All,

This past weekend our society installed a floor display (100 sf) for a local
show. Because of the hurricane losses so many growers have had down here,
there was only one other society participating (usually there would be a
minimum of four).

An aside: when we got up there and discovered there would only be the two
societies, Frank suggested that we simply throw the plants on the plastic
foot print and shoot for second place. We voted him down, LOL....

We were fortunate enough to be judged the best display, and out of the 43
plants we displayed 30 won ribbons and we had four Best in Show awards. Not
a bad day!

But here's the rub. The other display, with far less ribbons and judged to
be less worthy than ours (though beautiful, for sure!), was given the AOS
Trophy. Huh? Turns out that the judging teams had some infighting - mild
understatement - and one team decided to give the Trophy to the other
society. The gal running the show went into the judging room and asked if
someone could tell her what had happened. The judges replied, and I quote:
"No". Just "No".

The trophy doesn't matter to us. It was clearly stated that we won hands
down. Is this stuff common, though? Agreement on who had the best display
and one group of judges unilaterally deciding to place an AOS Trophy on its
own?

Maybe this is why I'm not in the judge's pipeline. Enough politics without
extending it to orchid shows!

Comments?

Diana

The trophy doesn't matter to us. It was clearly stated that we won hands
down. Is this stuff common, though? Agreement on who had the best display
and one group of judges unilaterally deciding to place an AOS Trophy on its
own?

Maybe this is why I'm not in the judge's pipeline. Enough politics without
extending it to orchid shows!



Doesn't sound good... In general, at least around here, we keep
politics to a minimum (we all get along pretty well) and it is usually
quite fun to be a judge (it better be fun, since we pay to do it.). I
highly recommend it. Judges should be excused from voting if they are
in conflict, if that didn't happen it is a serious mistake.

Some possible explainations (I wasn't there).
1) at a small show, it is often difficult to justify giving a show
trophy at all. Not because of the quality of the exhibits, but because
of the lack of competition to compare them to.
2) Judges look at things you might not consider when scoring show trophy
(it is a scored award, out of 100 like the rest of them). Flower
quality is only one of the criteria, and only worth about 1/3 of the
points (but like size, the most important points). So, regardless of
how many ribbons (probably awarded after the show trophy was voted),
even the best plants can only get you so many points. The rest of the
points are pretty much equally divided between artistic arrangement,
diversity of plants exhibited, labelling... stuff like that. It could
be that a small group of judges just had some deep objection to
something in your display. I've seen people get incensed over
butterflies on sticks, or little frogs, or splashy fountains -
distracting from the plants. Or a single plant totally dominated the
exhibit, rather than contributing to it. Maybe they didn't like the
labels. Anyway, the point is that you can disagree (honestly) about
the merits and demerits of a floral display. Sometimes that can turn
into a rather heated debate (I personally feel that butterflies on
sticks are a fatal flaw... little frogs are ok!).

Anyway, as a practical training exercise: Try to take an unbiased
look at the exhibit that received the show trophy. Does it have good
flowers? Good design (flow, contrast, balance - like a flower
arrangment)? Do the plants harmonize into an attractive display, or
just kind of look like a jumble of flowers? How did they label the
plants, and are the labels unobtrusive yet easy to read? That kind of
thing. It could be that your exhibit is indeed superior in all these
qualities. But that doesn't mean you can't learn a little bit more
about designing an exhibit by looking at the competition. And ask for a
sample show trophy ballot - so you know what the judges are looking
for. Make some photocopies, and at the next show go and score half a
dozen exhibits. Ask a judge or two that you know to comment on your
results.

Don't worry too much about trophies, they don't re-bloom, ever. *grin*

Rob

--
Rob's Rules: http://www.msu.edu/~halgren
1) There is always room for one more orchid
2) There is always room for two more orchids
2a. See rule 1
3) When one has insufficient credit to purchase
more orchids, obtain more credit
LittlefrogFarm is open - e-mail me for a list )

The trophy doesn't matter to us. It was clearly stated that we won hands
down. Is this stuff common, though? Agreement on who had the best display
and one group of judges unilaterally deciding to place an AOS Trophy on its
own?

Maybe this is why I'm not in the judge's pipeline. Enough politics without
extending it to orchid shows!



Doesn't sound good... In general, at least around here, we keep
politics to a minimum (we all get along pretty well) and it is usually
quite fun to be a judge (it better be fun, since we pay to do it.). I
highly recommend it. Judges should be excused from voting if they are
in conflict, if that didn't happen it is a serious mistake.

Some possible explainations (I wasn't there).
1) at a small show, it is often difficult to justify giving a show
trophy at all. Not because of the quality of the exhibits, but because
of the lack of competition to compare them to.
2) Judges look at things you might not consider when scoring show trophy
(it is a scored award, out of 100 like the rest of them). Flower
quality is only one of the criteria, and only worth about 1/3 of the
points (but like size, the most important points). So, regardless of
how many ribbons (probably awarded after the show trophy was voted),
even the best plants can only get you so many points. The rest of the
points are pretty much equally divided between artistic arrangement,
diversity of plants exhibited, labelling... stuff like that. It could
be that a small group of judges just had some deep objection to
something in your display. I've seen people get incensed over
butterflies on sticks, or little frogs, or splashy fountains -
distracting from the plants. Or a single plant totally dominated the
exhibit, rather than contributing to it. Maybe they didn't like the
labels. Anyway, the point is that you can disagree (honestly) about
the merits and demerits of a floral display. Sometimes that can turn
into a rather heated debate (I personally feel that butterflies on
sticks are a fatal flaw... little frogs are ok!).

Anyway, as a practical training exercise: Try to take an unbiased
look at the exhibit that received the show trophy. Does it have good
flowers? Good design (flow, contrast, balance - like a flower
arrangment)? Do the plants harmonize into an attractive display, or
just kind of look like a jumble of flowers? How did they label the
plants, and are the labels unobtrusive yet easy to read? That kind of
thing. It could be that your exhibit is indeed superior in all these
qualities. But that doesn't mean you can't learn a little bit more
about designing an exhibit by looking at the competition. And ask for a
sample show trophy ballot - so you know what the judges are looking
for. Make some photocopies, and at the next show go and score half a
dozen exhibits. Ask a judge or two that you know to comment on your
results.

Don't worry too much about trophies, they don't re-bloom, ever. *grin*

Rob

--
Rob's Rules: http://www.msu.edu/~halgren
1) There is always room for one more orchid
2) There is always room for two more orchids
2a. See rule 1
3) When one has insufficient credit to purchase
more orchids, obtain more credit
LittlefrogFarm is open - e-mail me for a list )

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 09:32:00 -0500, Rob Halgren
wrote:


The trophy doesn't matter to us. It was clearly stated that we won hands
down. Is this stuff common, though? Agreement on who had the best display
and one group of judges unilaterally deciding to place an AOS Trophy on its
own?

Maybe this is why I'm not in the judge's pipeline. Enough politics without
extending it to orchid shows!



Doesn't sound good... In general, at least around here, we keep
politics to a minimum (we all get along pretty well) and it is usually
quite fun to be a judge (it better be fun, since we pay to do it.). I
highly recommend it. Judges should be excused from voting if they are
in conflict, if that didn't happen it is a serious mistake.

Some possible explainations (I wasn't there).
1) at a small show, it is often difficult to justify giving a show
trophy at all. Not because of the quality of the exhibits, but because
of the lack of competition to compare them to.
2) Judges look at things you might not consider when scoring show trophy
(it is a scored award, out of 100 like the rest of them). Flower
quality is only one of the criteria, and only worth about 1/3 of the
points (but like size, the most important points). So, regardless of
how many ribbons (probably awarded after the show trophy was voted),
even the best plants can only get you so many points. The rest of the
points are pretty much equally divided between artistic arrangement,
diversity of plants exhibited, labelling... stuff like that. It could
be that a small group of judges just had some deep objection to
something in your display. I've seen people get incensed over
butterflies on sticks, or little frogs, or splashy fountains -
distracting from the plants. Or a single plant totally dominated the
exhibit, rather than contributing to it. Maybe they didn't like the
labels. Anyway, the point is that you can disagree (honestly) about
the merits and demerits of a floral display. Sometimes that can turn
into a rather heated debate (I personally feel that butterflies on
sticks are a fatal flaw... little frogs are ok!).

Anyway, as a practical training exercise: Try to take an unbiased
look at the exhibit that received the show trophy. Does it have good
flowers? Good design (flow, contrast, balance - like a flower
arrangment)? Do the plants harmonize into an attractive display, or
just kind of look like a jumble of flowers? How did they label the
plants, and are the labels unobtrusive yet easy to read? That kind of
thing. It could be that your exhibit is indeed superior in all these
qualities. But that doesn't mean you can't learn a little bit more
about designing an exhibit by looking at the competition. And ask for a
sample show trophy ballot - so you know what the judges are looking
for. Make some photocopies, and at the next show go and score half a
dozen exhibits. Ask a judge or two that you know to comment on your
results.

Don't worry too much about trophies, they don't re-bloom, ever. *grin*

Rob

Very good out line of the facts. Some one eye catching piece is
often the trip for or against an exhibit. At our last show I
would not have chosen what won the award. We also have a trophy
called "Best use of Show Theme" That is another "OPINION" that
is sometimes best kept quiet.
SuE
http://orchids.legolas.org/gallery/albums.php

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 09:32:00 -0500, Rob Halgren
wrote:


The trophy doesn't matter to us. It was clearly stated that we won hands
down. Is this stuff common, though? Agreement on who had the best display
and one group of judges unilaterally deciding to place an AOS Trophy on its
own?

Maybe this is why I'm not in the judge's pipeline. Enough politics without
extending it to orchid shows!



Doesn't sound good... In general, at least around here, we keep
politics to a minimum (we all get along pretty well) and it is usually
quite fun to be a judge (it better be fun, since we pay to do it.). I
highly recommend it. Judges should be excused from voting if they are
in conflict, if that didn't happen it is a serious mistake.

Some possible explainations (I wasn't there).
1) at a small show, it is often difficult to justify giving a show
trophy at all. Not because of the quality of the exhibits, but because
of the lack of competition to compare them to.
2) Judges look at things you might not consider when scoring show trophy
(it is a scored award, out of 100 like the rest of them). Flower
quality is only one of the criteria, and only worth about 1/3 of the
points (but like size, the most important points). So, regardless of
how many ribbons (probably awarded after the show trophy was voted),
even the best plants can only get you so many points. The rest of the
points are pretty much equally divided between artistic arrangement,
diversity of plants exhibited, labelling... stuff like that. It could
be that a small group of judges just had some deep objection to
something in your display. I've seen people get incensed over
butterflies on sticks, or little frogs, or splashy fountains -
distracting from the plants. Or a single plant totally dominated the
exhibit, rather than contributing to it. Maybe they didn't like the
labels. Anyway, the point is that you can disagree (honestly) about
the merits and demerits of a floral display. Sometimes that can turn
into a rather heated debate (I personally feel that butterflies on
sticks are a fatal flaw... little frogs are ok!).

Anyway, as a practical training exercise: Try to take an unbiased
look at the exhibit that received the show trophy. Does it have good
flowers? Good design (flow, contrast, balance - like a flower
arrangment)? Do the plants harmonize into an attractive display, or
just kind of look like a jumble of flowers? How did they label the
plants, and are the labels unobtrusive yet easy to read? That kind of
thing. It could be that your exhibit is indeed superior in all these
qualities. But that doesn't mean you can't learn a little bit more
about designing an exhibit by looking at the competition. And ask for a
sample show trophy ballot - so you know what the judges are looking
for. Make some photocopies, and at the next show go and score half a
dozen exhibits. Ask a judge or two that you know to comment on your
results.

Don't worry too much about trophies, they don't re-bloom, ever. *grin*

Rob

Very good out line of the facts. Some one eye catching piece is
often the trip for or against an exhibit. At our last show I
would not have chosen what won the award. We also have a trophy
called "Best use of Show Theme" That is another "OPINION" that
is sometimes best kept quiet.
SuE
http://orchids.legolas.org/gallery/albums.php

All good points, Rob & Sue. The thing is, we read the judges' comment cards
for both displays, and the consensus was clear. There was no grabber in the
other display, even though, as I said originally, it was lovely. The judges
simply deemed ours the better one.

Again, it's not the trophy I care about. Can't eat a trophy! I guess my real
question is about dissonance within the judging ranks, and why the arrogant
reply to the show director. Oh, well. From what I read in rgo, it's not that
way in most other areas.

A good note: a fellow came over and introduced himself as an rgo lurker,
having seen my name on a registration form. Cool!

Diana