"gregpresley" wrote in message
...

wrote in message motives, cost/benefit, etc. Once
you
get into the realm of which candidate
truly believes "Jesus Christ is my personal Savior", and how you would
prove
that, you've lost the ability to have a rational political discussion.

A Christian is by definition someone who believes that Jesus Christ is
their savior. Are you saying that Christians can't be reasoned with,
that they can't understand complex topics? Are Christians irrational?

It sure does sound like you're a religious bigot, though that seems to
be a politically correct form of bigotry these days. Shouldn't people
vote based on their personal beliefs?

Swyck

First of all, I consider myself Christian, so I don't look in the mirror
every morning and say "gosh, what an irrational creature you are".....LOL
But belief is private and acceptance of fine points of dogma, an
individual
matter - not a matter for politics. . Over 2/3rds of the world's
Christians
(Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Christians) believe that the defnition of
Christian is "follower of Christ" - embedded in that definition is, of
course, a belief that Jesus is the Savior, but also strong in that
tradition
is the answer to the biblical question, "how will you know they are
Christians? You will know they are Christians by their love". In that
tradition of Christianity, people are not going to accept a statement of
"I
have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior" from a public official
(or
from any individual) for that matter, as being significant. They are going
to look for the acts, or the works, if you will, which translate belief
into
action. And those acts, if a person has digested the new Testament, will
necessarily have to be fully living out the Beatitudes and similar
suggestions of Jesus on how to live a holy life. From a public policy
perspective, I have no interest in a politician's political beliefs, but
if
he/she consistently votes in favor of policies that ease the lives of the
poor and downtrodden, whether for school lunch programs, or making sure
that
children have shelter, on in international policies, if he/she votes for
sustained diplomacy for peace-making efforts above war, I have all the
"moral-values" information I need on that candidate - who could be
Christian, Jew, Moslem, Hindu, Buddhist , or atheist for all that I care.



How do you deal with the business about the end of the world, when
unfortunate Jews, Buddhists, etc will be toast because they don't believe in
Jesus?

"Doug Kanter" How do you deal with the business about the end of the
world, when
unfortunate Jews, Buddhists, etc will be toast because they don't believe
in
Jesus?

I don't concern myself with judgment day. The bible has many specific
injunction against doing that, most of which have been ignored by Christians
of all denominations ever since. As a matter of fact, I'm personally more
interested in how I can make the world a better place while I'm alive than
what's going to happen to me after death. I would be astounded if God were
as "judgmental" as a lot of folks think he ought to be - (of course, always
assuming that they themselves will be among the elect, and those they don't
like will be hell-bound). But that point of view is not going to be heard
from any Christian pulpit anytime soon, I don't expect......LOL

"gregpresley" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" How do you deal with the business about the end of the
world, when
unfortunate Jews, Buddhists, etc will be toast because they don't
believe
in
Jesus?

I don't concern myself with judgment day. The bible has many specific
injunction against doing that, most of which have been ignored by
Christians
of all denominations ever since. As a matter of fact, I'm personally more
interested in how I can make the world a better place while I'm alive than
what's going to happen to me after death. I would be astounded if God were
as "judgmental" as a lot of folks think he ought to be - (of course,
always
assuming that they themselves will be among the elect, and those they
don't
like will be hell-bound). But that point of view is not going to be heard
from any Christian pulpit anytime soon, I don't expect......LOL





You might get a kick out of the movie "Dogma", especially when god appears
at the end. :-) Great movie.

In article , "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"gregpresley" wrote in message
...

"Doug Kanter" How do you deal with the business about the end of the
world, when
unfortunate Jews, Buddhists, etc will be toast because they don't
believe
in
Jesus?

I don't concern myself with judgment day. The bible has many specific
injunction against doing that, most of which have been ignored by
Christians
of all denominations ever since. As a matter of fact, I'm personally more
interested in how I can make the world a better place while I'm alive than
what's going to happen to me after death. I would be astounded if God were
as "judgmental" as a lot of folks think he ought to be - (of course,
always
assuming that they themselves will be among the elect, and those they
don't
like will be hell-bound). But that point of view is not going to be heard
from any Christian pulpit anytime soon, I don't expect......LOL





You might get a kick out of the movie "Dogma", especially when god appears
at the end. :-) Great movie.

That was a cool movie, & God was hot.

On the opposite extreme from that lovely comedy is the first Prophesy
movie, in which Christopher Walken plays the archangel Gabriel, to whom
God will no longer speak, & who has become the evil urge of god much more
menacing than Lucifer who only wants to tempt us but Gabriel is out to
destroy all the ugly mud-monkeys, who are us, believing as he does that if
he can destroy everything God loves, God will love him instead. The two
sequels aren't bad but don't stand up to the original which has a creepy
believability, since this wacked out Gabriel so greatly resembles many
fundamentalists who likewise believe the way back to God is by hating &
destroying things.

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
Visit the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com

"gregpresley" wrote in message ...

I don't concern myself with judgment day. The bible has many specific
injunction against doing that, most of which have been ignored by Christians
of all denominations ever since. As a matter of fact, I'm personally more
interested in how I can make the world a better place while I'm alive than
what's going to happen to me after death. I would be astounded if God were
as "judgmental" as a lot of folks think he ought to be - (of course, always
assuming that they themselves will be among the elect, and those they don't
like will be hell-bound). But that point of view is not going to be heard
from any Christian pulpit anytime soon, I don't expect......LOL




Here is poem I like and don't know who wrote it. Don't even know it's
name. I've had it for years and never know where it is, but It seems
to surface about the time I get really smug and self-rightious !!! It
seems to know when I need it!

I dreamed death came the other night
And Heaven's gate swung wide:
With kindly grace an Angel
Ushered me inside.
And there---to my astonishment---
Stood folks I'd known on earth:
Some I had judged and labeled as
Unfit or little worth.

Indignent words rose to my lips
But never were set free-----
For every face showed stunned surprise---

NO ONE EXPECTED ME !!!!

leo/lee