It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
they are mature the first frost will kill them,
I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries

Dave Hill wrote:
: It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
: frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
: they are mature the first frost will kill them,
: I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.
:
: David Hill
: Abacus Nurseries

Not to mention rhubarb which amazes me for precisely the same reason

On 21 Mar, 18:02, "Dave Hill" wrote:
It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
they are mature the first frost will kill them,
I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries

This is something I noticed many years ago. Now I'm retired and back
to being an amateur gardener with no greenhouse I'm experimenting a
lot this year with rapid hardening off of barely germinated seedlings
and so far it's working quite well with January sown cabbages & caulis
and Sweet peas (the sweet peas and broad beans would have been done in
autumn if I'd had the plot at that time; Feb sown peas, lettuce,
spring onions, broad beans etc. This observation of David's is the
reason why autumn sown broad beans are better sown in November than in
September or October The new head gardener here is scaling down the
vegetable production so I've 'inherited' for my own use one of the veg
plots I used to cultivate at work, now to all intents and purposes I'm
an amateur allotmenteer, which is where I came in some fifty years
ago ;-)

In message .com, Dave
Hill writes
It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
they are mature the first frost will kill them,
I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries


If you'll pardon an "evolutionary just-so story", this seems quite
readily explainable. If we consider annual plants, if they grow in an
environment where frosts are regular occurrences then seedlings which
are not frost tolerant are going to be strongly selected against. At the
other end of the season, frost sensitivity is not so strongly selected
against (say a loss of 10% potential seed production, rather than 100%).
As frost resistance has metabolic costs it may well be that frost
resistance is beneficial to seedlings, but not to adult plants, as
frost-sensitive plants may outcompete by producing a heavier crop of
seeds before the frosts arrive.

I've noticed that with some pauciennial plants that they are more frost
hardy in their first winter than in their second winter, sometimes
behaving a biennials (except for a light seed crop in the first year),
or that their hardiness in their first winter depends on whether they
flower in their first summer.
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

On 21/3/07 19:00, in article
, "Rod"
wrote:

On 21 Mar, 18:02, "Dave Hill" wrote:
It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
they are mature the first frost will kill them,
I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries

This is something I noticed many years ago. Now I'm retired and back
to being an amateur gardener with no greenhouse I'm experimenting a
lot this year with rapid hardening off of barely germinated seedlings
and so far it's working quite well with January sown cabbages & caulis
and Sweet peas (the sweet peas and broad beans would have been done in
autumn if I'd had the plot at that time; Feb sown peas, lettuce,
spring onions, broad beans etc. This observation of David's is the
reason why autumn sown broad beans are better sown in November than in
September or October The new head gardener here is scaling down the
vegetable production so I've 'inherited' for my own use one of the veg
plots I used to cultivate at work, now to all intents and purposes I'm
an amateur allotmenteer, which is where I came in some fifty years
ago ;-)

Interesting, Rod, or frustrating or a bit of both, I wonder? Hope all goes
well.
--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
http://www.discoverdartmoor.co.uk/
(remove weeds from address)

"Dave Hill" wrote in message
oups.com...
It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
they are mature the first frost will kill them,
I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries

It's presumably a biochemical response - not one I'd thought of before - so
thank you for giving me something else to ponder over :-)
It would appear than in spring, the cold response is to strengthen and slow
growth, while in autumn, the same stimuli promotes decay. I'm sure research
has been done on trees in the autumn to see what prompts leaf drop - i.e.
which set of chemicals.
Very interesting......
Chris S

On 22 Mar, 00:47, "Chris S"
wrote:
"Dave Hill" wrote in message

oups.com... It has always struck me as strange that some young plants can take
frost, snow etc when only just emerged from the ground, whilst when
they are mature the first frost will kill them,
I am thinking of plants like sweet peas.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries

It's presumably a biochemical response - not one I'd thought of before - so
thank you for giving me something else to ponder over :-)
It would appear than in spring, the cold response is to strengthen and slow
growth, while in autumn, the same stimuli promotes decay. I'm sure research
has been done on trees in the autumn to see what prompts leaf drop - i.e.
which set of chemicals.
Very interesting......
Chris S

The chemistry of leaf drop has been well researched but don't take it
for granted that all aspects of plant metabolism have been well
studied. Far from it, our understanding of plants is still very
sketchy compared with that of animals. Frinstance it's a fairly recent
finding that plants give off a small but measurable amounts of
methane. Why wasn't this discovered long ago? Because no one dreamt
that this could happen so nobody looked - simple as that. The amount
involved is not significant in global warming so please don't stop
planting things.