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Opinions on bead filters appreciated
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... I am really surprised that you are going into personal attack mode. Actually I was not, that was not my intention. I was going out of town, and pressed for time, so I might have been shorter in my post, but there was no anger, just a concern over repeat "misinformation".. I apologize if I seemed a bit short, but you and I both know this is an issue we have "debated" before. We have disagreed on a number of issues in the past ranging from safe use of PP, amount of water people need, use of routine salt, routine use of antibiotics, etc. I never took any discussion personally, even when you stated things I knew not to be factual, based on my fields of training. Nor have I attacked people. That is not my style. I don't have much time, which is why I rarely post, except when questions are asked that I can answer based on available time, knowledge and experience. But, in this particular case I was quite concerned someone considering purchansing a BF was going to be discouraged by something that just doesn't happen, if the device is used properly. I addressed these concerns the last time you raised them, and referenced the same above 2 sites. I hoped you might have at least looked at the information on BF on those sites. Ingrid, .... A personal attack or assault is not a discussion of facts. It begins with the attacker clearly identifying the person being attacked either by name or by the use of "you" repeatedly it sure would be nice if you would sure of your facts, before providing such misinformation. I am sorry if you feel one use of "you", and one use of "your" constitutes a personal attack.. ... The attack is full of emotional words, feelings, beliefs and opinions, but few facts. this is a mild attack It really does impact the credibility of this NG. I'll let the informed readers of this NG determine where the emotional words, etc, etc... you refer to are. I must have missed something.. .... The attacker will often refer to "unidentified others" who share their beliefs and "know what they know". The attack is most often public to be effective. So you are assuming the role of protector of the newsgroup ... Not a protector, just someone who wants to help a person out with a filter selection based on current facts, along with some personal experience with BF. And here I am being nice to you Greg. I erase your name from an erroneous statement like "anaerobic bacteria break down ammonia to nitrogen which is a more usable form for plants". I dont assume anything except it was an oversight, a mistake. Actually Ingrid if you are going to quote things, please quote them accurately.. this is exactly what I mean! The quote (folks you can read from the post just above this one, entitled "VF.. 1 foot deep enough" )actually states (and I am using cut and paste here so I will make no errors in the quote actually says): "to allow anaerobic conditions to occur in the deeper soil layers, which allows for the reduction of nitrates back to nitrogen, which is more efficiently utilized by all the plants" It states reduction of nitrates, (not the ammonia which you quoted me as saying), back to nitrogen. I didn't mean nitrogen gas. I did assume most would know that reduced nitrogen is actually NH4 (ammonium), reduced by the addition of the hydrogen, but I should not have made any assumptions. Sorry folks if there was any confusion... If you go back and read my post (made a little bit ago, before my pc crashed) tonight to that thread, you can see the references yourself. The references will substantiate my statements in what goes on in plants, in how they most efficiently utilize nitrogen. (whoops, I should say again reduced nitrogen in the form of NH4). That's exactly what I mean.. by taking liberties with quotes, statements, etc, information is clearly taken out of context, and misleading to folks. The ONLY fact in what I wrote was bead filters were originally made for swimming pools Not fact. What I heard from Jo Ann. The local pond people come to her when their fish or ponds are in trouble. The locals brought their bead filters in and this is what SHE found inside of them. And the symptoms of the fish that were sick and/or dying in the ponds showing H2S poisoning were using some kind of bead filter. Not to mention that is what it smelled like when they opened them up. You are free to call Jo Ann and dispute what she has seen first hand. No need to attack me cause I am repeating what I heard from a highly reputable source. Now you've identified your source, that is useful.. By pond people, I assume that means more than one. I don't dispute she may have seen anaerobic poisoning, but as I said above, any filter that is not maintained properly can and does result in anaerobic conditions. BF are no different, They have a bigger SA per volume of filter, so they have a bigger SA that could produce more of our good aerobic (nitrifying) bacteria, and if not flushed for weeks at a time, a simple 5 minute task, more anaerobic as well. Bigger gain, bigger risk, if not maintained. They are so much easier to maintain compared to the brush, foam, and other media filters that need to be taken aaprt and cleaned for optimum performance. For people with back problems, degenerative athritis, etc, they really cut the work of ponding considerably down. A high tech blessing, I feel (that's my opinion only) I toured both Bretts koi farm and Prices koi farm. I saw no bead filters. Those are 2 farms. I could give you the names of many others that do use BF.. but that only shows that they can be safely used to handle large volumes of fish, which was my point to begin with. OTOH, as I jokingly said .. women will go with cheap, low maintenance "organic" veggie filter while men will use expensive, high maintenance technology to achieve the same purpose. So I am not surprised that some men will be recommending what they use. Ingrid Veggie filters are fine. It depends on the actual load of fish per volume of pond you want to maintain. I don't you think would dispute that BF have some of the highest SA to volume ratio you can get in a filter in today's market. With heavily loaded Koi ponds, I don't think many would only rely on VF to adequately maintain water quality. Happy ponding, Greg |
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