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22-02-2004, 05:10 PM

Folks,
Since there seemed to be a bit of interest in making ciment fondue slabs I
posted some pics on the main gallery of slabs/mountains/scoops I made
several years ago along with some tried&true methods ( which I covered well
in my previous post). These were all made with LeFarge Ciment Fondue mix.
They are VERY sturdy. If you are thinking about giving it a try take a look
at some of the types of things I used to make and sell.
Now....I've moved on to ceramics :)
Regards,
Dale Cochoy, Wild Things Bonsai Studio, Hartville, Ohio
http://www.WildThingsBonsai.Com
Specializing in power wood carving tools.
Yakimono no Kokoro bonsai pottery of hand-built stoneware

LaFarge Ciment Fondue should be allowed to slowly cure to avoid cracking
and thereby ensure the slab's ability to endure extreme heat and cold. I
recommend spraying the slab during the first day of curing.

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

23-02-2004, 05:29 PM

23-02-2004, 05:29 PM

24-02-2004, 02:46 PM

Hi Doug.

You write RE' Ciment Fondue manufacturer irep' in Virginia:
We ship most Fondu directly from our
plant in VA in minimum pallet quantities.

This stuff is also made & used in Canada:
http://www.lafargecorp.com/cmtp cfd.htm

Here's the Virginia site for data, which notes the smallest packaging is 94
pound bags:
http://www.lcainc.com/fondu.html

.... & on Secar products, that someone mentioned:
http://www.lcainc.com/product.html

My club (in Richmond VA) purchased it with help from local bonsai
enthusiasts in Chesapeake VA (admittedly several years ago) & picked-up the
bags we needed. The Ciment Fondue is HEAVY, of course, and latex molds are
very expensive to make even you already have a good stone as a mold. If you
can borrow molds (we did), it is a godsend.

Bonsai vendors can't assume there is a market for ciment fondue because the
molds are REALLY expensive to make. Vendors also realize purchasers at
bonsai conventions often don't have the option of carting an extra 94 pound
bag of cement in their luggage. [Though I'd like to hear the story of
getting that powder through airport security... :-)...]

This isn't a project for one person creating slabs for their personal
collection.

It sounds to me that a friend might be need in Virginia Bonsai Society
(Norfolk VA-- near Chesapeake) to scope alternatives. VBS has a website
with contact information for their president Ronnie Baum
http://www.vafgs.org/virginia_bonsai_society.htm. Ronnie is a great guy!

With enough interests (and likely a prepaid order), some Ciment Fondue could
wind its way to this year's bonsai convention in St. Louis or at next year's
World Bonsai Convention in Washington DC... or to any other site someone in
the bonsai community is trucking material.

Best wishes,
Chris... C. Cochrane, , Richmond VA USA

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

24-02-2004, 03:24 PM

Hi Doug.

You write RE' Ciment Fondue manufacturer irep' in Virginia:
We ship most Fondu directly from our
plant in VA in minimum pallet quantities.

This stuff is also made & used in Canada:
http://www.lafargecorp.com/cmtp cfd.htm

Here's the Virginia site for data, which notes the smallest packaging is 94
pound bags:
http://www.lcainc.com/fondu.html

.... & on Secar products, that someone mentioned:
http://www.lcainc.com/product.html

My club (in Richmond VA) purchased it with help from local bonsai
enthusiasts in Chesapeake VA (admittedly several years ago) & picked-up the
bags we needed. The Ciment Fondue is HEAVY, of course, and latex molds are
very expensive to make even you already have a good stone as a mold. If you
can borrow molds (we did), it is a godsend.

Bonsai vendors can't assume there is a market for ciment fondue because the
molds are REALLY expensive to make. Vendors also realize purchasers at
bonsai conventions often don't have the option of carting an extra 94 pound
bag of cement in their luggage. [Though I'd like to hear the story of
getting that powder through airport security... :-)...]

This isn't a project for one person creating slabs for their personal
collection.

It sounds to me that a friend might be need in Virginia Bonsai Society
(Norfolk VA-- near Chesapeake) to scope alternatives. VBS has a website
with contact information for their president Ronnie Baum
http://www.vafgs.org/virginia_bonsai_society.htm. Ronnie is a great guy!

With enough interests (and likely a prepaid order), some Ciment Fondue could
wind its way to this year's bonsai convention in St. Louis or at next year's
World Bonsai Convention in Washington DC... or to any other site someone in
the bonsai community is trucking material.

Best wishes,
Chris... C. Cochrane, , Richmond VA USA

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

24-02-2004, 03:26 PM

Hi Doug.

You write RE' Ciment Fondue manufacturer irep' in Virginia:
We ship most Fondu directly from our
plant in VA in minimum pallet quantities.

This stuff is also made & used in Canada:
http://www.lafargecorp.com/cmtp cfd.htm

Here's the Virginia site for data, which notes the smallest packaging is 94
pound bags:
http://www.lcainc.com/fondu.html

.... & on Secar products, that someone mentioned:
http://www.lcainc.com/product.html

My club (in Richmond VA) purchased it with help from local bonsai
enthusiasts in Chesapeake VA (admittedly several years ago) & picked-up the
bags we needed. The Ciment Fondue is HEAVY, of course, and latex molds are
very expensive to make even you already have a good stone as a mold. If you
can borrow molds (we did), it is a godsend.

Bonsai vendors can't assume there is a market for ciment fondue because the
molds are REALLY expensive to make. Vendors also realize purchasers at
bonsai conventions often don't have the option of carting an extra 94 pound
bag of cement in their luggage. [Though I'd like to hear the story of
getting that powder through airport security... :-)...]

This isn't a project for one person creating slabs for their personal
collection.

It sounds to me that a friend might be need in Virginia Bonsai Society
(Norfolk VA-- near Chesapeake) to scope alternatives. VBS has a website
with contact information for their president Ronnie Baum
http://www.vafgs.org/virginia_bonsai_society.htm. Ronnie is a great guy!

With enough interests (and likely a prepaid order), some Ciment Fondue could
wind its way to this year's bonsai convention in St. Louis or at next year's
World Bonsai Convention in Washington DC... or to any other site someone in
the bonsai community is trucking material.

Best wishes,
Chris... C. Cochrane, , Richmond VA USA

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

24-02-2004, 10:31 PM

Yes ! This is where i should 'chime in' again! My slabs, while very
functional are not extremely natural looking .... they look thick, and
have the texture of a frosted cake (hard of course) ... I'm going to
try the next time with a natural slab, and put 'muck' around the
perimeter to retain soil ... NOW my question is where do i find the
clay that i'm supposed to mix with peat moss to make my muck ?

(Michael Persiano) wrote in message ...
In a message dated 2/19/2004 12:22:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, writes:

Hi Kevin. You graciously write,
Don't forget to add the magic ingredient - a
proportion of Ordinary Cement, or the rapid
set is not achieved

When my bonsai club created a ciment fondue slabs, they set for at least 24
hours. We might well have used Portland cement-- I would guess that we did.
Is there advantage to rapid-setting other than being "rapid?" Perhaps 24
hour setting is rapid though it would seem painfully slow
for curing our
thin pours.

LaFarge Ciment Fondue should be allowed to slowly cure to avoid cracking and thereby ensure the slab's ability to endure extreme heat and cold. I recommend spraying the slab during the first day of curing.

My personal opinion is that the design of the slab should be the primary concern and not the speed with which the mixture dries. Creating a credible, non-molded slab is a difficult thing to pull off.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

24-02-2004, 10:31 PM

Yes ! This is where i should 'chime in' again! My slabs, while very
functional are not extremely natural looking .... they look thick, and
have the texture of a frosted cake (hard of course) ... I'm going to
try the next time with a natural slab, and put 'muck' around the
perimeter to retain soil ... NOW my question is where do i find the
clay that i'm supposed to mix with peat moss to make my muck ?

(Michael Persiano) wrote in message ...
In a message dated 2/19/2004 12:22:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, writes:

Hi Kevin. You graciously write,
Don't forget to add the magic ingredient - a
proportion of Ordinary Cement, or the rapid
set is not achieved

When my bonsai club created a ciment fondue slabs, they set for at least 24
hours. We might well have used Portland cement-- I would guess that we did.
Is there advantage to rapid-setting other than being "rapid?" Perhaps 24
hour setting is rapid though it would seem painfully slow
for curing our
thin pours.

LaFarge Ciment Fondue should be allowed to slowly cure to avoid cracking and thereby ensure the slab's ability to endure extreme heat and cold. I recommend spraying the slab during the first day of curing.

My personal opinion is that the design of the slab should be the primary concern and not the speed with which the mixture dries. Creating a credible, non-molded slab is a difficult thing to pull off.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

24-02-2004, 11:21 PM

Yes ! This is where i should 'chime in' again! My slabs, while very
functional are not extremely natural looking .... they look thick, and
have the texture of a frosted cake (hard of course) ... I'm going to
try the next time with a natural slab, and put 'muck' around the
perimeter to retain soil ... NOW my question is where do i find the
clay that i'm supposed to mix with peat moss to make my muck ?

(Michael Persiano) wrote in message ...
In a message dated 2/19/2004 12:22:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, writes:

Hi Kevin. You graciously write,
Don't forget to add the magic ingredient - a
proportion of Ordinary Cement, or the rapid
set is not achieved

When my bonsai club created a ciment fondue slabs, they set for at least 24
hours. We might well have used Portland cement-- I would guess that we did.
Is there advantage to rapid-setting other than being "rapid?" Perhaps 24
hour setting is rapid though it would seem painfully slow
for curing our
thin pours.

LaFarge Ciment Fondue should be allowed to slowly cure to avoid cracking and thereby ensure the slab's ability to endure extreme heat and cold. I recommend spraying the slab during the first day of curing.

My personal opinion is that the design of the slab should be the primary concern and not the speed with which the mixture dries. Creating a credible, non-molded slab is a difficult thing to pull off.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

24-02-2004, 11:31 PM

Yes ! This is where i should 'chime in' again! My slabs, while very
functional are not extremely natural looking .... they look thick, and
have the texture of a frosted cake (hard of course) ... I'm going to
try the next time with a natural slab, and put 'muck' around the
perimeter to retain soil ... NOW my question is where do i find the
clay that i'm supposed to mix with peat moss to make my muck ?

(Michael Persiano) wrote in message ...
In a message dated 2/19/2004 12:22:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, writes:

Hi Kevin. You graciously write,
Don't forget to add the magic ingredient - a
proportion of Ordinary Cement, or the rapid
set is not achieved

When my bonsai club created a ciment fondue slabs, they set for at least 24
hours. We might well have used Portland cement-- I would guess that we did.
Is there advantage to rapid-setting other than being "rapid?" Perhaps 24
hour setting is rapid though it would seem painfully slow
for curing our
thin pours.

LaFarge Ciment Fondue should be allowed to slowly cure to avoid cracking and thereby ensure the slab's ability to endure extreme heat and cold. I recommend spraying the slab during the first day of curing.

My personal opinion is that the design of the slab should be the primary concern and not the speed with which the mixture dries. Creating a credible, non-molded slab is a difficult thing to pull off.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

26-02-2004, 08:34 PM

Therer are many, many recipes for Muck without using clay. If you have
time, check out the archives.

Carl L. Rosner - near Atlantic City zone 6/7
http://bmee.net/rosner
http://www.jamesbaird.com/cgi-bin/Ja...d=00000068 48
http://www.jamesbaird.com/cgi-bin/Ja...d=00000068 48

Allen wrote:

Yes ! This is where i should 'chime in' again! My slabs, while very
functional are not extremely natural looking .... they look thick, and
have the texture of a frosted cake (hard of course) ... I'm going to
try the next time with a natural slab, and put 'muck' around the
perimeter to retain soil ... NOW my question is where do i find the
clay that i'm supposed to mix with peat moss to make my muck ?

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

28-02-2004, 07:12 AM

Over here in Holland the art-schools with a sculptural division use the
Lafarge-Fondu for sculptural work.
It can therefore easily be obtained at a dealer of sculptural requisites.
Perhaps this is also the case in USA,
Worth a try I think.
Good luck,
elize

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Cochrane"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 3:14 PM
Subject: [IBC] Ciment Fondu

Hi Doug.

You write RE' Ciment Fondue manufacturer irep' in Virginia:
We ship most Fondu directly from our
plant in VA in minimum pallet quantities.

This stuff is also made & used in Canada:
http://www.lafargecorp.com/cmtp cfd.htm

Here's the Virginia site for data, which notes the smallest packaging is
94
pound bags:
http://www.lcainc.com/fondu.html

... & on Secar products, that someone mentioned:
http://www.lcainc.com/product.html

My club (in Richmond VA) purchased it with help from local bonsai
enthusiasts in Chesapeake VA (admittedly several years ago) & picked-up
the
bags we needed. The Ciment Fondue is HEAVY, of course, and latex molds
are
very expensive to make even you already have a good stone as a mold. If
you
can borrow molds (we did), it is a godsend.

Bonsai vendors can't assume there is a market for ciment fondue because
the
molds are REALLY expensive to make. Vendors also realize purchasers at
bonsai conventions often don't have the option of carting an extra 94
pound
bag of cement in their luggage. [Though I'd like to hear the story of
getting that powder through airport security... :-)...]

This isn't a project for one person creating slabs for their personal
collection.

It sounds to me that a friend might be need in Virginia Bonsai Society
(Norfolk VA-- near Chesapeake) to scope alternatives. VBS has a website
with contact information for their president Ronnie Baum
http://www.vafgs.org/virginia_bonsai_society.htm. Ronnie is a great guy!

With enough interests (and likely a prepaid order), some Ciment Fondue
could
wind its way to this year's bonsai convention in St. Louis or at next
year's
World Bonsai Convention in Washington DC... or to any other site someone
in
the bonsai community is trucking material.

Best wishes,
Chris... C. Cochrane, , Richmond VA USA

************************************************** **************************
****
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++

************************************************** **************************
****
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

01-03-2004, 06:32 PM

I was once told that Ciment Fondu is used for lining furnaces. It is gypsum
type product It has a fine cosistency, which allows it to be applied with a
paint brush. or can also be drizzled, to create mountains
Chase Rosade does have a couple slab forests on slabs of ciment Fondue I saw
them when I vsited the studio Last fall. I had some but I kept it in a damp
area and ruined it all. I obtained it all from my Bonsai club a few years
ago. I do not rememeber the name of the company that distributed it. I only
remembber that it was in Maryland

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

01-03-2004, 06:35 PM

I was once told that Ciment Fondu is used for lining furnaces. It is gypsum
type product It has a fine cosistency, which allows it to be applied with a
paint brush. or can also be drizzled, to create mountains
Chase Rosade does have a couple slab forests on slabs of ciment Fondue I saw
them when I vsited the studio Last fall. I had some but I kept it in a damp
area and ruined it all. I obtained it all from my Bonsai club a few years
ago. I do not rememeber the name of the company that distributed it. I only
remembber that it was in Maryland

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

01-03-2004, 06:35 PM

I was once told that Ciment Fondu is used for lining furnaces. It is gypsum
type product It has a fine cosistency, which allows it to be applied with a
paint brush. or can also be drizzled, to create mountains
Chase Rosade does have a couple slab forests on slabs of ciment Fondue I saw
them when I vsited the studio Last fall. I had some but I kept it in a damp
area and ruined it all. I obtained it all from my Bonsai club a few years
ago. I do not rememeber the name of the company that distributed it. I only
remembber that it was in Maryland

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

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