On 31/07/17 14:59, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 31 Jul 2017 12:48:03 +0100, Tim Watts
wrote:

Hi,

It might seem like a silly question, but is there *any* likelihood of
one of these:

http://www.hotbincomposting.com/

catching fire of its own volition?


This affects whether I site it with my dalek bins under a low hanging
western red cedar tree whose foliage is likely flammable, or whether I
put it over by the fence (OK, the fence gets it, but fire won't spread
or get out of control).

I guess it depends on how risk averse you are. Compost bins do catch
fire, apparently http://tinyurl.com/yao4xyrt


Very risk adverse *if* the outcome is *bad*


Yeah - I found those two as well...

Interestingly, one was a bin and one was more of a pile albeit with
cover. Only one actually trashed the house.


It seems to be a problem that afflicts the massive piles at council
recycling places - there's even UK Gov H&S guidance on that.


I read somewhere that the spontaneous fires start due to a 2 way process:

1) Biological activity takes the pile to 80C - this is self regulating
as any hotter and the agents die off.

2) Chemical oxidation takes over at 80C and can start a fire - not being
self regulating.


From what I can see, 2 requires as fairly specific set of conditions:
dry materials (which may have been dried by stage 1), the right sort of
materials, lack of air flow and uneven mixing.


As usual one of your links says something like:

Put away from fences, buildings and in the shade.

Which would be impossible in most gardens - who's going to put it in the
middle of the lawn?


And there are 2 stories of domestic piles going up in the UK as far as I
can see, from the 100,000s or more compost piles and bins there must be
in use.


OK - by the fence seems to be the best idea - it's near the front road
so if it does go up and I'm away, someone will notice and I cannot see a
wooden fence managing to burn down its length to the shed 10m away - if
nothing else, the fire would probably block at the concrete fence posts.

On 2017-07-31 14:49:41 +0000, Tim Watts said:

On 31/07/17 14:59, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 31 Jul 2017 12:48:03 +0100, Tim Watts
wrote:

Hi,

It might seem like a silly question, but is there *any* likelihood of
one of these:

http://www.hotbincomposting.com/

catching fire of its own volition?


This affects whether I site it with my dalek bins under a low hanging
western red cedar tree whose foliage is likely flammable, or whether I
put it over by the fence (OK, the fence gets it, but fire won't spread
or get out of control).

I guess it depends on how risk averse you are. Compost bins do catch
fire, apparently http://tinyurl.com/yao4xyrt


Very risk adverse *if* the outcome is *bad*


Yeah - I found those two as well...

Interestingly, one was a bin and one was more of a pile albeit with
cover. Only one actually trashed the house.


It seems to be a problem that afflicts the massive piles at council
recycling places - there's even UK Gov H&S guidance on that.


I read somewhere that the spontaneous fires start due to a 2 way process:

1) Biological activity takes the pile to 80C - this is self regulating
as any hotter and the agents die off.

2) Chemical oxidation takes over at 80C and can start a fire - not
being self regulating.


From what I can see, 2 requires as fairly specific set of conditions:
dry materials (which may have been dried by stage 1), the right sort of
materials, lack of air flow and uneven mixing.


As usual one of your links says something like:

Put away from fences, buildings and in the shade.

Which would be impossible in most gardens - who's going to put it in
the middle of the lawn?


And there are 2 stories of domestic piles going up in the UK as far as
I can see, from the 100,000s or more compost piles and bins there must
be in use.


OK - by the fence seems to be the best idea - it's near the front road
so if it does go up and I'm away, someone will notice and I cannot see
a wooden fence managing to burn down its length to the shed 10m away -
if nothing else, the fire would probably block at the concrete fence
posts.

http://www.fireproofspray.co.uk/flam...rdant-68-p.asp


I make no recommendation having never used it or anything like it,
perhaps because our garden has granite walls.

--
Asha
minnies.opcop.org.uk
nature.opcop.org.uk
pictures.opcop.org.uk

On 31/07/17 17:03, Asha Santon wrote:

I make no recommendation having never used it or anything like it,
perhaps because our garden has granite walls.


Thanks - I might use that on my workshop build

I have found a location next to a path (convenient) down the crappy side
of the garden fairly clear of overhanging trees etc.

The main interest in a hot bin is can cannot get rid of law trimmings
fast enough. My 2 daleks are slow, but do make nice compost.

Clippings are going in an old pond right now, but I need that to rot
clear in a couple of years to fill in, so ought to stop putting junk in
it

I also have a chipper (Bosch) which means I have a supply of wood
chippings too to feed the compost, as well as grass and kitchen waste.

On 31/07/2017 17:12, Tim Watts wrote:
On 31/07/17 17:03, Asha Santon wrote:

I make no recommendation having never used it or anything like it,
perhaps because our garden has granite walls.


Thanks - I might use that on my workshop build

I have found a location next to a path (convenient) down the crappy side
of the garden fairly clear of overhanging trees etc.

The main interest in a hot bin is can cannot get rid of law trimmings
fast enough. My 2 daleks are slow, but do make nice compost.

Clippings are going in an old pond right now, but I need that to rot
clear in a couple of years to fill in, so ought to stop putting junk in
it

I also have a chipper (Bosch) which means I have a supply of wood
chippings too to feed the compost, as well as grass and kitchen waste.

How big is your lawn? I fully filled/packed an empty dalek bin with 90%
grass clippings and 10% light weight woody stems last Friday and now on
Monday they have compressed to less than a third of the volume and in
this hottish weather are currently steaming. The clippings went in
fairly damp.

I suspect the claims for the hot bin may be only valid for a full load
of material put into the bin at the same time and not drip fed with
small amounts a bit at a time.


--
mailto: news {at} admac {dot] myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 31/07/2017 17:19, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:12:47 +0100, Tim Watts
wrote:

On 31/07/17 17:03, Asha Santon wrote:

I make no recommendation having never used it or anything like it,
perhaps because our garden has granite walls.


Thanks - I might use that on my workshop build

I have found a location next to a path (convenient) down the crappy side
of the garden fairly clear of overhanging trees etc.

The main interest in a hot bin is can cannot get rid of law trimmings
fast enough. My 2 daleks are slow, but do make nice compost.

Clippings are going in an old pond right now, but I need that to rot
clear in a couple of years to fill in, so ought to stop putting junk in
it

I also have a chipper (Bosch) which means I have a supply of wood
chippings too to feed the compost, as well as grass and kitchen waste.

I should be interested to hear if lawn clippings compost in this thing
as well as they claim for other stuff. IME they are the most resistant
of garden waste to compost, apart from twiggy stuff, and take many
months in a cold open heap, only really disappearing when the heap is
eventually turned from one bay to the next.

I confess to being a little mystified that people have trouble getting
lawn clippings to go. Mine go very quickly indeed provided that I don't
compact them - peak temperature is reached in about three days. I'm
adding about 1m^3 at a time and they are mostly gone within a fortnight.

I think it is all a matter of scale. Once you have enough of them in one
place the interior will get mad hot and off they go. Pongs a bit but it
isn't an unpleasant smell. My recollection from my parents small garden
was that grass cuttings on a cold heap often went slimy and anaerobic.

I did originally seed my compost heaps with Garotta (sp?) which may have
made a difference and might help get a smaller heap going well and hot.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 08/08/2017 12:56, Martin Brown wrote:

I confess to being a little mystified that people have trouble getting
lawn clippings to go. Mine go very quickly indeed provided that I don't
compact them - peak temperature is reached in about three days. I'm
adding about 1m^3 at a time and they are mostly gone within a fortnight.

I think it is all a matter of scale.

I find that it helps if the clippings are added as soon as they are cut
and not left to dry out on the lawn before collection. With a petrol
mower I can cut the grass when it is damp and tend to get better
composting results when the moisture content is medium to high.

To get a compost heap/bin hot, even during the summer, it does take a
minimum quantity of composting material added at the same time. Even in
the videos for the Insulated Hotbin they state that the claimed results
are only achievable with the with a minimum fill with new material.

I have a plastic dustbin in which I store torn up cardboard, paper
shreddings and small amount of kitchen waste and the collateral damage
from weeding. When I cut my lawn I get around 4 collection baskets of
clippings or at the end of growing seasons when I get a large amount of
plant material I add a couple of buckets of water to the dustbin with
the card etc. and thoroughly mix the contents with the grass clippings
or green material when filling/topping up a bin. I also add a small
amount of fully or partially composted material from one of my other
bins. This usually rots down fast in the summer months.

If you have a bin that has 'stalled' the next time you have a large
quantity of grass clippings of fresh green material mix the contents of
the old bin with the new material. This may/will get you above the
critical mass and probably result in faster composting.

A tip for tearing up large cardboard boxes is to flatten them down and
leave them outside until after a period of rain. Wet card tears easily
and parcel tape etc. is easily removed. Just watch out for boxes that
have a shiny fully printed images. The shiny bit could be a plastic
layer but again can often be pealed off easily if the under-laying card
is fully soaked.

My recollection from my parents small garden
was that grass cuttings on a cold heap often went slimy and anaerobic.

But once there is enough materials tuning it over and re-mixing with
woody material or torn up cardboard will get it started.


I did originally seed my compost heaps with Garotta (sp?) which may have
made a difference and might help get a smaller heap going well and hot.


Just add a bucket of urine or if you have some privacy just pee on your
heap.

--
mailto: news {at} admac {dot] myzen {dot} co {dot} uk