On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:09:17 CST, "Henry & Carolyn"
wrote:

You can also cover the pond with a heavy plastic like we do. We make a
rough frame of 2x4's over the pond at drape the plastic over that. We do
all this and live is SW Ontario and the pond has never totally frozen over.


Yes, good point, that will make a BIG difference, just talk with Ingrid who
is able to feed her fish most of the winter by covering and supplying a
little heat.

I wonder if the OP was looking for a cheap up front cost, or power usage?
Pay a little more and lower the power usage, or pay a little up front and
pay over time via more power? ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

YES. altho 15" is really the limit.
#1 way to keep water open is covering the pond as close to the surface as possible.
EVEN IF THE ELECTRICITY GOES OUT, this will keep the pond pretty open, at least slow
freezing for several days.
#2 is keeping water moving, best is a small air bubbler AND a little pump, like one
of these http://weloveteaching.com/mypond/win...ondheater.html
the air stone puts in oxygen which is very good for the fish, the pump keeps the
water moving even if the air stone freezes up.
#3 is a heater of some kind. that flat one shown above is a low watt heater. this
one wont melt the side of the pond if it touches. only if you can put a bar across
the pond then hang a 100 watt heater from it so it wont touch the sides or bottom.
aim the pump output at the heater to move heat away

Ingrid


On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 11:53:29 CST, ~ jan wrote:

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:09:17 CST, "Henry & Carolyn"
wrote:

You can also cover the pond with a heavy plastic like we do. We make a
rough frame of 2x4's over the pond at drape the plastic over that. We do
all this and live is SW Ontario and the pond has never totally frozen over.


Yes, good point, that will make a BIG difference, just talk with Ingrid who
is able to feed her fish most of the winter by covering and supplying a
little heat.

I wonder if the OP was looking for a cheap up front cost, or power usage?
Pay a little more and lower the power usage, or pay a little up front and
pay over time via more power? ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

On Sun, 25 Nov 2007 09:37:37 CST, wrote:

#3 is a heater of some kind. that flat one shown above is a low watt heater. this
one wont melt the side of the pond if it touches. only if you can put a bar across
the pond then hang a 100 watt heater from it so it wont touch the sides or bottom.
aim the pump output at the heater to move heat away

Ingrid

Is that a bird bath heater by chance? ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

yeah, thats what it is. Ingrid

On Sun, 25 Nov 2007 14:56:16 CST, ~ jan wrote:
Is that a bird bath heater by chance? ~ jan

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 10:14:50 CST, wrote:

yeah, thats what it is. Ingrid

On Sun, 25 Nov 2007 14:56:16 CST, ~ jan wrote:
Is that a bird bath heater by chance? ~ jan

K. The link you had didn't work, but I found it he
http://allpetvetsupply.stores.yahoo.net/equmfrm001.html :-) ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

Thanks for all the good ideas...I am thinking to build 2x4 frame and cover
with 4mil clear plastic and drape over pond, I have small air bubler pump
that I can use......the link Ingrid provided for low watage pond heater
does not work, is anyone famaliar with this heater
http://www.aqua-mart.com/flph.html or if I cover and put bubler in pond
should I put heater in as well? tia

On Sun, 25 Nov 2007 20:30:59 CST, wrote:

http://www.aqua-mart.com/flph.html or if I cover and put bubler in pond
should I put heater in as well? tia

That's the heater I use in the lily pond with a bubbler. All the fish made
it thru the winter. We've been holding pretty steady around 32F the last
several days and the lily pond is currently 38F. My koi ponds, even after
the 1000 watt heater having power all day is only at 40F. ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

I cant remember, is your pond covered?
what was the temp before and after adding the heater? does this heater turn off at
34o or so? Ingrid

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 22:28:44 CST, ~ jan wrote:
My koi ponds, even after the 1000 watt heater having power all day is only at 40F.

I cant remember, is your pond covered?
what was the temp before and after adding the heater? does this heater turn off at
34o or so? Ingrid

Only covered with screen door stuff, so doesn't retain much heat. The
heater is suppose to turn off at a point.... but the point seems to be
45ishF. ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

wrote:

YES. altho 15" is really the limit.
#1 way to keep water open is covering the pond as close to the surface as
#possible.
EVEN IF THE ELECTRICITY GOES OUT, this will keep the pond pretty open, at
least slow freezing for several days.

Nobody has mentioned a technique usually used for somewhat deeper ponds.
_After_ ice forms, pump a little water out to leave a gap between the ice
and water. This works as well as covering with plastic, but I suspect it's
a bit too tricky to try it with only 15" to work with in the first place.
--
derek

the ice must be thick to support it across the pond and yes, the pond must be pretty
deep. this is used in zone 4 and colder, like in Sweden IIRC. Ingrid

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 10:14:36 CST, Derek Broughton wrote:
Nobody has mentioned a technique usually used for somewhat deeper ponds.
_After_ ice forms, pump a little water out to leave a gap between the ice
and water. This works as well as covering with plastic, but I suspect it's
a bit too tricky to try it with only 15" to work with in the first place.

In article ,
wrote:

the ice must be thick to support it across the pond and yes, the pond must be
pretty
deep. this is used in zone 4 and colder, like in Sweden IIRC. Ingrid

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 10:14:36 CST, Derek Broughton
wrote:
Nobody has mentioned a technique usually used for somewhat deeper ponds.
_After_ ice forms, pump a little water out to leave a gap between the ice
and water. This works as well as covering with plastic, but I suspect it's
a bit too tricky to try it with only 15" to work with in the first place.

I learned all I need to know about ice watching the last season of "Ice
Road Truckers"

--
To reply by email, remove the word "space"

wrote:

the ice must be thick to support it across the pond and yes, the pond must
be pretty
deep. this is used in zone 4 and colder, like in Sweden IIRC. Ingrid


I lived in zones 5 & 6 - the ice gets plenty thick enough. Especially if
you don't have snow (and if you _have_ snow, you don't usually have a
problem with a 15" pond freezing solid.
--
derek