What is your experience with fertilizers and CO2? I am currently
experiencing algae on the glass of my tank and leaves.
I think is because water my dosing of fertilizers and CO2 is not the
correct, it is over what it should be. I use liquid CO2 and Tropical Master
GRow.
My tank is a 58G tank that has vals, differen types of swords, dwarf sag,
red ludwiga, and some other plants I can't remember there name. The light is
on for around 10-12 hrs a day.
What doses do you recommend? What can I do to save my plants and get rid of
the alage?

Thanks

mid posted

"Pedro" wrote in message
.. .
What is your experience with fertilizers and CO2? I am currently
experiencing algae on the glass of my tank and leaves.
I think is because water my dosing of fertilizers and CO2 is not the
correct, it is over what it should be. I use liquid CO2 and Tropical
Master GRow.

I can grow algae in an unfertilized tank. I've got one tank that if I don't
watch it like a hawk it will sprout every kind of algae known to man. High
nitrate, low nitrate, high PO4 low PO4 plus a few other variations all can
cause algae it the rest of the nutrients aren't right for health vigorous
growth. When I get lazy and let things get out of whack.... Actually I
never had such problems with the tank under low light conditions.

Since I'm lazy, I use the Tom Barr Estimation method with big water changes.

My tank is a 58G tank that has vals, differen types of swords, dwarf sag,
red ludwiga, and some other plants I can't remember there name. The light
is on for around 10-12 hrs a day.
What doses do you recommend? What can I do to save my plants and get rid
of the alage?

http://www.sfbaaps.com/reference/barr_02_01.shtml
http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_aquacalc.htm

As for getting rid of the algae .... probably increase your nitrates and
phosphates.
Bob

In article ,
says...
What is your experience with fertilizers and CO2? I am currently
experiencing algae on the glass of my tank and leaves.
I think is because water my dosing of fertilizers and CO2 is not the
correct, it is over what it should be. I use liquid CO2 and Tropical Master
GRow.
My tank is a 58G tank that has vals, differen types of swords, dwarf sag,
red ludwiga, and some other plants I can't remember there name. The light is
on for around 10-12 hrs a day.
What doses do you recommend? What can I do to save my plants and get rid of
the alage?

I think that you will need to do some water testing to know if your dosage is in
an appropriate range. A nitrate measurement would be a good place to start. Iron
and phosphate are also useful. The liquid CO2 (Excel ?) is hard to gauge because
you cannot infer the amount from the pH and KH as you could if you used real CO2.
If your plants are growing nicely at the recommended dose then there is no reason
to adjust it.

In another post recently, there was a link to a website that talks about the
Redfield and "buddy" ratios. The theory says that algae is least likely to grow
when the range of nitrate to phosphate is between 15 and 30. For example, at a
reasonable nitrate level of 15ppm, .5 to 1 ppm phosphate would be ideal. The site
had some more details and a handy calculator. I don't know to what degree this has
been proven, but the recommended values are easily achieved and seem appropriate
for a planted tank. Check it out he

http://www.xs4all.nl/~buddendo/aquar...dfield_eng.htm

Once you get the algae growth under control you might want to try some plant-safe,
algae eating fish. Some good choices would be the ancistrus plecostomus,
otocinculus, and siamese algae eater (_not_ "chinese"). The ancistrus is heavier
duty and can keep large panels of glass clean, while the SAE and otos will
delicately clean leaves.

I have some ottos and SAE...will see if i can get the ancintrus...
Also, I have brown/dark algae...this calculator only talks about green and
blue algae...

Will you use liquid CO2 and Tropical master grow together?


"George Pontis" wrote in message
t...
In article ,
says...
What is your experience with fertilizers and CO2? I am currently
experiencing algae on the glass of my tank and leaves.
I think is because water my dosing of fertilizers and CO2 is not the
correct, it is over what it should be. I use liquid CO2 and Tropical
Master
GRow.
My tank is a 58G tank that has vals, differen types of swords, dwarf sag,
red ludwiga, and some other plants I can't remember there name. The light
is
on for around 10-12 hrs a day.
What doses do you recommend? What can I do to save my plants and get rid
of
the alage?

I think that you will need to do some water testing to know if your dosage
is in
an appropriate range. A nitrate measurement would be a good place to
start. Iron
and phosphate are also useful. The liquid CO2 (Excel ?) is hard to gauge
because
you cannot infer the amount from the pH and KH as you could if you used
real CO2.
If your plants are growing nicely at the recommended dose then there is no
reason
to adjust it.

In another post recently, there was a link to a website that talks about
the
Redfield and "buddy" ratios. The theory says that algae is least likely to
grow
when the range of nitrate to phosphate is between 15 and 30. For example,
at a
reasonable nitrate level of 15ppm, .5 to 1 ppm phosphate would be ideal.
The site
had some more details and a handy calculator. I don't know to what degree
this has
been proven, but the recommended values are easily achieved and seem
appropriate
for a planted tank. Check it out he

http://www.xs4all.nl/~buddendo/aquar...dfield_eng.htm

Once you get the algae growth under control you might want to try some
plant-safe,
algae eating fish. Some good choices would be the ancistrus plecostomus,
otocinculus, and siamese algae eater (_not_ "chinese"). The ancistrus is
heavier
duty and can keep large panels of glass clean, while the SAE and otos will
delicately clean leaves.

"George Pontis" wrote in message
t...
In article ,
says...
What is your experience with fertilizers and CO2? I am currently
experiencing algae on the glass of my tank and leaves.
I think is because water my dosing of fertilizers and CO2 is not the
correct, it is over what it should be. I use liquid CO2 and Tropical
Master
GRow.
My tank is a 58G tank that has vals, differen types of swords, dwarf sag,
red ludwiga, and some other plants I can't remember there name. The light
is
on for around 10-12 hrs a day.
What doses do you recommend? What can I do to save my plants and get rid
of
the alage?

I think that you will need to do some water testing to know if your dosage
is in
an appropriate range. A nitrate measurement would be a good place to
start. Iron
and phosphate are also useful. The liquid CO2 (Excel ?) is hard to gauge
because
you cannot infer the amount from the pH and KH as you could if you used
real CO2.
If your plants are growing nicely at the recommended dose then there is no
reason
to adjust it.

In another post recently, there was a link to a website that talks about
the
Redfield and "buddy" ratios. The theory says that algae is least likely to
grow
when the range of nitrate to phosphate is between 15 and 30. For example,
at a
reasonable nitrate level of 15ppm, .5 to 1 ppm phosphate would be ideal.
The site
had some more details and a handy calculator. I don't know to what degree
this has
been proven, but the recommended values are easily achieved and seem
appropriate
for a planted tank. Check it out he

http://www.xs4all.nl/~buddendo/aquar...dfield_eng.htm

Once you get the algae growth under control you might want to try some
plant-safe,
algae eating fish. Some good choices would be the ancistrus plecostomus,
otocinculus, and siamese algae eater (_not_ "chinese"). The ancistrus is
heavier
duty and can keep large panels of glass clean, while the SAE and otos will
delicately clean leaves.

From the blurb sent out reminding the August Barr report is
out.....................

"In providing further in depth aquatic plant research reviews, this month's
topic is still on mineral assimilation but with a special focus on ratios of
NPK and CNP from many submersed plants to show the wide ranges as well as
the averages. While ratios in and of themselves are insignificant till they
become limiting(Liebig's law of minimums), my focus in a more general
broader sense has been the upper ranges(Shleford' law of tolerances) that
cause poor plant growth. Finding the minimum amounts needed for plant growth
is relatively easy.

But the ratios will help support the main focus.......... that high PO4 is
present in natural aquatic plants and required for good plant growth. Past
aquatic horticulture advice from books has been very poor in the back ground
in relations to the plant's needs, content and the presence of algae with
respect to Fe, PO4, NO3 and NH4.

PO4 in particular is still referenced as "bad" in terms of excess. This myth
needs to stop as it is simply untrue. I am providing more evidence here to
show this even further than merely testing alone or consensus.

Redfield ratios are often quoted in the Neathlands as cure for this or that
algae. Tomorrow someone else will come along with some other incorrect
theory and bred another batch of myths relating to ratios. As if it is some
magical nirvana that will magically cure all your woes......... Testing
these things is rather straight forward, but also having some tables of the
ratios can lend a great deal of support combat such myths and tangents that
detracts from growing the plants.

I have always held that plants grow best good within a range, this range is
wide and exploring this range is important to understand the limits we can
maintain good plant growth. Using both field data from natural systems for
aquatic plants as well as test in our tanks allows a fairly good handle of
what the plants need.

This month's report shows the ranges found, look not just at the averages,
but the entire ranges, they are not picky plants, they grow well and
dominate in a wide range of conditions.

Regards,
Tom Barr"

Regards
Bob

"Pedro" wrote in message
. ..
I have some ottos and SAE...will see if i can get the ancintrus...
Also, I have brown/dark algae...this calculator only talks about green and
blue algae...

Forget algae specific treatment .... unless you want to try chemicals and
really screw up you tank chemistry.

THINK PLANTS. Go for the sweet spot for heathy plant grow. If you do that
the plant do most of the work themselves. You can't wipe out the algae, but
you can have plants that are relatively algae free. Get your NPK, and
traces where they need to be, mechanically clean what you can. The plants
will do the rest for you.



"But if the ranges of nutrients are optimized for the plants, we really
don't need to worry that much about the algae It becomes a very
hostile place for the algae when the plants are growing vigorously.
Doesn't matter if the nutrients are there for the algae or not. Algae
still will die off. "
Tom Barr here on May 4 2002, 4:25 pm and othew places a hundred times
before and after

On my grumpier days, Tom reminds me of of a smartass kid I once knew, (I out
grew it) but even on those days I listen because when I follow his advice
it works

try searching this news group

or

http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/

or

http://www.brainyday.com/jared/aquarium/info.htm


Bob

I will get a test kit for phosphate and see what I can do...I will try to
find the sweet spot. I might need some other plants. Maybe my plant load is
low and it can not combat the algae...any suggestion of good, easy care
plants that grow fast?


"Robert Flory" wrote in message
...
"George Pontis" wrote in message
t...
In article ,
says...
What is your experience with fertilizers and CO2? I am currently
experiencing algae on the glass of my tank and leaves.
I think is because water my dosing of fertilizers and CO2 is not the
correct, it is over what it should be. I use liquid CO2 and Tropical
Master
GRow.
My tank is a 58G tank that has vals, differen types of swords, dwarf
sag,
red ludwiga, and some other plants I can't remember there name. The
light is
on for around 10-12 hrs a day.
What doses do you recommend? What can I do to save my plants and get rid
of
the alage?

I think that you will need to do some water testing to know if your
dosage is in
an appropriate range. A nitrate measurement would be a good place to
start. Iron
and phosphate are also useful. The liquid CO2 (Excel ?) is hard to gauge
because
you cannot infer the amount from the pH and KH as you could if you used
real CO2.
If your plants are growing nicely at the recommended dose then there is
no reason
to adjust it.

In another post recently, there was a link to a website that talks about
the
Redfield and "buddy" ratios. The theory says that algae is least likely
to grow
when the range of nitrate to phosphate is between 15 and 30. For example,
at a
reasonable nitrate level of 15ppm, .5 to 1 ppm phosphate would be ideal.
The site
had some more details and a handy calculator. I don't know to what degree
this has
been proven, but the recommended values are easily achieved and seem
appropriate
for a planted tank. Check it out he

http://www.xs4all.nl/~buddendo/aquar...dfield_eng.htm

Once you get the algae growth under control you might want to try some
plant-safe,
algae eating fish. Some good choices would be the ancistrus plecostomus,
otocinculus, and siamese algae eater (_not_ "chinese"). The ancistrus is
heavier
duty and can keep large panels of glass clean, while the SAE and otos
will
delicately clean leaves.

From the blurb sent out reminding the August Barr report is
out.....................

"In providing further in depth aquatic plant research reviews, this
month's topic is still on mineral assimilation but with a special focus on
ratios of NPK and CNP from many submersed plants to show the wide ranges
as well as the averages. While ratios in and of themselves are
insignificant till they become limiting(Liebig's law of minimums), my
focus in a more general broader sense has been the upper ranges(Shleford'
law of tolerances) that cause poor plant growth. Finding the minimum
amounts needed for plant growth is relatively easy.

But the ratios will help support the main focus.......... that high PO4 is
present in natural aquatic plants and required for good plant growth. Past
aquatic horticulture advice from books has been very poor in the back
ground in relations to the plant's needs, content and the presence of
algae with respect to Fe, PO4, NO3 and NH4.

PO4 in particular is still referenced as "bad" in terms of excess. This
myth needs to stop as it is simply untrue. I am providing more evidence
here to show this even further than merely testing alone or consensus.

Redfield ratios are often quoted in the Neathlands as cure for this or
that algae. Tomorrow someone else will come along with some other
incorrect theory and bred another batch of myths relating to ratios. As if
it is some magical nirvana that will magically cure all your woes.........
Testing these things is rather straight forward, but also having some
tables of the ratios can lend a great deal of support combat such myths
and tangents that detracts from growing the plants.

I have always held that plants grow best good within a range, this range
is wide and exploring this range is important to understand the limits we
can maintain good plant growth. Using both field data from natural systems
for aquatic plants as well as test in our tanks allows a fairly good
handle of what the plants need.

This month's report shows the ranges found, look not just at the averages,
but the entire ranges, they are not picky plants, they grow well and
dominate in a wide range of conditions.

Regards,
Tom Barr"

Regards
Bob

Pedro wrote:
I will get a test kit for phosphate and see what I can do...I will try to
find the sweet spot. I might need some other plants. Maybe my plant load is
low and it can not combat the algae...any suggestion of good, easy care
plants that grow fast?

Hygrophila polysperma, Rotala indica (or rotundifolia), baby's tears,
and watersprite are some of my favorite fast growers. When the hygro,
rotala, or baby's tears get too tall, lop them off and stick the tops in
the gravel. The plant will sprout from the remaining stem and the tops
will root. Watersprite produces baby plants at its leaf margins you can
plant.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html '__
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com