On Fri, 6 Feb 2009 07:29:59 -0800 (PST) in Ted Byers wrote:

It isn't a question of being stuck. I have years of experience using
Outlook Express. I just hate it because of the extent it wastes
resources such as hard disk space, and it's interface leaves much to
be desired. A web interface is preferable (if well designed) since
the data remains on the host, always viewable, and consumes minimal
resources on the client machines. Web technologies are just more
flexible that nntp allows.

Outlook is a festering pile of feces, and always has been.
OTOH, an NNTP client need not be more than netcat and a pad
of paper to track last read articles...
And while most NNTP servers are configured to discard articles after
a period of time or quantity of storage space, they don't have
to be configured that way.
A single web host has the disadvantage that it can be shut down
and lost with one warrant or lawsuit.

Granted, things have gotten better, we're back to normally having web
pages where I can click on a specific blog entry and get a URL I
can send to someone else and 1) it'll work 2) It's human readable
and less than 80 characters long....
But it's a UI nightmare to shuffle between live journal,
various software blogs, launchpad.... And maintaining state about
what's read and unread and what was marked as unread so it
could be reread, is pretty much non-existant.

Plus I'm horribly biased from 11 years of dealing with incompetent
websphere developers mixed with cargo cult PHP developers
and my normal inspiration being to go build a raised bed
instead of writing something that sucks less :-).


--
Chris Dukes
davej eskimos have hundreds of words for snow. I have two. Bullshit.

On Feb 6, 11:30*pm, wrote:
On Fri, 6 Feb 2009 07:29:59 -0800 (PST) in Ted Byers *wrote:
Granted, things have gotten better, we're back to normally having web
pages where I can click on a specific blog entry and get a URL I
can send to someone else and 1) it'll work 2) It's human readable
and less than 80 characters long....
But it's a UI nightmare to shuffle between live journal,
various software blogs, launchpad.... *And maintaining state about
what's read and unread and what was marked as unread so it
could be reread, is pretty much non-existant.

Tell me about it. I have to handle such nightmares when designing web
based user interfaces that the end user would find both useful and
friendly. BTW: maintaining such state is not hard to handle IF one
creates an effective subscription interface (using a design pattern
similar to what is required for the combination of security and user
friendliness that requires single logon for multiple applications with
unique permissions requirements for different categories of users);
but creating it requires a software engineer who knows what he's doing
and finding one of these is itself a nightmare.

Plus I'm horribly biased from 11 years of dealing with incompetent
websphere developers mixed with cargo cult PHP developers
and my normal inspiration being to go build a raised bed
instead of writing something that sucks less :-).

Don't forget the cult Ruby developers and cult Javascript developers
and, the worst of the lot, VB developers. ;-)

I no longer get upset with the hordes of incompetent developers out
there. Instad I seek to endure what I can't change, change what I
can, and especially seek the wisdom to know the difference.

What passes for a curriculum for software engineers these days at a
lot of colleagues is a disgrace. It is annoying that such folks
damage the market for custom software by their routine failure to
deliver good quality software, but there isn't much one can do about
it. And I see poor quality software everywhere I go.

I'll stop here as this gets rather depressing ...

Cheers

Ted

wrote:
On Fri, 6 Feb 2009 07:29:59 -0800 (PST) in Ted Byers wrote:

It isn't a question of being stuck. I have years of experience using
Outlook Express. I just hate it because of the extent it wastes
resources such as hard disk space, and it's interface leaves much to
be desired. A web interface is preferable (if well designed) since
the data remains on the host, always viewable, and consumes minimal
resources on the client machines. Web technologies are just more
flexible that nntp allows.


Outlook is a festering pile of feces, and always has been.

Yes, it's always been a mystery to me why anyone would buy software from
a company whose chief product by volume is fixes for its faulty
products. Idiots!

there are lots of web
based orchid forums out there. None of them are like the wild, wild west
USENET used to be. I was recently asked where all the RGOers went. I
replied that I really did not know and that you did not see that many of
them on the various website forums

Yes, and I miss the wild wild west.The community feeling without it is
gone. AOS forum was a reasonable substitute til they broke it up into
little bits and cut out everyone who questioned AOS or argued. The
arguments were fun. It was just like real life - people argue - no need
for Second Life!

While USENET was useful in its time, there are major problems with it
(SPAM, flamewars, poor signal to noise ratio). I prefer a little more
order than is possible in the wild wild west.

And many of us, like me, prefer a LOT more freedom, like the USENET,
warts and all!!

problems like SPAM (some of which was so
disgraceful no responsible parent would let their kids see similar
material).

[Then, and here's an idea - don't let them see it!!]

Yes, responsible parents, who are as scarce as hen's teeth and would
lazily rather restrict everyone's freedom than supervise their children.
Well, I'm not a child and it's not my job to care about their children -
it's theirs! Don't want to go to the trouble of monitoring and
supervising your children? Then don't HAVE them!!! I'm sick of
everything in my life being circumscribed by OTHER PEOPLE'S CHILDREN.
Freedom of speech? Ooh, don't cuss in public because some person's
coddled little brat might hear a word. Oh, terrible. A word. So because
the parent chose to breed and drag their child out in public I lose my
freedom of speech? If they don't like it they can keep the kid in, or,
here's an idea, teach the kid whatever values they like without
impinging on the freedom of everyone else. Too hard? Then don't be a
parent. They're worried about my speech but they'll happily sit the kid
down in front of a tv set and watch two supposedly human beings beat
each other senseless and call it sport [boxing]. Bah! Humbug!

Thank goodness the governor of NY didn't pick the Cuomo nazi for the
senate seat!!