On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 20:46:53 +0100, wrote:

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases carried
by the newcomer?

I don't think this poll is going to give you much comfort. Many koi die
within 2 - 6 weeks just from poor management of water quality and than
2ndary infections, and/or parasites that might have come with the koi or
been in the pond, take advantage of the suppressed immune system.

Iows, healthy purchase, koi keeper killed it.

If quarantining doesn't work for you, for whatever reason, I highly suggest
you at least salt dip any new fish before putting them in the pond. Knowing
you run the risk, of infecting the pond with a virus, that salt dipping
can't kill. At which point, you'll deal with it. What the ratio to risk
factor is, I have no idea. ~ jan


~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 20:46:53 +0100, wrote:

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases carried
by the newcomer?

I don't think this poll is going to give you much comfort. Many koi die
within 2 - 6 weeks just from poor management of water quality and than
2ndary infections, and/or parasites that might have come with the koi or
been in the pond, take advantage of the suppressed immune system.

Iows, healthy purchase, koi keeper killed it.

If quarantining doesn't work for you, for whatever reason, I highly suggest
you at least salt dip any new fish before putting them in the pond. Knowing
you run the risk, of infecting the pond with a virus, that salt dipping
can't kill. At which point, you'll deal with it. What the ratio to risk
factor is, I have no idea. ~ jan


~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

Dude,

It's like having sex without condom, maybe the lady will get pregnant, maybe
you get gonorrhea, maybe you get aids, it only has to happen once then it's
too late.

I too use to poopoo Ingrid for her constant advice on quarantine, until
disaster struck twice ( Now I confess)

For many months I had grown my Koi, trained them to love me, and then I was
at Wal-Mart and saw this incredible goldfish that looked like Koi. I wanted
it so bad, so when my daughter put the slightest of pressure on me to get
it, deal was done. Got home, floated the bag for a while, and in goes fish.
Lost half of my Koi collection! And I spent a bundle to try and save them,
but them were murdered fish in the hands of "me"

So I swore never to buy fish again, my resistance lasted a few days. Built
new pond in addition to the existing, put in lovely huge Koi, all
quarantined. Dipped in salt before going into the quarantine tank, and
ultimately dipped again before going into the new pond. Not a single death!

Then the greed/impatience in me struck. I saw the most beautiful Showa at a
Koi auction. Bid for it and ultimately over paid. So I got home, and
wanted to see how this new Koi was going to complete my lovely collection of
imported Koi. About 8 of them averaging in cost of $200 per fish. They
were all healthy, until I put in the auction Showa, and then they all died
good, murdered again by me, while my lovely quarantine tank complete with
filter and pump sat nearby unused. But I was too impatient.

I have since collected more Koi, and now swear by my quarantine tank. Thank
you Ingrid, and sorry I didn't listen to you sooner.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8 GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16 inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.

Dude,

It's like having sex without condom, maybe the lady will get pregnant, maybe
you get gonorrhea, maybe you get aids, it only has to happen once then it's
too late.

I too use to poopoo Ingrid for her constant advice on quarantine, until
disaster struck twice ( Now I confess)

For many months I had grown my Koi, trained them to love me, and then I was
at Wal-Mart and saw this incredible goldfish that looked like Koi. I wanted
it so bad, so when my daughter put the slightest of pressure on me to get
it, deal was done. Got home, floated the bag for a while, and in goes fish.
Lost half of my Koi collection! And I spent a bundle to try and save them,
but them were murdered fish in the hands of "me"

So I swore never to buy fish again, my resistance lasted a few days. Built
new pond in addition to the existing, put in lovely huge Koi, all
quarantined. Dipped in salt before going into the quarantine tank, and
ultimately dipped again before going into the new pond. Not a single death!

Then the greed/impatience in me struck. I saw the most beautiful Showa at a
Koi auction. Bid for it and ultimately over paid. So I got home, and
wanted to see how this new Koi was going to complete my lovely collection of
imported Koi. About 8 of them averaging in cost of $200 per fish. They
were all healthy, until I put in the auction Showa, and then they all died
good, murdered again by me, while my lovely quarantine tank complete with
filter and pump sat nearby unused. But I was too impatient.

I have since collected more Koi, and now swear by my quarantine tank. Thank
you Ingrid, and sorry I didn't listen to you sooner.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8 GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16 inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.

Woooow, just hold it a minute!!! I am not running down Ingrid, I just want
to have a feel from people's experience so that we all can understand the
value of putting in the effort to quarentine. It seems that your experience
was most definately an unfortunate one, and much worse than most taking part
in this poll. It will require a considerable effort and cost for those of
us who haven't already got QT facilities to buy and install them, so its
good discuss the frequency for such catastrophies. Your experience is
certainly a catastrophy, and I'm sure that all of us in the group will
sympathise. Its certainly a lesson to learn. Personllay I can't justfy the
room that would be taken by a 100 gallon tank, but I do have a old aquarium
12x9x18 inches that I could use. But do we really have to keep new fish in
it for year, cycling the temperature from high to low to activate any
viruses?
So how many have used QT measures and get deaths in QT?


Fireball


"Just Me "Koi"" wrote in message
news:RJ1dd.8249$232.1298@trnddc09...
Dude,

It's like having sex without condom, maybe the lady will get pregnant,
maybe
you get gonorrhea, maybe you get aids, it only has to happen once then
it's
too late.

I too use to poopoo Ingrid for her constant advice on quarantine, until
disaster struck twice ( Now I confess)

For many months I had grown my Koi, trained them to love me, and then I
was
at Wal-Mart and saw this incredible goldfish that looked like Koi. I
wanted
it so bad, so when my daughter put the slightest of pressure on me to get
it, deal was done. Got home, floated the bag for a while, and in goes
fish.
Lost half of my Koi collection! And I spent a bundle to try and save
them,
but them were murdered fish in the hands of "me"

So I swore never to buy fish again, my resistance lasted a few days.
Built
new pond in addition to the existing, put in lovely huge Koi, all
quarantined. Dipped in salt before going into the quarantine tank, and
ultimately dipped again before going into the new pond. Not a single
death!

Then the greed/impatience in me struck. I saw the most beautiful Showa at
a
Koi auction. Bid for it and ultimately over paid. So I got home, and
wanted to see how this new Koi was going to complete my lovely collection
of
imported Koi. About 8 of them averaging in cost of $200 per fish. They
were all healthy, until I put in the auction Showa, and then they all died
good, murdered again by me, while my lovely quarantine tank complete with
filter and pump sat nearby unused. But I was too impatient.

I have since collected more Koi, and now swear by my quarantine tank.
Thank
you Ingrid, and sorry I didn't listen to you sooner.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi
dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases
carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8 GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16 inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.

I couldn't begin to quote numbers, but I would say I have lost just as many
quarantined as otherwise. And, like several others have said, it was surely
my mistakes in doing the quarantine, or in transferring them over, that did
it.

"axemanchris" wrote in message
. ..

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi
dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died
in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee
procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases
carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8
GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16
inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition
of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.








I purchased 3 goldfish this summer. They came from the feeder tanks at
Petsmart. No room to quarantine, so they went straight into the pond.
They
& all the other goldfish (about 7 or 8) are all fine. I've done this on
several occasions with no ill effect. Yes, I realize I'm probably playing
Russian roulette, but that's the way it has to be right now.

Jacqui

I couldn't begin to quote numbers, but I would say I have lost just as many
quarantined as otherwise. And, like several others have said, it was surely
my mistakes in doing the quarantine, or in transferring them over, that did
it.

"axemanchris" wrote in message
. ..

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi
dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died
in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee
procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases
carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8
GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16
inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition
of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.








I purchased 3 goldfish this summer. They came from the feeder tanks at
Petsmart. No room to quarantine, so they went straight into the pond.
They
& all the other goldfish (about 7 or 8) are all fine. I've done this on
several occasions with no ill effect. Yes, I realize I'm probably playing
Russian roulette, but that's the way it has to be right now.

Jacqui

I couldn't begin to quote numbers, but I would say I have lost just as many
quarantined as otherwise. And, like several others have said, it was surely
my mistakes in doing the quarantine, or in transferring them over, that did
it.

"axemanchris" wrote in message
. ..

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi
dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died
in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee
procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases
carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8
GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16
inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition
of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.








I purchased 3 goldfish this summer. They came from the feeder tanks at
Petsmart. No room to quarantine, so they went straight into the pond.
They
& all the other goldfish (about 7 or 8) are all fine. I've done this on
several occasions with no ill effect. Yes, I realize I'm probably playing
Russian roulette, but that's the way it has to be right now.

Jacqui

I think we both missed each other's point. I didn't think you were knocking
Ingrid in anyways. Heck I didn't even know what your experience or thoughts
were in terms of quarantine.

I suspect that my experience I snot unusual, more in line with anyone that
collects expensive Koi, but not smart enough to do QT.

I apologize if my lengthy mail confused the issue, but the bottom line was,
you are risking the life of your existing stock if you introduce new fish
without QT.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:4175616e@padme....
Woooow, just hold it a minute!!! I am not running down Ingrid, I just
want
to have a feel from people's experience so that we all can understand the
value of putting in the effort to quarentine. It seems that your
experience
was most definately an unfortunate one, and much worse than most taking
part
in this poll. It will require a considerable effort and cost for those
of
us who haven't already got QT facilities to buy and install them, so its
good discuss the frequency for such catastrophies. Your experience is
certainly a catastrophy, and I'm sure that all of us in the group will
sympathise. Its certainly a lesson to learn. Personllay I can't justfy
the
room that would be taken by a 100 gallon tank, but I do have a old
aquarium
12x9x18 inches that I could use. But do we really have to keep new fish
in
it for year, cycling the temperature from high to low to activate any
viruses?
So how many have used QT measures and get deaths in QT?


Fireball


"Just Me "Koi"" wrote in message
news:RJ1dd.8249$232.1298@trnddc09...
Dude,

It's like having sex without condom, maybe the lady will get pregnant,
maybe
you get gonorrhea, maybe you get aids, it only has to happen once then
it's
too late.

I too use to poopoo Ingrid for her constant advice on quarantine, until
disaster struck twice ( Now I confess)

For many months I had grown my Koi, trained them to love me, and then I
was
at Wal-Mart and saw this incredible goldfish that looked like Koi. I
wanted
it so bad, so when my daughter put the slightest of pressure on me to
get
it, deal was done. Got home, floated the bag for a while, and in goes
fish.
Lost half of my Koi collection! And I spent a bundle to try and save
them,
but them were murdered fish in the hands of "me"

So I swore never to buy fish again, my resistance lasted a few days.
Built
new pond in addition to the existing, put in lovely huge Koi, all
quarantined. Dipped in salt before going into the quarantine tank, and
ultimately dipped again before going into the new pond. Not a single
death!

Then the greed/impatience in me struck. I saw the most beautiful Showa
at
a
Koi auction. Bid for it and ultimately over paid. So I got home, and
wanted to see how this new Koi was going to complete my lovely
collection
of
imported Koi. About 8 of them averaging in cost of $200 per fish. They
were all healthy, until I put in the auction Showa, and then they all
died
good, murdered again by me, while my lovely quarantine tank complete
with
filter and pump sat nearby unused. But I was too impatient.

I have since collected more Koi, and now swear by my quarantine tank.
Thank
you Ingrid, and sorry I didn't listen to you sooner.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi
dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job
and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died
in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee
procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases
carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8
GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16
inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition
of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me
that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.

I think we both missed each other's point. I didn't think you were knocking
Ingrid in anyways. Heck I didn't even know what your experience or thoughts
were in terms of quarantine.

I suspect that my experience I snot unusual, more in line with anyone that
collects expensive Koi, but not smart enough to do QT.

I apologize if my lengthy mail confused the issue, but the bottom line was,
you are risking the life of your existing stock if you introduce new fish
without QT.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:4175616e@padme....
Woooow, just hold it a minute!!! I am not running down Ingrid, I just
want
to have a feel from people's experience so that we all can understand the
value of putting in the effort to quarentine. It seems that your
experience
was most definately an unfortunate one, and much worse than most taking
part
in this poll. It will require a considerable effort and cost for those
of
us who haven't already got QT facilities to buy and install them, so its
good discuss the frequency for such catastrophies. Your experience is
certainly a catastrophy, and I'm sure that all of us in the group will
sympathise. Its certainly a lesson to learn. Personllay I can't justfy
the
room that would be taken by a 100 gallon tank, but I do have a old
aquarium
12x9x18 inches that I could use. But do we really have to keep new fish
in
it for year, cycling the temperature from high to low to activate any
viruses?
So how many have used QT measures and get deaths in QT?


Fireball


"Just Me "Koi"" wrote in message
news:RJ1dd.8249$232.1298@trnddc09...
Dude,

It's like having sex without condom, maybe the lady will get pregnant,
maybe
you get gonorrhea, maybe you get aids, it only has to happen once then
it's
too late.

I too use to poopoo Ingrid for her constant advice on quarantine, until
disaster struck twice ( Now I confess)

For many months I had grown my Koi, trained them to love me, and then I
was
at Wal-Mart and saw this incredible goldfish that looked like Koi. I
wanted
it so bad, so when my daughter put the slightest of pressure on me to
get
it, deal was done. Got home, floated the bag for a while, and in goes
fish.
Lost half of my Koi collection! And I spent a bundle to try and save
them,
but them were murdered fish in the hands of "me"

So I swore never to buy fish again, my resistance lasted a few days.
Built
new pond in addition to the existing, put in lovely huge Koi, all
quarantined. Dipped in salt before going into the quarantine tank, and
ultimately dipped again before going into the new pond. Not a single
death!

Then the greed/impatience in me struck. I saw the most beautiful Showa
at
a
Koi auction. Bid for it and ultimately over paid. So I got home, and
wanted to see how this new Koi was going to complete my lovely
collection
of
imported Koi. About 8 of them averaging in cost of $200 per fish. They
were all healthy, until I put in the auction Showa, and then they all
died
good, murdered again by me, while my lovely quarantine tank complete
with
filter and pump sat nearby unused. But I was too impatient.

I have since collected more Koi, and now swear by my quarantine tank.
Thank
you Ingrid, and sorry I didn't listen to you sooner.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

wrote in message news:41741efc@padme....
Continuing the topic of the likelihood of newly introduced GF or Koi
dying
within the first year. Whilst I understand the desirability of having a
100
gallon QT tanks, heaters keeping them for a year in these tanks and
virtually turning your small garden into a fish importers quarantine
industrial estate (I exaggerate for effect - but you know what I mean).
Its
all very well to buy, sterilise, fill, heat, keep a watch on, maintain,
fence have the fish die anyway, etc etc, but I have got a proper job
and
house to rebuild to keep me busy, and I don't have any room for tanks.

The cost and effort put into running the QT tanks needs to be assessed
against the likely hood of the newly introduced fish dying, or more
worrying, existing stocks dying.

The POLL:-

Just how many fish have people in this newsgroup bought, and have died
in
the first, say, year? Both with and without using quarentee
procedures.
And how many times have existing stocks been killed of by diseases
carried
by the newcomer?

I'll start it off. I have added 10 Koi, in 5 batches over 5 years, 8
GF
in
4 batches over 5 years, 2 grass carp, 2 golden tench. All added as
tiddlers.
The grass carp are 12 inches long, and the Koi range from 12 to 16
inches
long.

Deaths: first occurrence this year, 1 out of 1 3 inch tiddler Koi
added.
seemed very happy for the first 3 weeks then poof! without any warning.
Purchased in the autumn.

1 off 16 inch Koi died out of the blue, over a year after the addition
of
any newcomer.

I suspect that this is very typical of pond life and death, whether
quarantining or not - but lets find out. Over to you.

I also lost 2 starlets (dwarf stergeon) but a fish importer told me
that
they are not suitable for ponds, they like rivers.

"Just Me "Koi"" wrote in message
newstjdd.835$qr.718@trnddc05...
I think we both missed each other's point. I didn't think you were knocking
Ingrid in anyways. Heck I didn't even know what your experience or thoughts
were in terms of quarantine.

I suspect that my experience I snot unusual, more in line with anyone that
collects expensive Koi, but not smart enough to do QT.

I apologize if my lengthy mail confused the issue, but the bottom line was,
you are risking the life of your existing stock if you introduce new fish
without QT.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

My view on quarantining fish is that you can go without doing it for years and
never have any trouble whatsoever. But it's the one time that you should have
quarantined and didn't that will make you wish you had. Safe bet - quarantine
the fish, especially if you've got a substantial investment in them.

"Just Me "Koi"" wrote in message
newstjdd.835$qr.718@trnddc05...
I think we both missed each other's point. I didn't think you were knocking
Ingrid in anyways. Heck I didn't even know what your experience or thoughts
were in terms of quarantine.

I suspect that my experience I snot unusual, more in line with anyone that
collects expensive Koi, but not smart enough to do QT.

I apologize if my lengthy mail confused the issue, but the bottom line was,
you are risking the life of your existing stock if you introduce new fish
without QT.

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

My view on quarantining fish is that you can go without doing it for years and
never have any trouble whatsoever. But it's the one time that you should have
quarantined and didn't that will make you wish you had. Safe bet - quarantine
the fish, especially if you've got a substantial investment in them.

Ingrid constantly "carps" about many things...quarantine is just one of them.
I learned the hard way in tanks, so I didnt make the mistake in the pond. I been
carping at my friend Marilyn The Pond Lady and she insists on dumping the new koi
right in and has lost whole ponds full of the best koi. I "carped" to her about
netting I mean especially cause she got a sand hill crane rookery right in the back
of her property and herons drop in all the time. for 20 years no herons. then they
came and wiped a couple of her ponds out.
I been "carping" about air pumps for ponds over winter too and keeping a hole open.
a bunch of koi nosing up to a heater sitting in an ice hole in spring is not "koi
basking in the heat" but an indication of low oxygen levels, especially in spring.
my latest "carp" is closed systems especially tanks. set it up with the fish and
then add NO MORE. dont even shuffle fish from one tank to another. dont know why
but after even a shuffle fish start dying.
Obviously I really dont care if people flame me about my carping (or anything else
for that matter). Ingrid

"Just Me \"Koi\"" wrote:
I too use to poopoo Ingrid for her constant advice on quarantine, until
disaster struck twice ( Now I confess)


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

not really costly. I got a 150 gallon rubbermaid stock tank... but, there are all
kinds of "kiddy pools" that are collapsible and the one with the PVC frame holds 800
GALLONS!! even better. a simple gravity filter using gravel and polyester batting
cycles almost instantly. bird netting is cheap and so is an air pump. cheap plastic
of any kind and a 200 watt tank heater can bring 100-150 gallon rubbermaid up to the
84oF required. quarantine in a garage or basement is perfect. it really isnt that
big a deal. Ingrid

wrote:
It will require a considerable effort and cost for those of
us who haven't already got QT facilities to buy and install them,


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

wrote in message
...
not really costly. I got a 150 gallon rubbermaid stock tank... but, there are
all
kinds of "kiddy pools" that are collapsible and the one with the PVC frame
holds 800
GALLONS!! even better. a simple gravity filter using gravel and polyester
batting
cycles almost instantly. bird netting is cheap and so is an air pump. cheap
plastic
of any kind and a 200 watt tank heater can bring 100-150 gallon rubbermaid up
to the
84oF required. quarantine in a garage or basement is perfect. it really
isnt that
big a deal. Ingrid

I agree 100%. And it might just save your favorite fish.