Hi all,

Would right now be a good time to buy and plant an Acer Palmatum? Something like a 'Sango-kaku'?

If yes, i'll get off the garden centre to get one as i really like them.

Also, any tips about planting them? ie anything special i should do in the hole?

Many thanks

Mick
Sheffield

On Mon, 1 Oct 2007 08:34:03 +0100
Zarch wrote:


Hi all,

Would right now be a good time to buy and plant an Acer Palmatum?
Something like a 'Sango-kaku'?


Buy, yes. Plant, no. Wait until the tree is dormant. If you have any
questions about winter drainage at all, wait until spring. If the roots
stay wet over winter, there is every chance it will die.

If yes, i'll get off the garden centre to get one as i really like
them.

Get the largest plant you can afford (within reason), the older the graft the more
chance it will have to take. Also consider getting Eddisbury or Beni kawa. They
both have the red bark of Sango kaku but are much less tricky to grow. Both
have less problems with wet, Eddisbury takes sun better and Beni kawa leafs out
a couple of weeks later, which is convenient if you're in a frost pocket. All three
can be grown in full sun, but will take a few years to establish.


Also, any tips about planting them? ie anything special i should do in
the hole?


You know it won't grow in chalk. Otherwise not too picky about soil, although
prefers slightly acidic. Don't use much soil amendment in heavy soil, it causes
drainage problems. If you're in heavy clay, the best bet is to build up on top of
the soil, if you want to keep the tree small (bear in mind Sango kaku is a 12 foot
tree). Otherwise you can certainly grow A. palmatum in clay, but very tough
to establish.

Don't fertilize beyond a little bone meal, you can do a little osmocote the second year.

Good luck. Even experienced maple growers kill scads of these (and
Sango kaku is pretty tricky) so "If at first you don't succeed..."

-E
--
Emery Davis
You can reply to ecom
by removing the well known companies
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Emery,

Thank you very much for taking the time to post such a detailed reply. I will get upto the garden centre and see what they have.

Many thanks

Mick

Emery,

I've been round 3 garden centres this morning and have been slightly disappointed with the selection of Acers available. Maybe its just the time of year?

Three types took my eye though.

Firstly, Orange Dream, it is possible to get quite an established plant for around 30 pounds. THe do seem very much similar to sango kaku that i had previously, with the small petite looking leaves.

Secondly, the Shin Deshojo, which was very striking red, but only smaller plants were available for 18 pounds.

And finally i saw a Osakazuki. And for 28 pounds i can get the following plant. (see pic). It looks very well established and have a very nice wide spread to it (whereas the orange dreams seem very tall and compact).

Is there any good and bad points you can tell me about the Orange Dream or Osakazuki? On the info label for the Osakazuki it says it doesn't appreciate pruning, is it just a case of letting it develop how it pleases?

if there is nothing to be to concerned about, i think might go back and get the plant in the picture, because it did look particularly grand!

http:\\zarch.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk\acer.jpg

Many thanks again

Mick

In message , Emery Davis
writes
You know it won't grow in chalk. Otherwise not too picky about soil,
although prefers slightly acidic. Don't use much soil amendment in
heavy soil, it causes drainage problems. If you're in heavy clay, the
best bet is to build up on top of the soil, if you want to keep the
tree small (bear in mind Sango kaku is a 12 foot tree). Otherwise you
can certainly grow A. palmatum in clay, but very tough to establish.

Don't fertilize beyond a little bone meal, you can do a little osmocote
the second year.

Good luck. Even experienced maple growers kill scads of these (and
Sango kaku is pretty tricky) so "If at first you don't succeed..."

-E

We were given one for our coral anniversary a couple of years ago, and
in our ignorance have been really successful with it - so far. But I
have just gone out to have a closer look, and most of the bark has been
stripped from it at a level that makes me suspect our cat! Any ideas how
I can bandage it to help it to heal and at the same time keep the cat
from further damaging it?

--
Klara, Gatwick basin

In article , Klara
wrote:

In message , Emery Davis
writes
You know it won't grow in chalk. Otherwise not too picky about soil,
although prefers slightly acidic. Don't use much soil amendment in
heavy soil, it causes drainage problems. If you're in heavy clay, the
best bet is to build up on top of the soil, if you want to keep the
tree small (bear in mind Sango kaku is a 12 foot tree). Otherwise you
can certainly grow A. palmatum in clay, but very tough to establish.

Don't fertilize beyond a little bone meal, you can do a little osmocote
the second year.

Good luck. Even experienced maple growers kill scads of these (and
Sango kaku is pretty tricky) so "If at first you don't succeed..."

We were given one for our coral anniversary a couple of years ago, and
in our ignorance have been really successful with it - so far. But I
have just gone out to have a closer look, and most of the bark has been
stripped from it at a level that makes me suspect our cat! Any ideas how
I can bandage it to help it to heal and at the same time keep the cat
from further damaging it?

Rabbits love sweet young bark and have been the certain cause of young
saplings of mine being stripped back to bare wood from approx 18in high
down to ground level. A low coil of chicken wire should provide
protection.

In message , Stan The Man
writes
We were given one for our coral anniversary a couple of years ago, and
in our ignorance have been really successful with it - so far. But I
have just gone out to have a closer look, and most of the bark has been
stripped from it at a level that makes me suspect our cat! Any ideas how
I can bandage it to help it to heal and at the same time keep the cat
from further damaging it?

Rabbits love sweet young bark and have been the certain cause of young
saplings of mine being stripped back to bare wood from approx 18in high
down to ground level. A low coil of chicken wire should provide
protection.

It was at around 18 inches, so I discounted rabbits ... also, we have
lots of foxes and haven't seen rabbits in a long time. But there are
deer and badgers.... In any case, the chicken wire idea should work on
whatever it is - thanks!

Should I paint the trunk with something in the hope that it will protect
the tree from infection, given that quite a bit of bark is missing?

Thanks!

--
Klara, Gatwick basin

In article , Klara
wrote:

In message , Stan The Man
writes
We were given one for our coral anniversary a couple of years ago, and
in our ignorance have been really successful with it - so far. But I
have just gone out to have a closer look, and most of the bark has been
stripped from it at a level that makes me suspect our cat! Any ideas how
I can bandage it to help it to heal and at the same time keep the cat
from further damaging it?

Rabbits love sweet young bark and have been the certain cause of young
saplings of mine being stripped back to bare wood from approx 18in high
down to ground level. A low coil of chicken wire should provide
protection.

It was at around 18 inches, so I discounted rabbits ... also, we have
lots of foxes and haven't seen rabbits in a long time. But there are
deer and badgers.... In any case, the chicken wire idea should work on
whatever it is - thanks!

Should I paint the trunk with something in the hope that it will protect
the tree from infection, given that quite a bit of bark is missing?

If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

I've always wondered about that. Is the explanation that it's not
actually the bark itself that carries the sap up the tree but the very
thin layer just inside it (phloem????), and which is destroyed in most
trees when you remove the bark. But on a cork oak the bark is so thick
you can remove the bark without removing that layer? Or is the layer
also thicker on a cork oak?
--
Kay

In article ,
wrote:


If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

I've always wondered about that. Is the explanation that it's not
actually the bark itself that carries the sap up the tree but the very
thin layer just inside it (phloem????), and which is destroyed in most
trees when you remove the bark. But on a cork oak the bark is so thick
you can remove the bark without removing that layer? Or is the layer
also thicker on a cork oak?

I believe that cork is harvested from the outer layer of the bark but
the more likely reason for the tree's survival and bark regeneration is
that the bark is stripped in a spiral and so the stripping never
completes the fatal circle.

In message , Stan The Man
writes
Should I paint the trunk with something in the hope that it will protect
the tree from infection, given that quite a bit of bark is missing?

If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

It is stripped the way something with claws would do it, and actually
mostly on one side, so there is a bit that is still intact. Is there
some sort of first aid I can apply, to try to salvage it? (It's a lovely
little tree, and, of course, an anniversary gift from our three
daughters....)

There is a lot of new growth from below that point, but that would turn
more into something like a bush....
--
Klara, Gatwick basin

On 11/10/07 08:40, in article ,
"Klara" wrote:

In message , Stan The Man
writes
Should I paint the trunk with something in the hope that it will protect
the tree from infection, given that quite a bit of bark is missing?

If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

It is stripped the way something with claws would do it, and actually
mostly on one side, so there is a bit that is still intact. Is there
some sort of first aid I can apply, to try to salvage it? (It's a lovely
little tree, and, of course, an anniversary gift from our three
daughters....)

There is a lot of new growth from below that point, but that would turn
more into something like a bush....

I'd still keep the new growth and I'd invest in one of those spiral plastic
tree guards, too.
--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove weeds from address)
'We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our
children.'

To the original poster:

The smaller the tree is when you plant it, the better it will establish and grow on. Most potted trees in garden centres are pot-bound - their roots are going round in circles in too small a container. You can tease out the roots to a degree but it's never quite the same.

If the tree is bare-rooted, it has lost a good proportion of its roots when removed from the soil. The smaller the tree, the less proportion it has lost. Commercial forestry nurseries, for example, undercut their seedlings in situ to encourage new growth of feeding roots at the expense of support roots. This means the seedling will feed itself well when planted out but it has to be small enough not to be blown over.

It is rare to get a really good tree at the normal garden centre. It's usually best to hunt out a specialist in the trees you are after.

Hope this helps.

In article , Klara
wrote:

In message , Stan The Man
writes
Should I paint the trunk with something in the hope that it will protect
the tree from infection, given that quite a bit of bark is missing?

If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

It is stripped the way something with claws would do it, and actually
mostly on one side, so there is a bit that is still intact. Is there
some sort of first aid I can apply, to try to salvage it? (It's a lovely
little tree, and, of course, an anniversary gift from our three
daughters....)

There is a lot of new growth from below that point, but that would turn
more into something like a bush....

You could try something like Prune & Seal - see
http://www.growingsuccess.org.uk/det...eal&cat=Garden
_Care - but I wouldn't be optimistic.

Squirrels like to strip bark too.

Stan The Man writes
In article ,
wrote:


If the full circumference is stripped I fear you will lose the tree as
the sap won't be able to travel up to the leaves. In any event it is
likely that there will be no new growth above the stripped bark albeit
you may get some new growth at ground level. Cork trees seem to cope
well when their bark is stripped/harvested but they are an exception.

I've always wondered about that. Is the explanation that it's not
actually the bark itself that carries the sap up the tree but the very
thin layer just inside it (phloem????), and which is destroyed in most
trees when you remove the bark. But on a cork oak the bark is so thick
you can remove the bark without removing that layer? Or is the layer
also thicker on a cork oak?

I believe that cork is harvested from the outer layer of the bark but
the more likely reason for the tree's survival and bark regeneration is
that the bark is stripped in a spiral and so the stripping never
completes the fatal circle.

That method of cutting doesn't tie up with what I've observed in
Portugal, which is that the circumference is completely stripped and the
removed pieces of bark form a cylinder with vertical cut, with no
indication that the cut edges don't match up perfectly.

Googling suggests you're right in that it's only the outer layer, eg:

(from http://www.killerplants.com/weird-plants/20040101.asp)

"Cork oaks produce a unique bark. Phloem and xylem derive from the
cambium, a thin cylinder of actively dividing cells in the trunk and
branches. Phloem tissue is created to the outside of the cambium; xylem
to the inside.

As the tree grows in diameter, xylem becomes wood; phloem becomes bark.
In the cork oak, the cambium is called the "mother of cork".

Unlike most trees that shed the outermost layers of bark, the cork oak
retains its bark. The bark is insulating--it protects the living cambium
from heat. The bark is lightweight, crossed by lenticels or pores that
allow the exchange of gases between the living cells and the atmosphere.
The bark is fire-resistant; the outer layers will char, but not burn,
during a wildfire."

.... in other words, it's as if a birch tree, say, didn't shed all those
lovely sheets of paper and instead stacked them up until we harvested
them in one go several years later.

--
Kay