I don't know about in soil, but hydroponics shops sell hydrogen peroxide for
use in hydroponic gardening. I think it provides oxygen for the roots.

"jhultman" wrote in message
...

Co-worker was asking me how my back felt after last weekends
marathon double dig session. Then proceeded to tell me he read
that one could obtain forty percent peroxide in gallon quantities
from a beauty supply shop. Dilute that down to eight percent and
condition the soil. Said plants will grow faster, healthier etc. etc.

I'm inclined to think it might kill of microbes and worms.

I'm definitely not going to do this. I amending the soil with all the
good
stuff.
Compost, mulch, composted manure and feel this will be more than
adequate.

But was wondering if this is snake oil or not.

Chemistry and I were not very good acquaintances back in the day.

Almost drying up here in the South SF Bay.
Off to the recycling center for more compost at lunch time. The
soil still clumps together.

Should have that compost tilled in and ready to plant this weekend.
Seed sprouts are now begging for their plot.

Jeff

"jhultman" wrote in message
...

Co-worker was asking me how my back felt after last weekends
marathon double dig session. Then proceeded to tell me he read
that one could obtain forty percent peroxide in gallon quantities
from a beauty supply shop. Dilute that down to eight percent and
condition the soil. Said plants will grow faster, healthier etc. etc.

I'm inclined to think it might kill of microbes and worms.

I'm definitely not going to do this. I amending the soil with all the
good
stuff.
Compost, mulch, composted manure and feel this will be more than
adequate.

But was wondering if this is snake oil or not.

Chemistry and I were not very good acquaintances back in the day.

Almost drying up here in the South SF Bay.
Off to the recycling center for more compost at lunch time. The
soil still clumps together.

Should have that compost tilled in and ready to plant this weekend.
Seed sprouts are now begging for their plot.

Jeff

Hydrogen peroxide is an unstable oxidising agent, it decomposes into
oxygen and water. As it decomposes it may bleach colours by oxidising
pigments to non coloured compounds and kill microbes too. Diluted to
about 2-3% it was used as a topical antiseptic to clean minor wounds etc
but this is not recommended much these days as it can damage tissue even
at that strength. At 8% it will certainly kill many micobes and
probably kill other small things like worms too, why would you want to
disinfect your soil?

At high concentrations it is quite dangerous and unstable, a spill of
40% on you or your clothes would be quite harmful. I have no information
here but my *guess* is that it would not be handled in that
concentration in the beauty industry as there is no need, the strongest
solution commonly found is around 10%. I wouldn't handle a large amount
of 40% unless I was wearing protective clothing and goggles and had a
safety shower handy. At very high concentrations it has been used as
rocket fuel - I kid you not.

It produces none of the common NPK minerals or trace elements. Plants do
require oxygen (they transpire as well as photosynthesise) so the oxygen
from peroxide (at low concentrations) *might* help roots similar to the
way the availability of air round the roots helps hydroponics but it
might not be harmless either. Here is a page that says it works:

http://ma.essortment.com/howtooxygenate_pjy.htm

Note that the starting concentration is not specified, which suggests a
rather haphazard approach and little understanding by the author. If
you start with the 2-3% solution you can buy from the local pharmacy and
diluted beyond that according to this article you would be applying it
at about 1/2 % not 8%. I think you would be better off working on good
aeration of your soil by more traditional methods unless you can get
more precise information. And play with 40% peroxide only if you have
good insurance.

David

Yes, I'm not messing with the 40% concentration.
Nor am I going to try this. My tilling in std amendments
is my story, and I'm sticking to it.

Thanks for your reply David, and others too.


David Hare-Scott wrote:

"jhultman" wrote in message
...

Co-worker was asking me how my back felt after last weekends
marathon double dig session. Then proceeded to tell me he read
that one could obtain forty percent peroxide in gallon quantities
from a beauty supply shop. Dilute that down to eight percent and
condition the soil. Said plants will grow faster, healthier etc. etc.

I'm inclined to think it might kill of microbes and worms.

I'm definitely not going to do this. I amending the soil with all the
good
stuff.
Compost, mulch, composted manure and feel this will be more than
adequate.

But was wondering if this is snake oil or not.

Chemistry and I were not very good acquaintances back in the day.

Almost drying up here in the South SF Bay.
Off to the recycling center for more compost at lunch time. The
soil still clumps together.

Should have that compost tilled in and ready to plant this weekend.
Seed sprouts are now begging for their plot.

Jeff

Hydrogen peroxide is an unstable oxidising agent, it decomposes into
oxygen and water. As it decomposes it may bleach colours by oxidising
pigments to non coloured compounds and kill microbes too. Diluted to
about 2-3% it was used as a topical antiseptic to clean minor wounds etc
but this is not recommended much these days as it can damage tissue even
at that strength. At 8% it will certainly kill many micobes and
probably kill other small things like worms too, why would you want to
disinfect your soil?

At high concentrations it is quite dangerous and unstable, a spill of
40% on you or your clothes would be quite harmful. I have no information
here but my *guess* is that it would not be handled in that
concentration in the beauty industry as there is no need, the strongest
solution commonly found is around 10%. I wouldn't handle a large amount
of 40% unless I was wearing protective clothing and goggles and had a
safety shower handy. At very high concentrations it has been used as
rocket fuel - I kid you not.

It produces none of the common NPK minerals or trace elements. Plants do
require oxygen (they transpire as well as photosynthesise) so the oxygen
from peroxide (at low concentrations) *might* help roots similar to the
way the availability of air round the roots helps hydroponics but it
might not be harmless either. Here is a page that says it works:

http://ma.essortment.com/howtooxygenate_pjy.htm

Note that the starting concentration is not specified, which suggests a
rather haphazard approach and little understanding by the author. If
you start with the 2-3% solution you can buy from the local pharmacy and
diluted beyond that according to this article you would be applying it
at about 1/2 % not 8%. I think you would be better off working on good
aeration of your soil by more traditional methods unless you can get
more precise information. And play with 40% peroxide only if you have
good insurance.

David

Hydrogen Peroxide is sold as an adjunct to foliar sprays. Supposedly it
helps increase nutrient uptake.

On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:25:46 -0700, Bill Ranseen wrote:

Hydrogen Peroxide is sold as an adjunct to foliar sprays. Supposedly it
helps increase nutrient uptake.

Under which label or manufacturer is hydrogen peroxide sold as an adjunct to
foliar sprays. I ask because I've been an organic gardener for 25 years and
never once heard of it, or used or purchased it for horticultural use. I do
know Jerry Baker, the mental giant, recommends using Listerine to make foliage
surface inhospitable to fungal infections, but never heard of hydrogen peroxide.

(FarmerDill) wrote:



Thought O had heard everything, but that is a new one for me. While hydrogen
peroxide releases nitrogen

It can't- it is H2O2 with no "N" in it.

Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

jhultman wrote:


Co-worker was asking me how my back felt after last weekends
marathon double dig session. Then proceeded to tell me he read
that one could obtain forty percent peroxide in gallon quantities
from a beauty supply shop.
True so far, but it's usually sold in cases of smaller bottles
because it goes bad so quickly.

Dilute that down to eight percent and
condition the soil. Said plants will grow faster, healthier etc. etc.

have cow-orker test it in their garden. Sounds like UTTER BS to
me.


But was wondering if this is snake oil or not.
I hear slithering


Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

animaux wrote:

On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:25:46 -0700, Bill Ranseen wrote:

Hydrogen Peroxide is sold as an adjunct to foliar sprays. Supposedly it
helps increase nutrient uptake.

Under which label or manufacturer is hydrogen peroxide sold as an adjunct to
foliar sprays. I ask because I've been an organic gardener for 25 years and
never once heard of it, or used or purchased it for horticultural use. I do
know Jerry Baker, the mental giant, recommends using Listerine to make foliage
surface inhospitable to fungal infections, but never heard of hydrogen peroxide.



ZeroTol, labeled for flowers, and Oxidate, labeled for vegetables, are
both basically hydrogen peroxide. They are used as a fungicide and
disinfectant. They are acceptable to the organic community.

The smallest quantity you can buy is 2.5 gallons of 27% strength (with
some sort of stabilizer, I think peroxyacetic acid or something like
that) for about $110. The application strength is 0.1%-0.3%, or about
100:1 to 300:1 dilution. The stuff you get in the grocery store is
generally about 3% strength and costs around $0.69/pt. More affordable
to the home garden crowd and much safer to handle, although slightly
more expensive per application.

As far as I know it does not aid nutrient uptake, other than keeping
fungal diseases at bay which might inhibit plant growth. I'm not aware
that it is being marketed for any such purpose. The fungicidal action is
basically as an oxidizer. It destroys very small organisms such as
spores (high surface area to volume ratio) but doesn't seem to affect
larger systems. I have used it at up to 0.5% strength without observing
any phytotoxicity. The hydrogen peroxide will break down in sunlight
into water and oxygen. It will supposedly destroy outbreaks of powdery
mildew. I've tried it and it works on early outbreaks, but if it's a
realy heavy case of PM, several applications reduce it but don't cure
it.

OMRI and NOP list as approved material, approved for organic use for
several years.




On Thu, 01 May 2003 13:05:54 GMT, animaux wrote:

On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:25:46 -0700, Bill Ranseen wrote:

Hydrogen Peroxide is sold as an adjunct to foliar sprays. Supposedly it
helps increase nutrient uptake.

Under which label or manufacturer is hydrogen peroxide sold as an adjunct to
foliar sprays. I ask because I've been an organic gardener for 25 years and
never once heard of it, or used or purchased it for horticultural use. I do
know Jerry Baker, the mental giant, recommends using Listerine to make foliage
surface inhospitable to fungal infections, but never heard of hydrogen peroxide.



"Nature, left alone, is in perfect balance.
Harmful insects and plant diseases are always present,
but do not occur in nature to an extent which requires the use of poisonous chemicals.
The sensible approach to disease and insect control is to grow sturdy crops in a healthy environment."

Masanobu Fukuoka, One Straw Revolution--1978

Thought O had heard everything, but that is a new one for me. While hydrogen
peroxide releases nitrogen

It can't- it is H2O2 with no "N" in it.

Tsu

You are absolutely right. Just finished typing up my exams, better check to if
if I substituted oxygen which I should have typed in this post for nitrogen in
one of these, Oh well, that what happens when when we come out of retirement.

Not really a very good product from my view, unless it was used in an
organic cash crop as a last ditch effort to save the crop and maintain
the organic certification. Like any fungicide it would likely take out
beneficial fungi inhabiting the leaves and render the crop defenseless
against other pathogens.


On Fri, 02 May 2003 03:08:05 GMT, animaux wrote:

I am not even a wealth of information on
products as I rarely, if ever, use any. Only fertilizer and compost.

Victoria



"Nature, left alone, is in perfect balance.
Harmful insects and plant diseases are always present,
but do not occur in nature to an extent which requires the use of poisonous chemicals.
The sensible approach to disease and insect control is to grow sturdy crops in a healthy environment."

Masanobu Fukuoka, One Straw Revolution--1978

You forgot to recommend mixing it with generous amounts of snake oil, Billy
Bob!


Bill Ranseen wrote in message
...
Hydrogen Peroxide is sold as an adjunct to foliar sprays. Supposedly it
helps increase nutrient uptake.

It is another case of something accepted in a certified organic program which is
not quite good to use. I agree about a last ditch effort. When you're about
to lose a greenhouse of plants, it's hard not to do everything possible and
still maintain certification standards.

V


On Fri, 02 May 2003 05:38:23 -0700, Tom Jaszewski wrote:

Not really a very good product from my view, unless it was used in an
organic cash crop as a last ditch effort to save the crop and maintain
the organic certification. Like any fungicide it would likely take out
beneficial fungi inhabiting the leaves and render the crop defenseless
against other pathogens.


On Fri, 02 May 2003 03:08:05 GMT, animaux wrote:

I am not even a wealth of information on
products as I rarely, if ever, use any. Only fertilizer and compost.

Victoria



"Nature, left alone, is in perfect balance.
Harmful insects and plant diseases are always present,
but do not occur in nature to an extent which requires the use of poisonous chemicals.
The sensible approach to disease and insect control is to grow sturdy crops in a healthy environment."

Masanobu Fukuoka, One Straw Revolution--1978

In article ,
wrote:

On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:25:46 -0700, Bill Ranseen
wrote:

Hydrogen Peroxide is sold as an adjunct to foliar sprays. Supposedly it
helps increase nutrient uptake.

Under which label or manufacturer is hydrogen peroxide sold as an adjunct
to
foliar sprays. I ask because I've been an organic gardener for 25 years
and
never once heard of it, or used or purchased it for horticultural use. I
do
know Jerry Baker, the mental giant, recommends using Listerine to make
foliage
surface inhospitable to fungal infections, but never heard of hydrogen
peroxide

Peaceful Valley Farm Supply (www.groworganic.com) sells 35%food grade
H2O2 as a "Foliar Spray Enhancer" to "improve oxygen levels...(which)
improve the plant's ability to take up any available nutrients...." I
think the name of the manufacturer is Farmgard Products. Personally I
have no notion if this is cutting edge stuff or horsepucky.