Pat: Thanks for the info. Around here, the second type of show you mention
simply would not work. Or at least, no professional grower would
participate. They might be able to fill it with backyard growers.
Professional growers already have sales tax accounts, credit card
processors, etc., etc. [that we already pay for, every month]. And I, at
least, have my own culture sheets to hand out -- the ones from AOS are not
real accurate for the So. Fla. environment, so I'd rather any purchasers use
mine.

At the better OS shows, we do still have member volunteers asking to help us
with set-up and break-down. These offers are much appreciated (sometimes I
get stuck or stranded), but I prefer to bring my own help, when at all
possible, even tho I have to pay for it -- the OS volunteers, despite their
best intentions, tend to do as much damage as good. At my last OS show, I
just barely managed to keep some of my equipment from being broken by one of
those eager volunteers ... No way I'd let them handle the $$. And even if I
relented on that, 20% would definitely _not_ work. I don't have enough
margin in the plants to pay that kind of commission, and I can't raise
prices to cover it (as you've mentioned), because the plants just won't sell
at prices raised to cover that.

I do understand the risk/reward aspect. Even tried it once or twice, years
back. Never again. I agree with you that it SHOULD give the show sponsor
an incentive to advertise, etc., but it has never seemed to work out that
way, down here. Hope that your luck with it continues. Kenni


"Pat Brennan" wrote in message
...

Around here we have two types of shows. The first is much like yours in
that the society sells sales tables. The cost of tables at these shows
have risen like every thing else over the years.

In the Mid Atlantic area we also have a second type of show, the
commission show. They are part of the legacy left by Merit Huntington.
Instead of vendors taking money, the society runs a central checkout. The
society collects money, handles sales tax, processes credit cards, packs
the purchases, and provides culture info (thus the booklet Al was talking
about for the DC show). Instead of receiving a fixed table fee, the
society takes a percent of the sales (20% in most cases). These shows are
cool in that a society's financial success in not measured by the number
of tables they sell and the amount they charged for them, instead the
society's financial success is measured by how successful the show was for
its vendors. The society is directly rewarded for advertising the show
and getting out the people.

I've been following this thread with great interest, but I haven't chimed in
yet. Here goes.

This I can tell you all: our society is constantly looking for ways to
increase attendance, and it's not all self serving. We recognize that if the
Vendors don't do well, they won't want to return. As it stands, we have a
waiting list of Vendors who wish to participate.

Last year we did some market research at the entry desk to determine which
of our advertising efforts were most successful, and we will use that to
better focus our ad dollars. For this coming year, we intend to offer some
incentives to other societies, in the form of free admission to groups, for
example. This will not increase our net gate, naturally, but it should be of
value to our Vendors. Hopefully, we will recoup a few $$$ due to increased
raffle sales. In any event, more foot traffic is good for everyone in the
long run.

As Kenni knows, we charge a flat fee for a fairly substantial booth set up.
Our flat fee is in keeping with the surrounding societies (including some
which have far more limited facility space), and in fact we were lower for a
good while. That doesn't mean that our own costs have stayed static. They
have not. We try to make things a bit easier for our Vendors by providing a
paid cleaning crew after the show breaks down. For the next show, we want to
provide light refreshments on the show floor during set up. We can't do
alcohol due to venue regulations that would make it prohibitively costly.

Bottom line: we know our Vendors work hard for their money, and we value
them greatly. As to displays, we have found through informal surveys that
they bring people in. Once in, they become potential purchasers. And it is
rare when I see someone leave our shows empty handed.

Just my two cents.

Diana

"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...
Pat: Thanks for the info. Around here, the second type of show you
mention simply would not work. Or at least, no professional grower would
participate. They might be able to fill it with backyard growers.
Professional growers already have sales tax accounts, credit card
processors, etc., etc. [that we already pay for, every month]. And I, at
least, have my own culture sheets to hand out -- the ones from AOS are
not real accurate for the So. Fla. environment, so I'd rather any
purchasers use mine.

At the better OS shows, we do still have member volunteers asking to help
us with set-up and break-down. These offers are much appreciated
(sometimes I get stuck or stranded), but I prefer to bring my own help,
when at all possible, even tho I have to pay for it -- the OS volunteers,
despite their best intentions, tend to do as much damage as good. At my
last OS show, I just barely managed to keep some of my equipment from
being broken by one of those eager volunteers ... No way I'd let them
handle the $$. And even if I relented on that, 20% would definitely _not_
work. I don't have enough margin in the plants to pay that kind of
commission, and I can't raise prices to cover it (as you've mentioned),
because the plants just won't sell at prices raised to cover that.

I do understand the risk/reward aspect. Even tried it once or twice,
years back. Never again. I agree with you that it SHOULD give the show
sponsor an incentive to advertise, etc., but it has never seemed to work
out that way, down here. Hope that your luck with it continues. Kenni


"Pat Brennan" wrote in message
...

Around here we have two types of shows. The first is much like yours in
that the society sells sales tables. The cost of tables at these shows
have risen like every thing else over the years.

In the Mid Atlantic area we also have a second type of show, the
commission show. They are part of the legacy left by Merit Huntington.
Instead of vendors taking money, the society runs a central checkout.
The society collects money, handles sales tax, processes credit cards,
packs the purchases, and provides culture info (thus the booklet Al was
talking about for the DC show). Instead of receiving a fixed table fee,
the society takes a percent of the sales (20% in most cases). These
shows are cool in that a society's financial success in not measured by
the number of tables they sell and the amount they charged for them,
instead the society's financial success is measured by how successful the
show was for its vendors. The society is directly rewarded for
advertising the show and getting out the people.

Diana, I have always said that your show is good, and messages like this are
what proves it. Also why it's one of the 3 OS shows I continue to do. PSL
is not one of them, but too many OS shows skimp on advertising, and/or keep
doing what they did 20 years ago and fail to monitor it, and then blame
their growers for low turn-out.

I'm not sure what you mean by free admission for groups, but if you're
talking busses from other OS, admission does need to be included in the
ticket price, otherwise customers get upset. (They already paid for the bus,
possibly a meal, etc., and then someone wants more $$ for admission???
Doesn't sit well) That doesn't mean your OS needs to eat the cost. If your
OS is arranging the bus, you can easily fold it into the ticket price (with
a conspicuous $1 or $2 discount right on the bill or ticket). If the other
OS is arranging the bus, that gets more complicated, but still doable.
Carpools, well, that gets way more complicated.

I could bring the alcohol for set-up, and keep it outside in the van, if you
send me some pre-orders so I know what to bring. Although it would be even
more welcome at breakdown G. Kenni

"Diana Kulaga" wrote in message
...
I've been following this thread with great interest, but I haven't chimed
in yet. Here goes.

This I can tell you all: our society is constantly looking for ways to
increase attendance, and it's not all self serving. We recognize that if
the Vendors don't do well, they won't want to return. As it stands, we
have a waiting list of Vendors who wish to participate.

Last year we did some market research at the entry desk to determine which
of our advertising efforts were most successful, and we will use that to
better focus our ad dollars. For this coming year, we intend to offer some
incentives to other societies, in the form of free admission to groups,
for example. This will not increase our net gate, naturally, but it should
be of value to our Vendors. Hopefully, we will recoup a few $$$ due to
increased raffle sales. In any event, more foot traffic is good for
everyone in the long run.

As Kenni knows, we charge a flat fee for a fairly substantial booth set
up. Our flat fee is in keeping with the surrounding societies (including
some which have far more limited facility space), and in fact we were
lower for a good while. That doesn't mean that our own costs have stayed
static. They have not. We try to make things a bit easier for our Vendors
by providing a paid cleaning crew after the show breaks down. For the next
show, we want to provide light refreshments on the show floor during set
up. We can't do alcohol due to venue regulations that would make it
prohibitively costly.

Bottom line: we know our Vendors work hard for their money, and we value
them greatly. As to displays, we have found through informal surveys that
they bring people in. Once in, they become potential purchasers. And it is
rare when I see someone leave our shows empty handed.

Just my two cents.

Diana

Diana Kulaga wrote:
I've been following this thread with great interest, but I haven't chimed in
yet. Here goes.

This I can tell you all: our society is constantly looking for ways to
increase attendance, and it's not all self serving. We recognize that if the
Vendors don't do well, they won't want to return. As it stands, we have a
waiting list of Vendors who wish to participate.


Where do you have your shows? The first show I went to was an
accident. The newspaper gave the wrong date and I thought I missed it.
On the way back from shopping I saw a banner outside the Senior Center
and stopped for it. I don't think they charged admission at that time.


I have since attended shows at Botanical Gardens in Birmingham and St
Louis, in malls in Gautier, MS, Chatanooga TN, and Louisville, KY. The
botanical gardens both charged admission, but it was discounted if you
intended to just see the orchid show. The society in Huntsville, AL,
couldn't get any of the malls in the area. I don't recall if it was
because of the price or the mall's refusal because of insurance
liability. They had the first I attended at the Senior Center, then
later years in an area motel's conference rooms.

The malls had the most viewers and was probably best for the venders
just because of normal mall traffic. The botanical gardens were also
busy. The cubby hole shows, such as the motel conference rooms, really
needed a lot of advertising and support. As stated before, if I had
not seen a banner "Orchid Show Today", on a road I drove frequently, I
would have missed it altogether.

Nancy

We are talking about buses from other areas, but I'm not going to get
involved in doing that. IMO, it has to be handled at the local society
level. And yes, we will absorb the admission fee, but what of it? We are
talking about getting people through the door who most likely would not
otherwise have come. So, it's good for the Vendors and maybe we get a kick
for the raffle. We need to discuss how to handle car pooling. Martin Motes
offers free admish for groups of ten or more (at the Miami International
Festival, not the Miami Show) plus a $5.00 coupon good at any Vendor's
booth. We won't be offering the coupons-too costly.

Thanks for offering to tend bar! The Community Center rules call for
expensive insurance and a hired cop for any event that has booze. OTOH, if
it's breakfast, who's to know what's in your OJ or V8 juice? G

Diana


"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...
Diana, I have always said that your show is good, and messages like this
are
what proves it. Also why it's one of the 3 OS shows I continue to do.
PSL
is not one of them, but too many OS shows skimp on advertising, and/or
keep
doing what they did 20 years ago and fail to monitor it, and then blame
their growers for low turn-out.

I'm not sure what you mean by free admission for groups, but if you're
talking busses from other OS, admission does need to be included in the
ticket price, otherwise customers get upset. (They already paid for the
bus,
possibly a meal, etc., and then someone wants more $$ for admission???
Doesn't sit well) That doesn't mean your OS needs to eat the cost. If
your
OS is arranging the bus, you can easily fold it into the ticket price
(with
a conspicuous $1 or $2 discount right on the bill or ticket). If the
other
OS is arranging the bus, that gets more complicated, but still doable.
Carpools, well, that gets way more complicated.

I could bring the alcohol for set-up, and keep it outside in the van, if
you
send me some pre-orders so I know what to bring. Although it would be
even
more welcome at breakdown G. Kenni

"Diana Kulaga" wrote in message
...
I've been following this thread with great interest, but I haven't chimed
in yet. Here goes.

This I can tell you all: our society is constantly looking for ways to
increase attendance, and it's not all self serving. We recognize that if
the Vendors don't do well, they won't want to return. As it stands, we
have a waiting list of Vendors who wish to participate.

Last year we did some market research at the entry desk to determine
which
of our advertising efforts were most successful, and we will use that to
better focus our ad dollars. For this coming year, we intend to offer
some
incentives to other societies, in the form of free admission to groups,
for example. This will not increase our net gate, naturally, but it
should
be of value to our Vendors. Hopefully, we will recoup a few $$$ due to
increased raffle sales. In any event, more foot traffic is good for
everyone in the long run.

As Kenni knows, we charge a flat fee for a fairly substantial booth set
up. Our flat fee is in keeping with the surrounding societies (including
some which have far more limited facility space), and in fact we were
lower for a good while. That doesn't mean that our own costs have stayed
static. They have not. We try to make things a bit easier for our Vendors
by providing a paid cleaning crew after the show breaks down. For the
next
show, we want to provide light refreshments on the show floor during set
up. We can't do alcohol due to venue regulations that would make it
prohibitively costly.

Bottom line: we know our Vendors work hard for their money, and we value
them greatly. As to displays, we have found through informal surveys that
they bring people in. Once in, they become potential purchasers. And it
is
rare when I see someone leave our shows empty handed.

Just my two cents.

Diana

We have our shows at the city Community Center. Right now, it's the only
venue large enough to accomodate us and the parking is pretty good. The
building has an electronic sign that advertises the show for a week in
advance, which is a nice supplement to our paid ads. And, like you, some
folks do find us by accident, though most intend to come.

Scripps Newspapers now has a function called www.yourhub.com. I don't know
if it is available everywhere, but we have made good use of it, and it's
free. Free is good, LOL!

As far as the mall shows go, you'd have to ask a Vendor how they do at them,
but I know that they are a nightmare for the judges. I have heard from a
few Vendors who have lost plants during shows like that; it has to be tough
to monitor all sides at once, and malls are Mecca to shoplifters. Of course,
people can steal at any venue, and I know of instances where it has happened
to individuals. Still, the displays are really unprotected in malls, subject
to everything from thieves to little kids. Just to add some more to the mix,
at a well run show, it shouldn't matter where a Vendor's booth is, but in a
mall someone really could be left out in the cold, at the end of the line,
for example. Shoppers get weary in malls, and start thinking about walking
all the way back to the entrance nearest their cars. Maybe it's just me. I
guess I'm a traitor to the female cause, because I *really* don't like
shopping, especially for clothes for myself. Yuck.

The problem with Botanical Gardens, as I see it, is weather. On a good day
it's great. If it rains, everyone is screwed.

Diana


"Nancy G." wrote in message
ups.com...

Diana Kulaga wrote:
I've been following this thread with great interest, but I haven't chimed
in
yet. Here goes.

This I can tell you all: our society is constantly looking for ways to
increase attendance, and it's not all self serving. We recognize that if
the
Vendors don't do well, they won't want to return. As it stands, we have a
waiting list of Vendors who wish to participate.


Where do you have your shows? The first show I went to was an
accident. The newspaper gave the wrong date and I thought I missed it.
On the way back from shopping I saw a banner outside the Senior Center
and stopped for it. I don't think they charged admission at that time.


I have since attended shows at Botanical Gardens in Birmingham and St
Louis, in malls in Gautier, MS, Chatanooga TN, and Louisville, KY. The
botanical gardens both charged admission, but it was discounted if you
intended to just see the orchid show. The society in Huntsville, AL,
couldn't get any of the malls in the area. I don't recall if it was
because of the price or the mall's refusal because of insurance
liability. They had the first I attended at the Senior Center, then
later years in an area motel's conference rooms.

The malls had the most viewers and was probably best for the venders
just because of normal mall traffic. The botanical gardens were also
busy. The cubby hole shows, such as the motel conference rooms, really
needed a lot of advertising and support. As stated before, if I had
not seen a banner "Orchid Show Today", on a road I drove frequently, I
would have missed it altogether.

Nancy

Diana, your show is very fortunate to have that facility, my vote (if I have
one) is that you should hang on to it forever. Moving a successful show is
always costly, for both the sponsor and the growers, and sometimes fatal.
Some of your neighbors have been less fortunate -- Hurricanes Frances and
Jeanne did away with the Civic Center that FPOS used to use, TOS lost its
twice-yearly venue to a Lexus dealer ...

Most malls are nightmares, period. Besides all the problems that Diana
mentions, the hours are hellish. Booths have to be staffed the whole time
the mall is open (average 13 hours/day, around here), and setup has to be
done while the mall is closed (breakdown, too, but that's usually a smaller
problem because most malls have shorter hours on Sundays) -- as in after 10
pm the night before the show. If displays are involved, then that's an
all-nighter.

It's also not uncommon to contract with a mall, months in advance, and then
walk in at setup time to find a car, or some other special display,
occupying the space that was planned for the raffle table, or one of the
vendor's booths or exhibits, or whatever --even though the person in charge
checked in with the mall the week or two, or even the day or two, before to
make sure of the final arrangements. And there's no recourse (read the fine
print in one of those contracts).

Good growing to all, Kenni



"Diana Kulaga" wrote in message
...
We have our shows at the city Community Center. Right now, it's the only
venue large enough to accomodate us and the parking is pretty good. The
building has an electronic sign that advertises the show for a week in
advance, which is a nice supplement to our paid ads. And, like you, some
folks do find us by accident, though most intend to come.

Scripps Newspapers now has a function called www.yourhub.com. I don't know
if it is available everywhere, but we have made good use of it, and it's
free. Free is good, LOL!

As far as the mall shows go, you'd have to ask a Vendor how they do at
them, but I know that they are a nightmare for the judges. I have heard
from a few Vendors who have lost plants during shows like that; it has to
be tough to monitor all sides at once, and malls are Mecca to shoplifters.
Of course, people can steal at any venue, and I know of instances where it
has happened to individuals. Still, the displays are really unprotected in
malls, subject to everything from thieves to little kids. Just to add some
more to the mix, at a well run show, it shouldn't matter where a Vendor's
booth is, but in a mall someone really could be left out in the cold, at
the end of the line, for example. Shoppers get weary in malls, and start
thinking about walking all the way back to the entrance nearest their
cars. Maybe it's just me. I guess I'm a traitor to the female cause,
because I *really* don't like shopping, especially for clothes for myself.
Yuck.

The problem with Botanical Gardens, as I see it, is weather. On a good day
it's great. If it rains, everyone is screwed.

Diana

And VBOS lost their venue and some members, too, including the folks who
used to run things. My understanding is that the old guard simply rode off
into the sunshine without so much as a Howdy Ma'am, and left the new people
without needed resources. They are rebounding nicely, and we hope that
continues. When one society in an area is strong, we are all stronger for
it.

Diana

"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...
Diana, your show is very fortunate to have that facility, my vote (if I
have one) is that you should hang on to it forever. Moving a successful
show is always costly, for both the sponsor and the growers, and sometimes
fatal. Some of your neighbors have been less fortunate -- Hurricanes
Frances and Jeanne did away with the Civic Center that FPOS used to use,
TOS lost its twice-yearly venue to a Lexus dealer ...

Most malls are nightmares, period. Besides all the problems that Diana
mentions, the hours are hellish. Booths have to be staffed the whole time
the mall is open (average 13 hours/day, around here), and setup has to be
done while the mall is closed (breakdown, too, but that's usually a
smaller problem because most malls have shorter hours on Sundays) -- as in
after 10 pm the night before the show. If displays are involved, then
that's an all-nighter.

It's also not uncommon to contract with a mall, months in advance, and
then walk in at setup time to find a car, or some other special display,
occupying the space that was planned for the raffle table, or one of the
vendor's booths or exhibits, or whatever --even though the person in
charge checked in with the mall the week or two, or even the day or two,
before to make sure of the final arrangements. And there's no recourse
(read the fine print in one of those contracts).

Good growing to all, Kenni



"Diana Kulaga" wrote in message
...
We have our shows at the city Community Center. Right now, it's the only
venue large enough to accomodate us and the parking is pretty good. The
building has an electronic sign that advertises the show for a week in
advance, which is a nice supplement to our paid ads. And, like you, some
folks do find us by accident, though most intend to come.

Scripps Newspapers now has a function called www.yourhub.com. I don't
know if it is available everywhere, but we have made good use of it, and
it's free. Free is good, LOL!

As far as the mall shows go, you'd have to ask a Vendor how they do at
them, but I know that they are a nightmare for the judges. I have heard
from a few Vendors who have lost plants during shows like that; it has to
be tough to monitor all sides at once, and malls are Mecca to
shoplifters. Of course, people can steal at any venue, and I know of
instances where it has happened to individuals. Still, the displays are
really unprotected in malls, subject to everything from thieves to little
kids. Just to add some more to the mix, at a well run show, it shouldn't
matter where a Vendor's booth is, but in a mall someone really could be
left out in the cold, at the end of the line, for example. Shoppers get
weary in malls, and start thinking about walking all the way back to the
entrance nearest their cars. Maybe it's just me. I guess I'm a traitor to
the female cause, because I *really* don't like shopping, especially for
clothes for myself. Yuck.

The problem with Botanical Gardens, as I see it, is weather. On a good
day it's great. If it rains, everyone is screwed.

Diana

On Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:11:55 -0500 in Kenni Judd wrote:
It's also not uncommon to contract with a mall, months in advance, and then
walk in at setup time to find a car, or some other special display,
occupying the space that was planned for the raffle table, or one of the
vendor's booths or exhibits, or whatever --even though the person in charge
checked in with the mall the week or two, or even the day or two, before to
make sure of the final arrangements. And there's no recourse (read the fine
print in one of those contracts).

Well, there's always the recourse of using a maul payphone to call in that
the display vehicle "looks suspicious" and let LEO do their damage...
Wait until after the show is done and ya'll can pretty much guarantee that
the car shows positive on nitrates :-).

--
Chris Dukes, Practicing his inner (and outer) curmudgeon.
elfick willg: you can't use dell to beat people, it wouldn't stand up
to the strain... much like attacking a tank with a wiffle bat

On Thu, 16 Nov 2006 14:35:32 -0500, "Diana Kulaga"
wrote:

Thanks for offering to tend bar! The Community Center rules call for
expensive insurance and a hired cop for any event that has booze. OTOH, if
it's breakfast, who's to know what's in your OJ or V8 juice? G

Diana

How early do I need to be there for Breakfast?
SuE
http://orchids.legolas.org/gallery/orchids

How early do I need to be there for Breakfast?

LOL!!!

Diana

using a maul payphone...................

Or mauling the display vehicle! ;oD

Diana