Hi-
I have a small (75 sq foot) area that has been overgrown with English
Ivy. We spent all day yesterday raking and removing any signs of it.
I feel we were pretty successful in getting most of the ivy out but am
worried because I live in a condo and the neighbors have the ivy
growing on their fence. No one lives there at the moment (hasn't in
years) so no one takes care of their area. Do you think I need to
clear out the ivy growing on their fence since it is less than three
feet from the area I've cleared? I have some roundup and though I
might spray it on the newly cleared area to kill off anything we may
have missed. Is this necessary or do you think pulling out the vines
was good enough? I would like to replace the ivy with new shrubbery
and/or flowers, will spraying the roundup hurt my chances of growing
something new there? I am a complete novice when it comes to
gardening ( first place of my own ) so any help would be greatly
appreciated. Thanks!
Kat

(Kat) wrote:

Hi-
I have a small (75 sq foot) area that has been overgrown with English
Ivy. We spent all day yesterday raking and removing any signs of it.
I feel we were pretty successful in getting most of the ivy out but am
worried because I live in a condo and the neighbors have the ivy
growing on their fence. No one lives there at the moment (hasn't in
years) so no one takes care of their area. Do you think I need to
clear out the ivy growing on their fence since it is less than three
feet from the area I've cleared?

I would cut off anything that is hanging off the fence on YOUR side of
the property, but try not to damage what is on their side, since you
do not want to get sued. If this is the normal english ivy (hedera
helix) and not some fancy cultivar, it can grow fairly quickly and
there is no reason to leave it hanging over on your side where it has
that much more of a head start on getting back into your yard. I love
the variegated and miniature forms of english ivy, but the standard
stuff I am beginning to despise. It can be quite hard to get rid of
when you have a well-established patch of it.

I have some roundup and though I might spray it on the newly cleared
area to kill off anything we may have missed.

Roundup should be used on the leaf surfaces of things you want to
kill. Since you have already removed most of the ivy, there is not
much point. You could wait for a while and see if any starts coming
back up and then spray it. But I think the absolute best thing for
you to do if you want to replant the area soon is to work the soil up,
removing any plant material you find as you go. You can use a tiller,
hoe or whatever to do this, but if the area is more or less bare after
the removal of the ivy, I would suggest two of my favorite tools. The
"garden claw" and "garden weasel" - the claw is great for breaking up
soil to begin with and the weasel is fantastic for running over soil
after you have alrady worked it up and weed seeds and things like that
are starting to sprout.

Another option if you are willing to wait a while before planting is
to cover the area with newspapers and mulch on top of that (lawn
clippings, shredded leaves, compost, etc.) or simply to cover the area
with plastic for a while. The former will kill off any remaining ivy
and other plants and will rot them along with the newspaper and enrich
the soil, worms will also love this and the end result should be soil
which is very easy to work up - the plastic method will also kill off
any ivy but it kills other stuff in the soil, does not enrich your
soil like the other method and then you have all of that plastic to do
something with.

Is this necessary or do you think pulling out the vines
was good enough? I would like to replace the ivy with new shrubbery
and/or flowers, will spraying the roundup hurt my chances of growing
something new there? I am a complete novice when it comes to
gardening ( first place of my own ) so any help would be greatly
appreciated. Thanks!

If you spray Roundup, you need to wait a few days before planting
there and many people would tell you that you need to wait much longer
than the label claims. I only use roundup in places where I am not
going to plant anything at least that year, and then I only use it on
things which are exceptionally hard to get rid of. But that is my
preference.

In article ,
(Kat) wrote:

Hi-
I have a small (75 sq foot) area that has been overgrown with English
Ivy. We spent all day yesterday raking and removing any signs of it.
I feel we were pretty successful in getting most of the ivy out but am
worried because I live in a condo and the neighbors have the ivy
growing on their fence. No one lives there at the moment (hasn't in
years) so no one takes care of their area. Do you think I need to
clear out the ivy growing on their fence since it is less than three
feet from the area I've cleared? I have some roundup and though I
might spray it on the newly cleared area to kill off anything we may
have missed. Is this necessary or do you think pulling out the vines
was good enough? I would like to replace the ivy with new shrubbery
and/or flowers, will spraying the roundup hurt my chances of growing
something new there? I am a complete novice when it comes to
gardening ( first place of my own ) so any help would be greatly
appreciated. Thanks!
Kat

Don't injure neighbors plants! It'll render you a criminal. You could ask
permission to remove the growth but I'd expect nobody to give you such
permission unless you are also willing to replace the ivy with something
that requires just as little care.

Many people misunderstand what it means to be an invasive ivy. Ivy is
actually VERY EASY to contol if you bother to control it, it's not going
to creep rapidly into your yard & be hell to get rid of every year. Ivy's
INVASIVE proponensity is due to its SEEDS. Many cultivars of ivys don't
flower or seed ever; even the most aggressive wildest forms commonly
remain in their juvenile stage as vines & do not flower or seed especially
if growing in shade. The vines can be aggressive if never pruned, but no
worse than many a neglectable plant.

They tend to flower only in bright sun, & the vine must first undergo a
literal genetic transformation to create upright bush-like bits that are
no longer vining (the genetically changed bits are sometimes taken as
cuttings & grafted to regular roots, & sold as "tree ivy" because one they
have undergone the maturity-change, they can never revert to vines. The
form called "Arborescens" produces flowers & fruits like mad and should
not be planted anywhere where ivy is potentially invasive, but other forms
do not bare fruit so make safe non-vinging ivy-shrubs, usually sold as
"Erecta" "Congesta" or "Conglomerata").

The flowers on a matured/genetically changed ivy turn to berries, birds
eat the berries, poop the seeds in the woods, hence invasive -- controlled
ivy vines which are kept from fruiting are never invasive in the legal or
environmental sense, though they can even so be annoyingly aggressive
within the garden. But exceedingly few fancy cultivated forms are on any
list as at all apt to seed into the environment, & even if your neighbor
has the aggressive wild form, unless you actually see it flowering &
fruiting, it's not invasive. It is "merely" an aggressive vine that you
can very easily keep off your property without having to kill your
neighbor's plant. If it does seed, you can pull the seedlings out of your
own garden as easily as sprouted hollies or cotoneasters or any constantly
seeding tree or shrub or vine, but it might be responsible to suggest to
anyone growing invasively seeding ivy to replace it with a more ornate ivy
cultivar that will not seed into the woodlands & parks.

REPOST OF PREVIOUS COMMENTARY ON INVASIVE VS NON-INVASIVE IVY:

The general rule is "the smaller & more variegated or the more deeply cut
& delicate the leaves, the less invasive it will be." There are
going-on-500 named cultivars of Hedera helix & the majority (especially
those developed in the last 15 years) are extremely strong in the garden
but not invasive. It is some of the oldest cultivars & the large
leather-leaf plain green English Ivy that is the worst, but its small more
colorful cultivars are by & large safe. Here in the Northwest, the plain
English ivy is a destructive invasive plant. Increasing numbers of
professional landscapers have "taken the oath" to stop planting it, &
Portland was considering actually outlawing it.

The really bad ones locally are H. helix 'Baltica' (now reclassified H.
hibernica 'Hibernica'), H. helix 'Pittsburgh' and H. helix 'Star', ' --
the only ones listed as Washington state's "Class C invasives" which isn't
as nasty as invasives get, but bad enough to require advisory warnings.
These have invaded many forested areas & caused harm, sometimes
completely eradicating the natural forest's undergrowth, & it is not less
damaging in landscape use killing off all the gardened plants in its path.

Miniature H. helix cultivars & especially those with yellow in the leaves
or frilly almost cannabis-like leaves are non-invasive. There is some
potential for escape but none of the mini-leaf cultivars are on government
lists of invasive ivys. H. helix "Buttercup" "Lady Francis" "Goldheart" &
suchlike are safely used English Ivy cultivars. Last year the American Ivy
Society, beset by people suggesting they were evil buggering *******s to
promote ivy, began a new promotion with their "non-invasive Ivy of the
Year" choices, & the first one selected for the annual
best-non-invasive-ivy was "Teardrop."

Others that have in some regions been problem-causing include Hedera
canariensis (Algerian Ivy) & Hedera cholchis (Persian Ivy) which in warmer
zones than mine have proven no less aggressive than English Ivy. But in
Zone 8 or chillier, these MIGHT be restrained by partial die-backs in
winter. I completely destroyed a large stand of English Ivy that had
killed everything in its wake, & replaced a huge area of the crap with
scores of plants, an elaborate garden where once was nothing but ivy. But
I nevertheless decided to plant some of the miniature cultivars on one
shady wall where little else would grow, & I planted the huge-leafed
Algerian Ivy to train to a fence, with some slight terepidation, but it is
not regarded as ever invasive in zone 8.

The most often recommended alternative shade-loving evergreen groundcover
is Japanese Spurge (Pachysandra), which is prettier besides, but if an
upward-growing vine were needed, that would have to be climbing hydrangea
or evergreen cimbing hydrangia.

Deciduous Boston Ivy (Parthenocissus tricuspidata) is not regarded as invasive
here (in terms of official classification) even if it can seem so in a garden.

Here is the "No Ivy Pledge for Landscape Professionals":
http://www.noivyleague.com/Pages/pledge_prof.html

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/