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Old 10-06-2003, 01:56 PM
Carl e Roberts
 
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Default hard packed soil (clay)

15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?


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Old 10-06-2003, 02:08 PM
animaux
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

Pelletized gypsum is an excellent product to add to the soil when it is hard
clay. I would not suggest you use powdered gypsum. The addition of sand may
work, but usually only if accompanied by a thick layer of mulch, otherwise the
small particles of clay stick to the significantly larger sand particles and can
cause some very hard soil, as you now can see. Mulch is really important in
that it continues to nourish the soil with active organisms which help break
down the mulch and shades the soil to keep it cooler, thus the earthworms come
higher to the surface and drag down the organic matter to ingest and process, as
well as aerating the soil. Worm castings will then be present in the soil,
which will introduce other aerobic organisms, which further break the soil down
into more friable particles.

Leaving clay with added sand in hot open sun will give you something on the
order of concrete. It will change the minute you mulch. On areas where
aesthetic is not an issue, I will use alfalfa hay to suppress weeds and feed the
soil organisms. It keeps the soil cool and moist, which is how clay(s) develop
from hardpan into workable soil.

It's a process which is well worth it. It can take about three years for soil
to truly come alive and be self sufficient enough where you only need to add
organic matter to maintain the levels of micro and macro organisms which in
turn, do all the work. A soil should only need to be tilled mechanically once.
Then it should be left alone to recover and develop a fungal mat where you will
smell frankincense in the soil. It smells sweet and has great texture and
structure. Clay is a lot easier to do this with than sand since the clay
already has body, it just needs to be nurtured and given organic matter to
develop. If you add anything, add finished compost, preferably with active
actinomycetes, which is a fungus and will help develop active soils.

For information about soil and how to get it alive, take a look at:

http://www.soilfoodweb.com/phpweb/to...ex.php?tid=153

or start at their home page:

www.soilfoodweb.com

Victoria


On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 07:44:54 -0500, Carl e Roberts wrote:

15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?


  #3   Report Post  
Old 10-06-2003, 04:20 PM
Carl e Roberts
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

thanx Victoria.. there's a lot here to "chew" on..

• pelletized gypsum.. can I top dress with this or do I need to till it in the fall
(already established beds)
•I am trying to develope "tilth" in this garden-sometimes it gets so packed you
can't poke yer finger into the soil. (gotta be hard on those little roots trying to
spread out)
•I am currently using straw to mulch where I can (to prevent the sun from baking
the clay and also moisture retention)
•let's talk about worms-happy abundant worms make for good soil-(no doubt in my
mind)- what can I do to make these little guys happy and go forth and
multiply?-(maybe sprinkle some corn meal on the soil?)-also things to avoid to make
them unhappy
•I've got grass clippings and shredded newspaper to use for organic
material-currently "working" in two compost piles.. (more on this-maybe in another
post) When to add the grass clippings and shredded newspaper? -we're talking about
top dressing with these-(established beds)-would make me some happy worms?
•I would like to hear more about this "fungal mat"-what does it look like?-I just
surface cultivated what I think to be a "fungal mat" this morning.. The soil was
(lightly) hard packed with a green surface area..




animaux wrote:

Pelletized gypsum is an excellent product to add to the soil when it is hard
clay. I would not suggest you use powdered gypsum. The addition of sand may
work, but usually only if accompanied by a thick layer of mulch, otherwise the
small particles of clay stick to the significantly larger sand particles and can
cause some very hard soil, as you now can see. Mulch is really important in
that it continues to nourish the soil with active organisms which help break
down the mulch and shades the soil to keep it cooler, thus the earthworms come
higher to the surface and drag down the organic matter to ingest and process, as
well as aerating the soil. Worm castings will then be present in the soil,
which will introduce other aerobic organisms, which further break the soil down
into more friable particles.

Leaving clay with added sand in hot open sun will give you something on the
order of concrete. It will change the minute you mulch. On areas where
aesthetic is not an issue, I will use alfalfa hay to suppress weeds and feed the
soil organisms. It keeps the soil cool and moist, which is how clay(s) develop
from hardpan into workable soil.

It's a process which is well worth it. It can take about three years for soil
to truly come alive and be self sufficient enough where you only need to add
organic matter to maintain the levels of micro and macro organisms which in
turn, do all the work. A soil should only need to be tilled mechanically once.
Then it should be left alone to recover and develop a fungal mat where you will
smell frankincense in the soil. It smells sweet and has great texture and
structure. Clay is a lot easier to do this with than sand since the clay
already has body, it just needs to be nurtured and given organic matter to
develop. If you add anything, add finished compost, preferably with active
actinomycetes, which is a fungus and will help develop active soils.

For information about soil and how to get it alive, take a look at:

http://www.soilfoodweb.com/phpweb/to...ex.php?tid=153

or start at their home page:

www.soilfoodweb.com

Victoria

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 07:44:54 -0500, Carl e Roberts wrote:

15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?



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Old 10-06-2003, 04:44 PM
animaux
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 10:20:05 -0500, Carl e Roberts wrote:

thanx Victoria.. there's a lot here to "chew" on..

• pelletized gypsum.. can I top dress with this or do I need to till it in the fall
(already established beds)


Yes, you can top dress and gently scratch it into the soil with a rake. It will
make its way down.

•I am trying to develope "tilth" in this garden-sometimes it gets so packed you
can't poke yer finger into the soil. (gotta be hard on those little roots trying to
spread out)


Mulch will fix this problem after you loosen the soil the first time. Add the
compost, then mulch on top of that and you will not have the hard crust any
more.

•I am currently using straw to mulch where I can (to prevent the sun from baking
the clay and also moisture retention)


This is excellent. Maybe you need more of it, or it may need to be more heavily
applied.

•let's talk about worms-happy abundant worms make for good soil-(no doubt in my
mind)- what can I do to make these little guys happy and go forth and
multiply?-(maybe sprinkle some corn meal on the soil?)-also things to avoid to make
them unhappy


Compost, corn meal, plain white sugar, any organic matter is what worms thrive
on. If you till, you will kill many worms. I fix my soil by gently turning it
with a fork. Not a flat tines fork, a pitch fork which has thin tines. It's a
delicate balance when to work clay. Too wet, you can harm the structure for
years, too dry, good luck getting anything to penetrate it. I then break up the
clods with my hands, which could explain the horrible arthritic pain I have all
the time! Worms love compost. Everything loves it. Next truck load you have
delivered should be compost.

•I've got grass clippings and shredded newspaper to use for organic
material-currently "working" in two compost piles.. (more on this-maybe in another
post) When to add the grass clippings and shredded newspaper? -we're talking about
top dressing with these-(established beds)-would make me some happy worms?


Grass clippings are far better mulched with a mower and left on the grass than
they are in piles, but if you want to use them as mulch make sure they are not
kept wet or soggy or you will set up an unhealthy anaerobic situation which can
breed pathogens. Make sure the grass is dry when you apply it to the soil as
mulch, but I recommend shredded native hardwood mulch. Check to see if your
municipality shreds Christmas trees and gives the mulch away to the public for
free. I was surprised when I found out that nobody was at the pile in our city.
I must have hauled 4 truckloads to our property. I went back recently, and
there is still a huge pile. Going to go back and get some more.

•I would like to hear more about this "fungal mat"-what does it look like?-I just
surface cultivated what I think to be a "fungal mat" this morning.. The soil was
(lightly) hard packed with a green surface area..


Fungal mat is not green. That was probably some form of algae. Here is a good
website which explains MYCORRHIZAE.

http://www.herb.lsa.umich.edu/kidpage/mycorhiz.htm

another:

http://www.bio-organics.com/

http://www.mycorrhizae.com/FAQ.php


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Old 10-06-2003, 06:20 PM
Travis
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

Carl e Roberts wrote:
15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in
Memphis). (The neighbors thot I was building a beach).
The sand is still mixed with the clay but the
clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have two compost piles
"working" and intend this fall to incorporate large quantities of
organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into this garden
spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add more sand to
help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the answer here-
I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is "gypsum" and
how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be purchased?


I don't know about gypsum but I have heard that clay+sand=cement.

--
Travis in Shoreline (just North of Seattle) Washington
USDA Zone 8b
Sunset Zone 5




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Old 10-06-2003, 06:20 PM
Ali
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

How about some peat? We had some pretty bad spots in the back of the yard,
and after mixing a good bit of peat (as well as compost) it helped with the
heaviness and clumping.

Ali



"Carl e Roberts" wrote in message
...
15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?




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Old 10-06-2003, 06:32 PM
paghat
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

In article , "Travis"
wrote:

Carl e Roberts wrote:
15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in
Memphis). (The neighbors thot I was building a beach).
The sand is still mixed with the clay but the
clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have two compost piles
"working" and intend this fall to incorporate large quantities of
organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into this garden
spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add more sand to
help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the answer here-
I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is "gypsum" and
how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be purchased?


I don't know about gypsum but I have heard that clay+sand=cement.


That sounds like a pretty likely outcome all righty. Sounds like that soil
needs MASSES of organic matter added but already has all the sand & clay
it will ever require. I doubt two compost piles (unless they're
super-humongous sized piles) will be near enough. Breaking up the soil by
mixing in a coarse-grade sawdust might be a cheap start-up for getting
organic matter in the soil. As the wood bits degrade in situ, they
encourage beneficial funguses & other healthful soil activity. Plus
coatings of sterile composted manures or leafmold will speed up the soil
improvement.

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/
  #8   Report Post  
Old 10-06-2003, 06:44 PM
Phisherman
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

You can purchase gypsum at most garden centers. It is a little on the
expensive side, but application is very easy--just spread it over the
ground. Adding compost to clay soil will help it more than sand
(although sand is okay but it has no nutrients).

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 07:44:54 -0500, Carl e Roberts
wrote:

15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?


  #9   Report Post  
Old 10-06-2003, 06:56 PM
jcart003
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

If you look at a venn diagramm of what makes up soil texture it
becomes obvious that adding sand to a clay soil is pointless, to truly
effect the soil texture you would need to basically replace all the
clay. (which brings me to a pet peave-- add what you want you will NOT
improve the soil drainage that is a function of subsoil and slope)....
but you have slope. TONS of organic matter and the proper amount of
gypsum is the best bet. In the "old" days 100 tons of compost to the
acre per year was not considered to much!!!!! And as was said earlier
keep the sun off (with a nice thick mulch) this is especially
important in the warmer areas of the world. And finally take heart in
the fact that clay soil is "strong" soil, that is it has lots of
minerals to make plants thrive, it is just a bit (LOT) fussy about how
it gets treated!


animaux wrote in message . ..
Pelletized gypsum is an excellent product to add to the soil when it is hard
clay. I would not suggest you use powdered gypsum. The addition of sand may
work, but usually only if accompanied by a thick layer of mulch, otherwise the
small particles of clay stick to the significantly larger sand particles and can
cause some very hard soil, as you now can see. Mulch is really important in
that it continues to nourish the soil with active organisms which help break
down the mulch and shades the soil to keep it cooler, thus the earthworms come
higher to the surface and drag down the organic matter to ingest and process, as
well as aerating the soil. Worm castings will then be present in the soil,
which will introduce other aerobic organisms, which further break the soil down
into more friable particles.

Leaving clay with added sand in hot open sun will give you something on the
order of concrete. It will change the minute you mulch. On areas where
aesthetic is not an issue, I will use alfalfa hay to suppress weeds and feed the
soil organisms. It keeps the soil cool and moist, which is how clay(s) develop
from hardpan into workable soil.

It's a process which is well worth it. It can take about three years for soil
to truly come alive and be self sufficient enough where you only need to add
organic matter to maintain the levels of micro and macro organisms which in
turn, do all the work. A soil should only need to be tilled mechanically once.
Then it should be left alone to recover and develop a fungal mat where you will
smell frankincense in the soil. It smells sweet and has great texture and
structure. Clay is a lot easier to do this with than sand since the clay
already has body, it just needs to be nurtured and given organic matter to
develop. If you add anything, add finished compost, preferably with active
actinomycetes, which is a fungus and will help develop active soils.

For information about soil and how to get it alive, take a look at:

http://www.soilfoodweb.com/phpweb/to...ex.php?tid=153

or start at their home page:

www.soilfoodweb.com

Victoria


On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 07:44:54 -0500, Carl e Roberts wrote:

15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?

  #10   Report Post  
Old 10-06-2003, 07:56 PM
Carl e Roberts
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

Actually the sand is a good thing in that it will mix with the clay and
help its breakup allowing additional organic matter to be more easily
introduced.. Also worked wonders for the draingage of my yard (we are on
the receiving end of a slight slope in our neighborhood). My neighbor has
standing water after a heavy rain-I have green grass..




I don't know about gypsum but I have heard that clay+sand=cement.

--
Travis in Shoreline (just North of Seattle) Washington
USDA Zone 8b
Sunset Zone 5





  #11   Report Post  
Old 11-06-2003, 12:44 AM
animaux
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:13:29 GMT, "Travis"
wrote:


I don't know about gypsum but I have heard that clay+sand=cement.


I thought that at one time, also. Then I learned from someone who used to post
here often (Don Chappman) who said that sand in the proper amount would not make
cement (concrete actually, since its made up of cement and aggregate). The
original poster said he used a lot of sand, not a bag or two in a square
(10'x10').

Gypsum in the pelletized form does help to loosen and mellow tight clay soils,
but I go back the original question and will say that proper moisture levels in
soil is paramount when trying to loosen it.

Victoria
  #12   Report Post  
Old 11-06-2003, 12:44 AM
animaux
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

Adding peat is not a permanent fix, and may cause problems if the soil dries
out. It's very difficult to wet peat moss once it has dried out. It's also a
non-renewable resource and has no life in it at all. It's good for potting
mixes, but not practical or effective for changing structure or texture of clay
soils.

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:18:36 GMT, "Ali"
wrote:

How about some peat? We had some pretty bad spots in the back of the yard,
and after mixing a good bit of peat (as well as compost) it helped with the
heaviness and clumping.

Ali



"Carl e Roberts" wrote in message
...
15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?




  #13   Report Post  
Old 11-06-2003, 01:20 AM
Travis
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

Carl e Roberts wrote:
Actually the sand is a good thing in that it will mix with the clay
and help its breakup allowing additional organic matter to be more
easily introduced.. Also worked wonders for the draingage of my yard
(we are on the receiving end of a slight slope in our neighborhood).
My neighbor has standing water after a heavy rain-I have green grass..


If you are adding TONS of organic matter at the same time the end result
"may" not be cement, but it will take LOTS of organic matter.

--
Travis in Shoreline (just North of Seattle) Washington
USDA Zone 8b
Sunset Zone 5

  #14   Report Post  
Old 13-06-2003, 06:44 AM
Jason Quick
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

"Travis" wrote :

I don't know about gypsum but I have heard that clay+sand=cement.


Nope. Sand (aggregate actually) + portland cement = concrete.
Sand+clay=clay with sand in it. The problem comes when people work the clay
while it's too wet. THAT leads to the concrete-like texture you describe.
To get any noticeable effect from the addition of sand, you've gotta add a
ton of it.

Jason


  #15   Report Post  
Old 13-06-2003, 12:20 PM
GIJane
 
Posts: n/a
Default hard packed soil (clay)

Carl,

Victoria's advice sounds right on. Whether you can do that in an
established bed is going to be a challenge. What has worked for me is
simply taking kitchen scraps out every few days (even in winter, zone 6) and
digging a narrow hole to 2-3 inches below the clay line, dumping the scrapes
in and covering. The garden has slowly but surely been improved over the
last year or two. Digging a narrow hole will be a lot less intrusive to
your established plants. Good luck.

"Carl e Roberts" wrote in message
...
thanx Victoria.. there's a lot here to "chew" on..

. pelletized gypsum.. can I top dress with this or do I need to till it in

the fall
(already established beds)
.I am trying to develope "tilth" in this garden-sometimes it gets so

packed you
can't poke yer finger into the soil. (gotta be hard on those little roots

trying to
spread out)
.I am currently using straw to mulch where I can (to prevent the sun from

baking
the clay and also moisture retention)
.let's talk about worms-happy abundant worms make for good soil-(no doubt

in my
mind)- what can I do to make these little guys happy and go forth and
multiply?-(maybe sprinkle some corn meal on the soil?)-also things to

avoid to make
them unhappy
.I've got grass clippings and shredded newspaper to use for organic
material-currently "working" in two compost piles.. (more on this-maybe in

another
post) When to add the grass clippings and shredded newspaper? -we're

talking about
top dressing with these-(established beds)-would make me some happy worms?
.I would like to hear more about this "fungal mat"-what does it look

like?-I just
surface cultivated what I think to be a "fungal mat" this morning.. The

soil was
(lightly) hard packed with a green surface area..




animaux wrote:

Pelletized gypsum is an excellent product to add to the soil when it is

hard
clay. I would not suggest you use powdered gypsum. The addition of

sand may
work, but usually only if accompanied by a thick layer of mulch,

otherwise the
small particles of clay stick to the significantly larger sand particles

and can
cause some very hard soil, as you now can see. Mulch is really

important in
that it continues to nourish the soil with active organisms which help

break
down the mulch and shades the soil to keep it cooler, thus the

earthworms come
higher to the surface and drag down the organic matter to ingest and

process, as
well as aerating the soil. Worm castings will then be present in the

soil,
which will introduce other aerobic organisms, which further break the

soil down
into more friable particles.

Leaving clay with added sand in hot open sun will give you something on

the
order of concrete. It will change the minute you mulch. On areas where
aesthetic is not an issue, I will use alfalfa hay to suppress weeds and

feed the
soil organisms. It keeps the soil cool and moist, which is how clay(s)

develop
from hardpan into workable soil.

It's a process which is well worth it. It can take about three years

for soil
to truly come alive and be self sufficient enough where you only need to

add
organic matter to maintain the levels of micro and macro organisms which

in
turn, do all the work. A soil should only need to be tilled

mechanically once.
Then it should be left alone to recover and develop a fungal mat where

you will
smell frankincense in the soil. It smells sweet and has great texture

and
structure. Clay is a lot easier to do this with than sand since the

clay
already has body, it just needs to be nurtured and given organic matter

to
develop. If you add anything, add finished compost, preferably with

active
actinomycetes, which is a fungus and will help develop active soils.

For information about soil and how to get it alive, take a look at:

http://www.soilfoodweb.com/phpweb/to...ex.php?tid=153

or start at their home page:

www.soilfoodweb.com

Victoria

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 07:44:54 -0500, Carl e Roberts

wrote:

15 yrs ago I added 24 cu yds of white sand to my yard (here in

Memphis).
(The neighbors thot I was building a beach). We are on the downward

side
of a slight slope and this sand definitely has helped with drainage and
has improved our soil overall. Recently this spring we tilled about
400sq. ft of new flowerbeds and I was amazed at the variety of soil
types in various locations of the yard. Some in full sun, partial

shade,
the "upside" of our yard, and the "downside" all with different types

of
soil. (I am going to take a small break from this sand issue to say for
the benefit of some-I have also added other "amendments" to the soil
such as lime,compost,organic matter,etc. ). Here (finally) is the

issue:
The area where we have a small garden after tilling and planting this
spring is showing signs of hard packed soil. The sand is still mixed
with the clay but the clay still "hardpacks" after a good rain. I have
two compost piles "working" and intend this fall to incorporate large
quantities of organic matter (grassclippings/shredded newspaper) into
this garden spot. My question is this: I am wondering whether to add
more sand to help with the breakup of the clay or maybe gypsum is the
answer here- I am not very familiar with this product what exactly is
"gypsum" and how/when is this product added? where can gypsum be
purchased?





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