On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 11:52:17 GMT, Mike Fitzpatrick wrote:

My wife planted in large pots last autumn a load of Freesia bulbs. this year
we have had a fantastic display,cut and taken indoors for vases. What is the
procedure to get the same show next year? do I leave them in the pots and
over winter them in the greenhouse or leave them out. Any advise please will
be gratefully accepted.

An elderly gentleman, a gardener all his working life, now long
dead, told me years ago to grow new freesias from seed every
year. He overwintered his in a sheltered coldframe that he
covered with matting during spells of sub-freezing weather.


--
Rodger Whitlock
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
[change "atlantic" to "pacific" and
"invalid" to "net" to reply by email]

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 17:06:20 GMT, lid
(Rodger Whitlock) wrote:

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 11:52:17 GMT, Mike Fitzpatrick wrote:

My wife planted in large pots last autumn a load of Freesia bulbs. this year
we have had a fantastic display,cut and taken indoors for vases. What is the
procedure to get the same show next year? do I leave them in the pots and
over winter them in the greenhouse or leave them out. Any advise please will
be gratefully accepted.

An elderly gentleman, a gardener all his working life, now long
dead, told me years ago to grow new freesias from seed every
year. He overwintered his in a sheltered coldframe that he
covered with matting during spells of sub-freezing weather.

Years ago I used to keep my freesias going year after year, IIRC by
letting the pots dry out in the greenhouse (frost free) in autumn,
then re-potting all the bulbs and offsets in fresh compost next year
to get them growing again. The numbers increased steadily, BUT over
two or three years, all the reds, purples etc died out, and all I had
left were yellows.

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?


--
Chris

E-mail: christopher[dot]hogg[at]virgin[dot]net

On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

--
Rodger Whitlock
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
[change "atlantic" to "pacific" and
"invalid" to "net" to reply by email]

lid (Rodger Whitlock) wrote in message ...
On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

That's interesting: I've often wondered about the Great Musk Mystery.
I find it absolutely fascinating that a characteristic in a particular
clone should just have "timed-out" like that. I didn't know they'd
been out looking for it, though: good for them. I bet in some old
country house there's a dried-up pot of musk left lurking since 1880
which could provide scientists with the right bit of DNA for a
Jurassic-Park-style reconstruction!

My own bugbear (or annoying hobby-horse) is sweet peas. How can it be
legal to sell "sweet peas" which aren't sweet?

I suppose that could be one area where I might be easy to bring over
to non-medical uses of GM technology!

Mike.

"Mike Lyle" wrote in message
om...
lid (Rodger Whitlock) wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

That's interesting: I've often wondered about the Great Musk Mystery.
I find it absolutely fascinating that a characteristic in a particular
clone should just have "timed-out" like that. I didn't know they'd
been out looking for it, though: good for them. I bet in some old
country house there's a dried-up pot of musk left lurking since 1880
which could provide scientists with the right bit of DNA for a
Jurassic-Park-style reconstruction!

My own bugbear (or annoying hobby-horse) is sweet peas. How can it be
legal to sell "sweet peas" which aren't sweet?

I suppose that could be one area where I might be easy to bring over
to non-medical uses of GM technology!

Mike.
--------------------
My server has stopped letting me see practically all questions~~~only
answers so forgive if I'm repeating others' comments.
Freesias do seem to have lost a great deal of their scent. The breeding
efforts have been restricted to providing stronger stems. The original stems
were so lax that all needed some form of support. At that time a single
freesia could be detected throughout a house~~ by those who are able to
perceive its scent at all. This is a known genetical variable. It will be a
great pity if this scent is irretrievable.
There are 'biological clocks' in the make-up of all organisms.
Sometimes the clock was set tens of thousands years ago. This would have
been the case with Musk when all plants lost scent over night.
Relatively recently many reports were received simultaneously
of a sport produced by a variety of Chrysanthemum.~ called 'Birmingham', I
believe. This was not an isolated incident~~there are many examples.
We also have our own clocks ticking away so that, to a great
extent, our destiny is predetermined~~ especially obvious now that we are
living longer so that our 'clock' can run its course.
The Canadian work with identical twins is the most revealing.
Sweet peas certainly aren't as they used to be. I originally put it
down to the recent proliferation of new varieties and my failure to obtain
the correct seed~~ perhaps this is so? If not, then the breeders have done
us no favours.
Best Wishes Brian

On Sun, 18 Jul 2004 23:23:06 +0100, "Brian" ---
'flayb' to respond wrote:


The Canadian work with identical twins is the most revealing.
Sweet peas certainly aren't as they used to be. I originally put it
down to the recent proliferation of new varieties and my failure to obtain
the correct seed~~ perhaps this is so? If not, then the breeders have done
us no favours.
Best Wishes Brian

As I said in the sweet pea thread. What you need are the old 'Eckford'
varieties (ie. pre Spencer) Google will take you to the Eckford Sweet
Pea Society who hold an annual show in Wem to celebrate Eckford's
varieties.
Rod

Weed my email address to reply.
http://website.lineone.net/~rodcraddock/index.html

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 17:06:20 GMT, lid
(Rodger Whitlock) wrote:

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 11:52:17 GMT, Mike Fitzpatrick wrote:

My wife planted in large pots last autumn a load of Freesia bulbs. this year
we have had a fantastic display,cut and taken indoors for vases. What is the
procedure to get the same show next year? do I leave them in the pots and
over winter them in the greenhouse or leave them out. Any advise please will
be gratefully accepted.

An elderly gentleman, a gardener all his working life, now long
dead, told me years ago to grow new freesias from seed every
year. He overwintered his in a sheltered coldframe that he
covered with matting during spells of sub-freezing weather.

Years ago I used to keep my freesias going year after year, IIRC by
letting the pots dry out in the greenhouse (frost free) in autumn,
then re-potting all the bulbs and offsets in fresh compost next year
to get them growing again. The numbers increased steadily, BUT over
two or three years, all the reds, purples etc died out, and all I had
left were yellows.

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?


--
Chris

E-mail: christopher[dot]hogg[at]virgin[dot]net

On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

--
Rodger Whitlock
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
[change "atlantic" to "pacific" and
"invalid" to "net" to reply by email]

lid (Rodger Whitlock) wrote in message ...
On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

That's interesting: I've often wondered about the Great Musk Mystery.
I find it absolutely fascinating that a characteristic in a particular
clone should just have "timed-out" like that. I didn't know they'd
been out looking for it, though: good for them. I bet in some old
country house there's a dried-up pot of musk left lurking since 1880
which could provide scientists with the right bit of DNA for a
Jurassic-Park-style reconstruction!

My own bugbear (or annoying hobby-horse) is sweet peas. How can it be
legal to sell "sweet peas" which aren't sweet?

I suppose that could be one area where I might be easy to bring over
to non-medical uses of GM technology!

Mike.

"Mike Lyle" wrote in message
om...
lid (Rodger Whitlock) wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

That's interesting: I've often wondered about the Great Musk Mystery.
I find it absolutely fascinating that a characteristic in a particular
clone should just have "timed-out" like that. I didn't know they'd
been out looking for it, though: good for them. I bet in some old
country house there's a dried-up pot of musk left lurking since 1880
which could provide scientists with the right bit of DNA for a
Jurassic-Park-style reconstruction!

My own bugbear (or annoying hobby-horse) is sweet peas. How can it be
legal to sell "sweet peas" which aren't sweet?

I suppose that could be one area where I might be easy to bring over
to non-medical uses of GM technology!

Mike.
--------------------
My server has stopped letting me see practically all questions~~~only
answers so forgive if I'm repeating others' comments.
Freesias do seem to have lost a great deal of their scent. The breeding
efforts have been restricted to providing stronger stems. The original stems
were so lax that all needed some form of support. At that time a single
freesia could be detected throughout a house~~ by those who are able to
perceive its scent at all. This is a known genetical variable. It will be a
great pity if this scent is irretrievable.
There are 'biological clocks' in the make-up of all organisms.
Sometimes the clock was set tens of thousands years ago. This would have
been the case with Musk when all plants lost scent over night.
Relatively recently many reports were received simultaneously
of a sport produced by a variety of Chrysanthemum.~ called 'Birmingham', I
believe. This was not an isolated incident~~there are many examples.
We also have our own clocks ticking away so that, to a great
extent, our destiny is predetermined~~ especially obvious now that we are
living longer so that our 'clock' can run its course.
The Canadian work with identical twins is the most revealing.
Sweet peas certainly aren't as they used to be. I originally put it
down to the recent proliferation of new varieties and my failure to obtain
the correct seed~~ perhaps this is so? If not, then the breeders have done
us no favours.
Best Wishes Brian

On Sun, 18 Jul 2004 23:23:06 +0100, "Brian" ---
'flayb' to respond wrote:


The Canadian work with identical twins is the most revealing.
Sweet peas certainly aren't as they used to be. I originally put it
down to the recent proliferation of new varieties and my failure to obtain
the correct seed~~ perhaps this is so? If not, then the breeders have done
us no favours.
Best Wishes Brian

As I said in the sweet pea thread. What you need are the old 'Eckford'
varieties (ie. pre Spencer) Google will take you to the Eckford Sweet
Pea Society who hold an annual show in Wem to celebrate Eckford's
varieties.
Rod

Weed my email address to reply.
http://website.lineone.net/~rodcraddock/index.html

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 17:06:20 GMT, lid
(Rodger Whitlock) wrote:

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 11:52:17 GMT, Mike Fitzpatrick wrote:

My wife planted in large pots last autumn a load of Freesia bulbs. this year
we have had a fantastic display,cut and taken indoors for vases. What is the
procedure to get the same show next year? do I leave them in the pots and
over winter them in the greenhouse or leave them out. Any advise please will
be gratefully accepted.

An elderly gentleman, a gardener all his working life, now long
dead, told me years ago to grow new freesias from seed every
year. He overwintered his in a sheltered coldframe that he
covered with matting during spells of sub-freezing weather.

Years ago I used to keep my freesias going year after year, IIRC by
letting the pots dry out in the greenhouse (frost free) in autumn,
then re-potting all the bulbs and offsets in fresh compost next year
to get them growing again. The numbers increased steadily, BUT over
two or three years, all the reds, purples etc died out, and all I had
left were yellows.

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?


--
Chris

E-mail: christopher[dot]hogg[at]virgin[dot]net

On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

--
Rodger Whitlock
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
[change "atlantic" to "pacific" and
"invalid" to "net" to reply by email]

lid (Rodger Whitlock) wrote in message ...
On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

That's interesting: I've often wondered about the Great Musk Mystery.
I find it absolutely fascinating that a characteristic in a particular
clone should just have "timed-out" like that. I didn't know they'd
been out looking for it, though: good for them. I bet in some old
country house there's a dried-up pot of musk left lurking since 1880
which could provide scientists with the right bit of DNA for a
Jurassic-Park-style reconstruction!

My own bugbear (or annoying hobby-horse) is sweet peas. How can it be
legal to sell "sweet peas" which aren't sweet?

I suppose that could be one area where I might be easy to bring over
to non-medical uses of GM technology!

Mike.

"Mike Lyle" wrote in message
om...
lid (Rodger Whitlock) wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Jul 2004 08:29:59 +0100, Chris Hogg wrote:

We were given a bunch of freesias a few months ago, but they had
absolutely no scent. Most disappointing. Is this the result of
intensive breeding to get earlier/bigger/whatever flowers?

Scent seems restricted to white and yellow freesias.

But the breeders have to take some of the blame, barring some
obscure genetic barrier to moving the scent genes into a
red/purple line.

This has been a problem for a very long time. Graham Stuart
Thomas railed about the stereotyped breeding of daylilies in the
first edition of his "Perennial Garden Plants" some thirty years
ago, pointing out that the breeders totally neglected scent as a
factor even though some species of Hemerocallis have an extremely
pleasant scent.

But you have to wonder if scent is harder to breed for? Perhaps
it depends on very few genes. The famous musk plant (Mimulus
moschatus) that lost its scent a hundred years ago may have
simply been a single aberrant plant with a once-off mutation of a
single gene. There've even been those who've combed Oregon
looking for a wild plant with the musk scent, but none has ever
been found.

That's interesting: I've often wondered about the Great Musk Mystery.
I find it absolutely fascinating that a characteristic in a particular
clone should just have "timed-out" like that. I didn't know they'd
been out looking for it, though: good for them. I bet in some old
country house there's a dried-up pot of musk left lurking since 1880
which could provide scientists with the right bit of DNA for a
Jurassic-Park-style reconstruction!

My own bugbear (or annoying hobby-horse) is sweet peas. How can it be
legal to sell "sweet peas" which aren't sweet?

I suppose that could be one area where I might be easy to bring over
to non-medical uses of GM technology!

Mike.
--------------------
My server has stopped letting me see practically all questions~~~only
answers so forgive if I'm repeating others' comments.
Freesias do seem to have lost a great deal of their scent. The breeding
efforts have been restricted to providing stronger stems. The original stems
were so lax that all needed some form of support. At that time a single
freesia could be detected throughout a house~~ by those who are able to
perceive its scent at all. This is a known genetical variable. It will be a
great pity if this scent is irretrievable.
There are 'biological clocks' in the make-up of all organisms.
Sometimes the clock was set tens of thousands years ago. This would have
been the case with Musk when all plants lost scent over night.
Relatively recently many reports were received simultaneously
of a sport produced by a variety of Chrysanthemum.~ called 'Birmingham', I
believe. This was not an isolated incident~~there are many examples.
We also have our own clocks ticking away so that, to a great
extent, our destiny is predetermined~~ especially obvious now that we are
living longer so that our 'clock' can run its course.
The Canadian work with identical twins is the most revealing.
Sweet peas certainly aren't as they used to be. I originally put it
down to the recent proliferation of new varieties and my failure to obtain
the correct seed~~ perhaps this is so? If not, then the breeders have done
us no favours.
Best Wishes Brian