than
fresh.

On 5/28/2014 1:42 AM, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:
On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:
My wife is the daughter of a depression baby, and has a sometimes bad
habit of keeping things she should throw away.

We planted some Bush contender string beans last year, nice
germination time, and great growers and producers right into frost.

We had seeds left over, which she kept in a plastic ziploc in the
garden shed, temps sometimes very hot, and then through a freezing
winter.

This year, it seems they to be taking a long time to germinate. Is
there a good estimate of how long seeds are good for? I would say to
buy just enough for what you need each year, but perhaps you find a
strain that you really like, and don't know if they will carry that at
the seed store next year.

And tips on storage from season to season would be appreciated.

Seed companies just keep their bulk seed in the warehouse/bulk storage
facilities, where it stays dry and safe from wide temperature swings.
The following year they'll perform germination testing and if necessary
add fresher seeds to bring the germination rate up to what is stated on
their package labeling. All seed companies do this, which is why the
label says, "Packed for calendar year", instead of "grown for" or
"harvested in" calendar year.

For home gardeners dealing with small amounts, the seed company I
worked
for suggested storing the left-over seed packets in clean, dry glass
jars indoors to ensure the seeds were kept dry.

Whew! Sounds like I'm doing the right thing. I store my seeds in my
large walk in pantry in the middle of the house where the temperature
stays not too hot and not too cool. I store my saved seeds in
recycled glass pill bottles or, for purchased seed, in the original
packets in metal boxes.

Properly stored - i.e. kept dry and safe from temperature swings - most
vegetable seeds will retain most of their germinating ability for at
least a couple more years.

And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that
I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather
than fresh.


The owner of the seed company I worked for told me that was true of
tomato seeds, too. Though I did the germination testing for the
company, I can't say if that was really true, because I never saved a
specific sample for long-term testing. We just tested what was held
over every year and adjusted with fresh seed as necessary.

Oh - and when a customer complained about poor germination, we'd ask
for a sample of the seed (assuming there was any left) and tested
that, too. Invariably, it met specs, meaning the poor germination was
due to environmental conditions, not that it was non-viable seed.
Ironically, the fad now is for 'organic' seeds, most usually meaning
seed that isn't treated with a fungicide to reduce the risk of
decaying before it sprouts. If you want untreated seed, fine, but if
the weather doesn't cooperate it will have a greater chance of rotting
rather than sprouting.

On 28/05/2014 10:25 PM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:
On 5/28/2014 1:42 AM, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:
On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:
My wife is the daughter of a depression baby, and has a sometimes bad
habit of keeping things she should throw away.

We planted some Bush contender string beans last year, nice
germination time, and great growers and producers right into frost.

We had seeds left over, which she kept in a plastic ziploc in the
garden shed, temps sometimes very hot, and then through a freezing
winter.

This year, it seems they to be taking a long time to germinate. Is
there a good estimate of how long seeds are good for? I would say to
buy just enough for what you need each year, but perhaps you find a
strain that you really like, and don't know if they will carry that at
the seed store next year.

And tips on storage from season to season would be appreciated.

Seed companies just keep their bulk seed in the warehouse/bulk storage
facilities, where it stays dry and safe from wide temperature swings.
The following year they'll perform germination testing and if necessary
add fresher seeds to bring the germination rate up to what is stated on
their package labeling. All seed companies do this, which is why the
label says, "Packed for calendar year", instead of "grown for" or
"harvested in" calendar year.

For home gardeners dealing with small amounts, the seed company I
worked
for suggested storing the left-over seed packets in clean, dry glass
jars indoors to ensure the seeds were kept dry.

Whew! Sounds like I'm doing the right thing. I store my seeds in my
large walk in pantry in the middle of the house where the temperature
stays not too hot and not too cool. I store my saved seeds in
recycled glass pill bottles or, for purchased seed, in the original
packets in metal boxes.

Properly stored - i.e. kept dry and safe from temperature swings - most
vegetable seeds will retain most of their germinating ability for at
least a couple more years.

And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that
I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather
than fresh.


The owner of the seed company I worked for told me that was true of
tomato seeds, too.

That's interesting. I hadn't ever heard that before. I'll tuck it into
my memory banks and try it next year with some older seed.

Though I did the germination testing for the company,
I can't say if that was really true, because I never saved a specific
sample for long-term testing. We just tested what was held over every
year and adjusted with fresh seed as necessary.

Oh - and when a customer complained about poor germination, we'd ask for
a sample of the seed (assuming there was any left) and tested that, too.
Invariably, it met specs, meaning the poor germination was due to
environmental conditions, not that it was non-viable seed. Ironically,
the fad now is for 'organic' seeds, most usually meaning seed that isn't
treated with a fungicide to reduce the risk of decaying before it
sprouts. If you want untreated seed, fine, but if the weather doesn't
cooperate it will have a greater chance of rotting rather than sprouting.

Thankfully, seeds in my part of Australia are more in danger of failing
to sprout due to dry conditions rather than rotting.

On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 11:42:40 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:

On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:



And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that

I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather than

fresh.

That sounds wildly counter-intuitive. Did your interlocutors say why?

HB

On 29/05/2014 2:28 PM, Higgs Boson wrote:
On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 11:42:40 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:

On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:



And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that

I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather than

fresh.

That sounds wildly counter-intuitive. Did your interlocutors say why?

No.

Higgs Boson said:
On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 11:42:40 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:

On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:



And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that

I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather than

fresh.

That sounds wildly counter-intuitive. Did your interlocutors say why?

I've noticed that sometimes the plants that grow from my older squash seeds
are more likely to skip the first flush of male flowers and get right to producing
female flowers. Most particularly this seems to be true of the C. pepo types
(zuchinni, summer squash, delicata, acorn).

--
Pat in Plymouth MI

"Yes, swooping is bad."

email valid but not regularly monitored

On 29/05/2014 10:46 PM, Pat Kiewicz wrote:
Higgs Boson said:
On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 11:42:40 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:

On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:



And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that

I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather than

fresh.

That sounds wildly counter-intuitive. Did your interlocutors say why?

I've noticed that sometimes the plants that grow from my older squash seeds
are more likely to skip the first flush of male flowers and get right to producing
female flowers. Most particularly this seems to be true of the C. pepo types
(zuchinni, summer squash, delicata, acorn).

That's interesting. I must pay more attention next time I plant older
seeds of the cucurbita family. One thing that does occur to me is that
in Australia what we call 'pumpkin', USians call 'winter squash' so
Higgs might still need to seek a definitive answer to his query.

I'm assuming that the gardeners who told me about older pumpkin seeds
found out what they were telling me based on experience just as you did
with your summer squash. One of these gardeners also told me that dog
poo was a superb fertiliser under lemon trees. Can't say I've ever been
tempted to try that one but since he was a gardener who worked for many
years at Government House then he should have had some knowledge and skills.

Fran Farmer wrote:
One of these gardeners also told me
that dog poo was a superb fertiliser under lemon trees. Can't say I've
ever
been tempted to try that one but since he was a gardener who worked
for many years at Government House then he should have had some
knowledge and skills.

Where did all these dogs come from at Government House? The explanation is
that there are few conveniences in the rather large grounds of Government
House.

Its due to gardeners' piddle.

D

On 30/05/2014 2:00 PM, David Hare-Scott wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
One of these gardeners also told me
that dog poo was a superb fertiliser under lemon trees. Can't say
I've ever
been tempted to try that one but since he was a gardener who worked
for many years at Government House then he should have had some
knowledge and skills.

Where did all these dogs come from at Government House?

I wrote that he was a gardener at Government House. I don't know if he
ever put dog poop under the trees at Government House. He had years of
experience as a gardener both as a wage earner and as a non paid home
gardener. His home garden was wonderful. I'd always assumed that it
was his home trees that had the dog poop under them but must admit that
I didn't specifically ask at the time and he's now dead.

He also advocated the use of banana peel and the water left over in the
pot that vegetables had been cooked in as great for plants. I've
recently taken up this latter tip and it's brought back to (relatively)
lush life a poor suffering camellia and another small flowering plant at
the base of the stairs off my front deck.

Regardless of that, the lemon trees at Government House are very good
ones. Quite amazing really when you consider the climate in which they
grow.

The explanation
is that there are few conveniences in the rather large grounds of
Government House.

Not so - there are excellent dunnies in the grounds at GH.

Its due to gardeners' piddle.

Possibly that is why the lemons at GH are so good.

On 5/29/2014 8:53 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 29/05/2014 10:46 PM, Pat Kiewicz wrote:
Higgs Boson said:
On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 11:42:40 PM UTC-7, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 28/05/2014 12:23 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:

On 5/26/2014 11:30 PM, SteveB wrote:



And some gardeners prefer older seeds too - pumpkin is one seed that

I've been told a few times does better if the seed is older rather than

fresh.

That sounds wildly counter-intuitive. Did your interlocutors say why?

I've noticed that sometimes the plants that grow from my older squash
seeds
are more likely to skip the first flush of male flowers and get right
to producing
female flowers. Most particularly this seems to be true of the C. pepo
types
(zuchinni, summer squash, delicata, acorn).

That's interesting. I must pay more attention next time I plant older
seeds of the cucurbita family. One thing that does occur to me is that
in Australia what we call 'pumpkin', USians call 'winter squash' so
Higgs might still need to seek a definitive answer to his query.

I'm assuming that the gardeners who told me about older pumpkin seeds
found out what they were telling me based on experience just as you did
with your summer squash. One of these gardeners also told me that dog
poo was a superb fertiliser under lemon trees. Can't say I've ever been
tempted to try that one but since he was a gardener who worked for many
years at Government House then he should have had some knowledge and
skills.

Same, same Fran, squash and pumpkins are all basically squash.
Nomenclature is just a way to get your kids to eat pumpkin. G

We have numerous acorn squash seed that didn't compost well so one of
the beds has lots of squash growing. I baked a store bought acorn squash
and tossed the seeds in the composter. The seeds germinated in the
garden bed and are producing what looks like a Hubbard squash that has a
light green background and dark green stripes. Hybridization does that
to plants. Doesn't matter to us as squash is squash and might be a
pumpkin but it's all edible. Amazes the great grand kids when they see
something different and teaches them a small lesson about hybridization,
I hope.

George Shirley wrote:
Fran wrote:
....
I'm assuming that the gardeners who told me about older pumpkin seeds
found out what they were telling me based on experience just as you did
with your summer squash. One of these gardeners also told me that dog
poo was a superb fertiliser under lemon trees. Can't say I've ever been
tempted to try that one but since he was a gardener who worked for many
years at Government House then he should have had some knowledge and
skills.

Same, same Fran, squash and pumpkins are all basically squash.
Nomenclature is just a way to get your kids to eat pumpkin. G

We have numerous acorn squash seed that didn't compost well so one of
the beds has lots of squash growing. I baked a store bought acorn squash
and tossed the seeds in the composter. The seeds germinated in the
garden bed and are producing what looks like a Hubbard squash that has a
light green background and dark green stripes. Hybridization does that
to plants. Doesn't matter to us as squash is squash and might be a
pumpkin but it's all edible. Amazes the great grand kids when they see
something different and teaches them a small lesson about hybridization,
I hope.

i've always seen recommendations to include a
variety of types in a patch to encourage good
fruit setting/filling. my own experience here
bears that out.

as we don't have a formal compost pile to
put scraps in i put them in the worm bins, but
after several years of having squash and melon
seeds pushing up through my other seedlings i
decided the past few years to separate as much
out as i can before putting things in the worm
bins and to put the seeds into only one of the
worm bins (that one doesn't go out into the
gardens each spring).

as most squash seeds are great when roasted
i've taken to squeezing them out of the pulp
(do not add any water) and drying them on a tray
before rubbing the last bits of stuff off them.
i have a good supply now for planting. if we
had more empty fields about i'd be scattering
them in those to see if i can get a wild
population established. i'm hoping i can get
out in the back area (on the other side of the
large drainage ditch) and scatter a bunch of
squash and melon seeds back there. likely
most of them will be animal food, but that's
ok...


songbird