We have just had our garden done. Well, when I say "garden", I
actually mean "small, Northern style yard". It used to have all
concrete that sloped and we had Pools, nay, Lakes of water in one
corner. Now it is level, has nice terracotta tiles, and a new bed plus
an enlarged one.

The new bed is on the only south-facing wall, which gets a little shade
from a tree in someone else's garden also, unfortunately. It's about a
6 foot isosceles triangle and I want to use it as my kitchen garden
(aww, how sweet!).

So, I was thinking of planting an espaliered apple tree against the
south-facing wall. Ideally I'd like to plant a vine with edible fruit,
but we live in the Morecambe Bay area, let's be realistic here. An
apple tree is probably about my speed. At least we hardly ever get
frost...

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?

Thank you, especially for bearing with me as I ask stupid questions...

Katie

wrote:
[...]
The new bed is on the only south-facing wall, which gets a little
shade from a tree in someone else's garden also, unfortunately.
It's
about a 6 foot isosceles triangle and I want to use it as my
kitchen
garden (aww, how sweet!).

So, I was thinking of planting an espaliered apple tree against the
south-facing wall. Ideally I'd like to plant a vine with edible
fruit, but we live in the Morecambe Bay area, let's be realistic
here. An apple tree is probably about my speed. At least we
hardly
ever get frost...

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?
[...]

An apple tree would be fine -- ask for recommended varieties at a
local specialist nursery. Espaliers are more work than natural forms,
by the way. But its roots wouldn't mix happily with vegetables in
such a small area.

You may find some inspiration at the Square Foot Gardening website:
http://www.squarefootgardening.com/

It's very American, but does put a new slant on container growing.

--
Mike.

On 11/11/05 17:35, in article
, "
wrote:

We have just had our garden done. Well, when I say "garden", I
actually mean "small, Northern style yard". It used to have all
concrete that sloped and we had Pools, nay, Lakes of water in one
corner. Now it is level, has nice terracotta tiles, and a new bed plus
an enlarged one.

The new bed is on the only south-facing wall, which gets a little shade
from a tree in someone else's garden also, unfortunately. It's about a
6 foot isosceles triangle and I want to use it as my kitchen garden
(aww, how sweet!).

So, I was thinking of planting an espaliered apple tree against the
south-facing wall. Ideally I'd like to plant a vine with edible fruit,
but we live in the Morecambe Bay area, let's be realistic here. An
apple tree is probably about my speed. At least we hardly ever get
frost...

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?

Thank you, especially for bearing with me as I ask stupid questions...

Funnily enough, I was finding just such an apple for someone the other day.
She asked for Kidd's Orange Red or Mother, as having particularly good
flavours. The latter is known in USA as American Mother and has an Award of
Garden Merit here, IIRC. I found them locally (S. Devon) at a place that
does mail order, however. Agroforestry, 46 Hunters Moon, Dartington,
Devon. 01803 840776, email
Of course, you may be able to find a good supplier near you, anyway and it
might be worth a Google search for a fruit tree specialist in your area. I
the plants are container grown, you can plant at any time, really but
there's not a lot to be gained from putting them into wet, cold ground for
the winter.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove the weeds to email me)

Katie wrote
We have just had our garden done. Well, when I say "garden", I
actually mean "small, Northern style yard". It used to have all
concrete that sloped and we had Pools, nay, Lakes of water in one
corner. Now it is level, has nice terracotta tiles, and a new bed plus
an enlarged one.

The new bed is on the only south-facing wall, which gets a little shade
from a tree in someone else's garden also, unfortunately. It's about a
6 foot isosceles triangle and I want to use it as my kitchen garden
(aww, how sweet!).

So, I was thinking of planting an espaliered apple tree against the
south-facing wall. Ideally I'd like to plant a vine with edible fruit,
but we live in the Morecambe Bay area, let's be realistic here. An
apple tree is probably about my speed. At least we hardly ever get
frost...

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?


Yes, it's always a good idea to use a S. facing wall for fruit growing, but
why apples? They aren't that expensive in the shops, why not a Peach or
Apricot, some of the new varieties like Apricot Tomcot grow and crop well in
the UK (especially if you don't get much frost).
Winter is the preferred time to plant any tree.
For choice look at... http://www.kenmuir.co.uk/

--
Regards
Bob
In Runnymede, 17 miles West of London

I did think some varieties of apple were self-fertile?

I would love to have something more exotic - I had an apricot when I
lived in London but my patch is much less sunny than the garden there
was - it gets a few hours of sun a day in the summer, a bit in the
winter too when the tree next door has no leaves!

If I can't put veg in the patch then I could just grow tomatoes etc. in
pots, would it be OK to have a little soft fruit in the patch? My
alpine strawberries are going strong in pots just now, and my regular
strawberries don't seem to realise it's November and have just grown
some more fruit! So it could be time to give them all a bit more space.

thanks for all the advice!

Katie

On 11/11/05 18:00, in article , "Kay"
wrote:

In article om,
writes

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?

While they're dormant, from now on.
But you need two apple trees, flowering at the same time, for fruit -
they don't self pollinate. You could risk there being a neighbour's
apple tree in flower at the same time as yours, but it's a risk. You can
get 'family trees' where more than one type of apple has been grafted on
to the same tree, but I'm not sure they're suitable for training as
espaliers.

My current favourites for taste are Cornish Aromatic, Herrings Pippin,
followed by Brownlees Russet and Allingtons Pippin, and Worcesters
straight off the tree.

Never having grown them but thinking of the OP's space, would any of the
smaller trees like 'Ballerina' - if I have that right - be a suitable choice
for her? In some gardening programme a long time ago, I seem to remember
someone advocating apple plants that were no bigger than Fuchsias, I think.
Anyone?
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove the weeds to email me)

The message
from Kay contains these words:

In article om,
writes

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?


My current favourites for taste are Cornish Aromatic, Herrings Pippin,
followed by Brownlees Russet and Allingtons Pippin, and Worcesters
straight off the tree.
--
Kay,

You've tempted me to plant yet again more apples than I really should by
this tempting list!

In particular though I have been planning to plant an apple which ripens
in early September and had wondered about either Worcester or Katy. I
had read that Katy is more vigorous and reliable and has inherited some
of its taste from its Worcester parent.
Do you by any chance have experience of both and, if so, which would you
prefer for taste - and reliablility?

Janet G

On Fri, 11 Nov 2005 09:35:22 -0800, wrote:

We have just had our garden done. Well, when I say "garden", I
actually mean "small, Northern style yard". It used to have all
concrete that sloped and we had Pools, nay, Lakes of water in one
corner. Now it is level, has nice terracotta tiles, and a new bed plus
an enlarged one.

The new bed is on the only south-facing wall, which gets a little shade
from a tree in someone else's garden also, unfortunately. It's about a
6 foot isosceles triangle and I want to use it as my kitchen garden
(aww, how sweet!).

So, I was thinking of planting an espaliered apple tree against the
south-facing wall. Ideally I'd like to plant a vine with edible fruit,
but we live in the Morecambe Bay area, let's be realistic here. An
apple tree is probably about my speed. At least we hardly ever get
frost...

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?

Thank you, especially for bearing with me as I ask stupid questions...

Katie
*********************
Wonderful to have your own apples so long as you don't do what my daughter
did and have it near a greenhouse (well she is a painful amateur) The
apples fell off the tree in the autumn and shattered lots of panes of
glass:-)
**********************

"Welsh Witch" wrote
Wonderful to have your own apples so long as you don't do what my
daughter did and have it near a greenhouse (well she is a painful
amateur) The apples fell off the tree in the autumn and shattered lots of
panes of glass:-)

Was it a 'Newton Wonder'? ;-)

--
Sue

On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 13:13:50 +0000, Sue wrote:


"Welsh Witch" wrote
Wonderful to have your own apples so long as you don't do what my
daughter did and have it near a greenhouse (well she is a painful
amateur) The apples fell off the tree in the autumn and shattered lots of
panes of glass:-)

Was it a 'Newton Wonder'? ;-)
*******************************
LOL very funny. Perhaps they should have fallen on her
head...alternatively perhaps that's what happened to get her her MA lately;-)
************************

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...

Katie wrote
We have just had our garden done. Well, when I say "garden", I
actually mean "small, Northern style yard". It used to have all
concrete that sloped and we had Pools, nay, Lakes of water in one
corner. Now it is level, has nice terracotta tiles, and a new bed plus
an enlarged one.

The new bed is on the only south-facing wall, which gets a little shade
from a tree in someone else's garden also, unfortunately. It's about a
6 foot isosceles triangle and I want to use it as my kitchen garden
(aww, how sweet!).

So, I was thinking of planting an espaliered apple tree against the
south-facing wall. Ideally I'd like to plant a vine with edible fruit,
but we live in the Morecambe Bay area, let's be realistic here. An
apple tree is probably about my speed. At least we hardly ever get
frost...

Would this be a good idea? What kinds of apple trees would be best?
When do you plant apple trees?


Yes, it's always a good idea to use a S. facing wall for fruit growing,
but why apples? They aren't that expensive in the shops,


Trouble is many of the shop apples taste more like cotton wool than apple.
They have mostly sacrificed flavour in favour of cosmetic looks / shape. In
my opinion, nothing has a better flavour than a real (pre-supermarket)
russet apple, if your area is suitable for growing them. If available, buy
on a dwarf root-stock so that it won't grow too high for a small garden.

Bevan

The message
from Welsh Witch contains these words:

LOL very funny. Perhaps they should have fallen on her
head...alternatively perhaps that's what happened to get her her MA
lately;-)

Presumably 'A' stands for 'Apple' - what does 'M' stand for?

--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article , Bevan Price
mynameATTTTfreeukDOTTTcom@?.? writes

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...


Yes, it's always a good idea to use a S. facing wall for fruit growing,
but why apples? They aren't that expensive in the shops,


Trouble is many of the shop apples taste more like cotton wool than apple.
They have mostly sacrificed flavour in favour of cosmetic looks / shape. In
my opinion, nothing has a better flavour than a real (pre-supermarket)
russet apple, if your area is suitable for growing them. If available, buy
on a dwarf root-stock so that it won't grow too high for a small garden.

And the number of varieties available in the shops is a minute fraction
of the total, and covering a very small portion of the taste spectrum.
You can get various types of sweet, crisp or juicy, and one variety of
russet if you are lucky, but not the scented or spicy flavoured ones.
--
Kay
"Do not insult the crocodile until you have crossed the river"

Having done a bit more searching and thinking, there are several apple
trees in the street (and a set of allotments about 200 yards away with
more trees - is that close enough?) and I might get a "family tree" if
that's not close enough.

However, a quick search on the RHS plant finder says that all the apple
trees need full sun - is this right? If so, I'll have a rethink... I
thought they were less fussy than e.g. apricots?


thanks all!

wrote:
[...]
However, a quick search on the RHS plant finder says that all the
apple trees need full sun - is this right? If so, I'll have a
rethink... I thought they were less fussy than e.g. apricots?

Well, less fussy than apricots, yes, when it comes to temperature and
length of ripening season. But fruit trees generally want some light
all day long. My experience with a partly-shaded apple tree (variety
unknown, but a russet of some kind) was that it didn't set fruit
well, and tended to drop most of what did set. I'd have a scout round
the neighbourhood, if possible, to see who's having success this
autumn, and consult a good local nursery if there is one.

--
Mike.