Nick Maclaren wrote:
In article .com,
La Puce wrote:
Bob Hobden wrote:

I would not expect it to get that hot, indeed you often get a
good
crop of weeds after spreading it so it's not hot enough to kill
the
weed seeds.
I know it's the biggest source of Tenanus, and also contains
E.coli
and Giardia but what others? Anyone?

Do you mean Tetanus or something else?

He means tetanus. But, in the UK, getting tetanus is rather less
likely than being hit by lightning. It wasn't once.
[...]

Funny stuff, lightning. We had regular prayers in Chapel for a
schoolmate who nearly died after catching tetanus while playing rugby
at Cardiff Arms Park. I didn't give up rugger, but I sure as Hell
think about my shots every now and then. (Actually, now I come to
think of it...)

--
Mike.

Nick Maclaren wrote:

He means tetanus. But, in the UK, getting tetanus is rather less
likely than being hit by lightning. It wasn't once.

Reassuring. My Father's second wife contracted polio as a child whilst
playing in a stream behind her house, where cattle were passing daily
(she's 50 yrs old now). The first time I heard of it as a teenager
myself, it gave me such a different outlook on life.

E. coli (except for 0157) is not a pathogen, and does not have
resistant spores - nor do I think that Giardia spores can survive
out of water. So those aren't an issue, provided that you don't
use fresh manure on sald crops just before harvest.

Who would use fresh manure on sald crops before harvesting?! Strange.
But perhaps contamination could happen if the crop is near the OM,
possibly...

Mike Lyle wrote:

Funny stuff, lightning. We had regular prayers in Chapel for a
schoolmate who nearly died after catching tetanus while playing rugby
at Cardiff Arms Park. I didn't give up rugger, but I sure as Hell
think about my shots every now and then. (Actually, now I come to
think of it...)

I'm bad with injections. I - just - don't - like - them - at - all (

Talking of rugby and very much OT: my uncle when a kid got hit by the
extremety of the rugby goal post, as the later fell down after being
hit by the ball. Isn't that just crazy?! The thing is we always asked
him why on earth you didn't run side ways when the pole fell? He kept
running in a straight line. Now he's got this soft patch on his head
with no scull. Yurk. btw, this didn't stop him becoming the finest
patissier the world has ever seen.

In article .com,
La Puce wrote:

Mike Lyle wrote:

Funny stuff, lightning. We had regular prayers in Chapel for a
schoolmate who nearly died after catching tetanus while playing rugby
at Cardiff Arms Park. I didn't give up rugger, but I sure as Hell
think about my shots every now and then. (Actually, now I come to
think of it...)

I'm bad with injections. I - just - don't - like - them - at - all (

Yes, but tetanus for UK gardeners is one that really is worth it.
My comment on lightning is accurate largely because most people who
work on the land are immunised against it - I do not know how common
it would be if that were not the case, except more so.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Rupert" wrote
OK I have googled horse poo and am now a leading expert so don't shout at
me for talking shit.

While horse manure may contain some of the pathogens discussed , they are
unlikely to exist in significant numbers to impact human health
Read all about it at:-
http://www.californiastatehorsemen.com/enviro-risk.htm


Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit than cat
poo then. :-)

--
Regards
Bob
In Runnymede, 17 miles West of London

The message
from "Bob Hobden" contains these words:


"Rupert" wrote
OK I have googled horse poo and am now a leading expert so don't shout at
me for talking shit.

While horse manure may contain some of the pathogens discussed , they are
unlikely to exist in significant numbers to impact human health
Read all about it at:-
http://www.californiastatehorsemen.com/enviro-risk.htm

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit than cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

Janet

"Janet Baraclough" wrote after "Bob Hobden" said

"Rupert" wrote
OK I have googled horse poo and am now a leading expert so don't shout
at
me for talking shit.

While horse manure may contain some of the pathogens discussed , they
are
unlikely to exist in significant numbers to impact human health
Read all about it at:-
http://www.californiastatehorsemen.com/enviro-risk.htm

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit than
cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

I think you missed the :-) Janet.

I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things, rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

But looking at the two it appears it's only Toxoplasma gondii that the cat
poo may have extra to Horse poo, indeed most of the original list posted for
cats wouldn't be in the stools of a healthy pet cat. Toxoplasma gondii is
only found in the stools of recently infected cats, a matter of a few weeks
after infection only, and not all cats get infected.
Most people who are infected don't know they are, and after an initial flue
like period won't have any problems unless their immune system is
compromised in later life or they get AIDS or similar. The problem with
pregnancy is if the mother gets Toxoplasmosis for the first time during
pregnancy, if she has an old infection there isn't a problem.
Oh, and infected people can pass it on too just like cats.

Perhaps Nick could work out the risk?
--
Regards
Bob
In Runnymede, 17 miles West of London

The message
from "Bob Hobden" contains these words:


"Janet Baraclough" wrote after "Bob Hobden" said

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit than
cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

I think you missed the :-) Janet.

No, but some other reader might. And you made a serious error.

I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things,
rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

Children playing in a garden often touch their mouths with dirty hands.

But looking at the two it appears it's only Toxoplasma gondii that the cat
poo may have extra to Horse poo, indeed most of the original list
posted for
cats wouldn't be in the stools of a healthy pet cat. Toxoplasma gondii is
only found in the stools of recently infected cats, a matter of a few weeks
after infection only, and not all cats get infected.

Playing devil's advocate with peoples' health without understanding
the issue?

.. There are two separate risks to human health from cat pooh,
toxoplasmosis and toxocariasis.

Toxoplasma gondii is a zoonose transmissible to humans by contact
with infected animals (not just cats; you can get it from handling raw
meat). It causes the flu-like disease in humans called toxoplasmosis
(AKA, "cat -scratch flu") As you say, infected cats only shed the
infection for a limited period (usually as kittens) so the risk to their
owners and family of catching TOXOPLASMOSIS from a cat is limited (and
the flu-like symptoms are not very grave except if the human is pregnant
or immunosuppressed .

http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:L...lasmosis&hl=en

But don't discount that risk as trivial.

http://www.womens-health.co.uk/toxo.asp

However, there's a separate issue. Any cat that goes outside, hunts
mice, or grooms outdoor cats. will be infected recurrently throughout
its life by roundworms in its gut. These roundworms constantly shed
millions of viable eggs in the cats faeces.The worm eggs can survive a
very long time in surrounding soil, and transfer from it to the human
gut. Then there is a risk of that person, developing TOXOCARIASIS. The
worm larva migrates through human gut to any other organ, such as the
eye, where the human body rejects the invasion by forming a cyst around
it. Immature human organs are at higher risk from developmental
obstruction by cysts, and children have gone blind as a result of
toxocariasis..

http://www.dh.gov.uk/PolicyAndGuidan...cariasis/fs/en

These are two separate disease risks from cat pooh. Neither is a
trivial issue.

Janet

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Bob Hobden" contains these words:


"Janet Baraclough" wrote after "Bob Hobden" said

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit
than
cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

I think you missed the :-) Janet.

No, but some other reader might. And you made a serious error.

I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things,
rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to
do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

Children playing in a garden often touch their mouths with dirty hands.

But looking at the two it appears it's only Toxoplasma gondii that the
cat
poo may have extra to Horse poo, indeed most of the original list
posted for
cats wouldn't be in the stools of a healthy pet cat. Toxoplasma gondii is
only found in the stools of recently infected cats, a matter of a few
weeks
after infection only, and not all cats get infected.

What about squirrels and foxes poo, how bad is that?

Alan

"Alan Holmes" wrote in message
...

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Bob Hobden" contains these words:


"Janet Baraclough" wrote after "Bob Hobden" said

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets
from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit
than
cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

I think you missed the :-) Janet.

No, but some other reader might. And you made a serious error.

I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all
this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things,
rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's
all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to
do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

Children playing in a garden often touch their mouths with dirty hands.

But looking at the two it appears it's only Toxoplasma gondii that the
cat
poo may have extra to Horse poo, indeed most of the original list
posted for
cats wouldn't be in the stools of a healthy pet cat. Toxoplasma gondii
is
only found in the stools of recently infected cats, a matter of a few
weeks
after infection only, and not all cats get infected.

What about squirrels and foxes poo, how bad is that?

Alan


Red squirrel pooh is excellent but as for grey squirrel.................

"Alan Holmes" wrote in message
...

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Bob Hobden" contains these words:


"Janet Baraclough" wrote after "Bob Hobden" said

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets
from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit
than
cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

I think you missed the :-) Janet.

No, but some other reader might. And you made a serious error.

I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all
this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things,
rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's
all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to
do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

Children playing in a garden often touch their mouths with dirty hands.

But looking at the two it appears it's only Toxoplasma gondii that the
cat
poo may have extra to Horse poo, indeed most of the original list
posted for
cats wouldn't be in the stools of a healthy pet cat. Toxoplasma gondii
is
only found in the stools of recently infected cats, a matter of a few
weeks
after infection only, and not all cats get infected.

What about squirrels and foxes poo, how bad is that?

Alan


There is a limit to how much googling one can do on the pooh subject.
It would appear that all animal pooh has some danger but the biggest cause
for concern appears to be the danger of slipping on bird pooh in the street.

"Janet Baraclough" wrote after "Bob Hobden" said

Be wary when reading USA animal health articles..the USA contains
very different animal diseases and zoonoses ( for that reason vets from
the UK have to do considerable additional study before they can work
there). So not all the advice would be appropriate to UK conditions.

Excellent article, thank you. No more to worry about in Horse shit
than
cat
poo then. :-)

It's the other way round. Cat pooh is riskier to human health than
horse pooh (especially, for children and pregnant women).

I think you missed the :-) Janet.

No, but some other reader might. And you made a serious error.

A serious error? Where?


I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things,
rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to
do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

Children playing in a garden often touch their mouths with dirty hands.

But looking at the two it appears it's only Toxoplasma gondii that the
cat
poo may have extra to Horse poo, indeed most of the original list
posted for
cats wouldn't be in the stools of a healthy pet cat. Toxoplasma gondii is
only found in the stools of recently infected cats, a matter of a few
weeks
after infection only, and not all cats get infected.

Playing devil's advocate with peoples' health without understanding
the issue?

To assume = to make an ass of u and me

My point is that the risk to health is slight, a lot less than being
injured or killed on the roads.


. There are two separate risks to human health from cat pooh,
toxoplasmosis and toxocariasis.

The latter wasn't mentioned by Mel and I wasn't about to bring it up as she
seems concerned enough already and most cat owners will worm their hunting
cats on a regular basis in order to reduce the risk of all worms anyway. We
were specifically talking about cats too and that isn't the main source of
infection.

It's not only from cat poo (T. cati) that this infection comes as dogs poo
contains T canis. Indeed the biggest problem of the two by far is dog poo,
especially puppy poo where they have become infected through their mothers
milk and after 3 or 4 weeks shed loads of the parasite eggs into the
environment, and it's from the environment (Park, garden, footpath etc) that
people and children pick up the infection as it needs time in the soil to
develop.
Again, as it's not a human parasite, for most people there will be little
sign of infection and the immune system will deal with the problem idc.
Children are more at risk of developing illness it's true and if they do go
on to get the eye problems then it's serious.

((snip))

These are two separate disease risks from cat pooh. Neither is a
trivial issue.

Not trivial but a small risk and therefore not anything to panic about
either.

--
Regards
Bob
In Runnymede, 17 miles West of London

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
Snip

These are two separate disease risks from cat pooh. Neither is a
trivial issue.

Janet

At a guess there must be more than two diseases or infections carried by cat
pooh or any other faeces.
In reality the risk of direct infection from animal faeces is small compared
to contracting the same diseases by other methods.
But -Yes I do agree that when and if you contract one of the diseases, under
discussion, the consequences may not always be trivial.
I shall continue to kiss my cats and let them sleep with me but perhaps I
may be more cautious when they have been licking their bums.

Bob Hobden wrote:

(snip)

I have played the Devils Advocate here because I'm so bored with all this
hysterical worry about cat poo when there are so many other things,
rat pee,
migrating birds poo, fox poo, hedgehog poo......to panic about. It's all
down to hygiene, wash your hands, wash your food and train your kids to
do
the same as we were trained, and there isn't a problem.

(snip)

I don't eat beef because of BSG
I don't eat chicken because of chicken flu
I don't eat fish because of mercury
I don't eat salades because of nitrates
I don't eat veal because of hormones
I don't eat vegetables because of GMO
I don't drink water because of lead ...

..... actually I do eat all the above, but sometimes I'm wondering what
else they are going to find.

In article .com,
"La Puce" writes:
|
| I don't eat beef because of BSG
| I don't eat chicken because of chicken flu
| I don't eat fish because of mercury
| I don't eat salades because of nitrates
| I don't eat veal because of hormones
| I don't eat vegetables because of GMO
| I don't drink water because of lead ...

http://www.bartleby.com/101/49.html


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.