My lilac bush does not bloom. It is 5 years old and gets a
half a day of sun. Last summer I had one flower 1/2 " high
and nothing this year. What am I doing wrong?

--
b

"Boots" expounded:

My lilac bush does not bloom. It is 5 years old and gets a
half a day of sun. Last summer I had one flower 1/2 " high
and nothing this year. What am I doing wrong?

Have you tested soil pH? Lilacs prefer a sweet soil, 6-7, I throw a
cup of lime on the rootzone each year and get plenty of blooms (my
soil is naturally very acid, 5 or lower).

--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

In article , "Boots"
wrote:

My lilac bush does not bloom. It is 5 years old and gets a
half a day of sun. Last summer I had one flower 1/2 " high
and nothing this year. What am I doing wrong?

#1 cause of failure to bloom is insufficient sunlight. Ideally they have
morning AND afternoon sun; morning sun alone could well be insufficient.
Six bright hours is the minimum, longer would be great. If the shrub isn't
getting enough sun, no matter what else you do for it it won't bloom.

#2 reason for never blooming is their narrow environmental requirements
aren't met. They need very warm summers with lots & lots of sunlight, then
a good solid wintry winter for dormancy; they like rather northerly
climates with summer sun still shining at nine at night, followed short
winter days, like in central Europe or the Pacific Northwest. If
conditions are too even year round, especially the older cultivars will
forget when it's time to bloom (newer varieties are more forgiving). So
some of the commercially prepared plants are grown where they get exactly
the seasons they want & are quick-shipped to market as soon as buds are
big, & people buy a plant in full flower -- but it's the wrong zone &
though it won't drop dead it won't bloom again either.

Other possibilities:

They set buds a year in advance, & untimely pruning can remove all the
next year's flowers. Correct time to prune is immediately after bloom, as
they set new buds the summer after blooming. Pruning in autumn, winter, or
spring removes those buds.

Fertilizing with nitrogen-rich fertilizer can stop them from blooming.
Kelp or bonemeal is about as much fertilizer as they can stand.

So too overwatering can stop them from setting buds. Sometimes worrying
about a shrub causes a gardener to take extra special good care of it,
meaning watering it way too often & overfertilizing, when it would more
likely thrive on neglect.

Ours do fine in our naturally acidic soils, but sometimes they don't, &amp
if soil is too acidic it might slow them down, & feedings of lime or
wood-ash can help them flower. But don't lime the soil without knowing the
pH as if it doesn't need lime it seriously doesn't need lime.

A shrub planted too deep in the ground will not bloom; it should be
planted on a little hump.

It's rare that lilac buds freeze off, but if there is a harshe late freeze
that hits the buds just as they come out of dormancy, they could all be
killed.

There MIGHT be nothing wrong. If your shrub is really only five years old
total, it would not be at all unusual that it didn't bloom until it was
six years old &amp of substantial size -- it normally takes to to five
full years before they bloom at all. Even somewhat mature lilacs
pot-raised frequently take three to five full years to "settle in" from
the shock of being transplanted into the garden -- six or seven years
would be an unexpected length of time, but five is just within the normal
range of adjustment.

-paghat the ratgirl
--
Get your Paghat the Ratgirl T-Shirt he
http://www.paghat.com/giftshop.html
"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden
people maintaining a free civil government." -Thomas Jefferson

"paghat" wrote in message
news
In article , "Boots"
wrote:



#2 reason for never blooming is their narrow environmental requirements
aren't met. They need very warm summers with lots & lots of sunlight, then
a good solid wintry winter for dormancy; they like rather northerly
climates with summer sun still shining at nine at night, followed short
winter days, like in central Europe or the Pacific Northwest.

I don't understand why short winter days would make any difference since
lilacs are deciduous.

"Vox Humana" wrote in
:



I don't understand why short winter days would make any difference
since lilacs are deciduous.

Photoreceptors are also present in the bark of many trees & shrubs.

--
David J. Bockman, Fairfax, VA (USDA Hardiness Zone 7)
email:
http://beyondgardening.com/Albums

Well, it's a corollary, although not necessarily an obvious one, that long
summer days (of, say 16 sunlit hours) must exist only in places with short
winter days (8 sunlit hours) . Many lilacs are native to Eastern Europe -
places like Yugoslavia, Romania, Hungary. The latitude there is between 45
and 55. This is the same latitude as the northern tier of states in the US,
all along the Canadian border.
"Vox Humana" wrote in message
. ..

"paghat" wrote in message
news
In article , "Boots"
wrote:



#2 reason for never blooming is their narrow environmental requirements
aren't met. They need very warm summers with lots & lots of sunlight,
then
a good solid wintry winter for dormancy; they like rather northerly
climates with summer sun still shining at nine at night, followed short
winter days, like in central Europe or the Pacific Northwest.

I don't understand why short winter days would make any difference since
lilacs are deciduous.

(paghat) expounded:


#1 cause of failure to bloom is insufficient sunlight. Ideally they have
morning AND afternoon sun; morning sun alone could well be insufficient.

I guess all the lilacs I've seen around here in partial shade or
planted in a dooryard getting only partial day sun haven't heard this
rule yet. Yes, the prefer sun, but they do find with part-day sun and
filtered shade.
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

"paghat" wrote
#1 cause of failure to bloom is insufficient sunlight. Ideally they have
morning AND afternoon sun; morning sun alone could well be insufficient.
Six bright hours is the minimum, longer would be great. If the shrub isn't
getting enough sun, no matter what else you do for it it won't bloom.

#2 reason for never blooming is their narrow environmental requirements
aren't met. They need very warm summers with lots & lots of sunlight, then
a good solid wintry winter for dormancy; they like rather northerly
climates with summer sun still shining at nine at night, followed short
winter days, like in central Europe or the Pacific Northwest. If
conditions are too even year round, especially the older cultivars will
forget when it's time to bloom (newer varieties are more forgiving). So
some of the commercially prepared plants are grown where they get exactly
the seasons they want & are quick-shipped to market as soon as buds are
big, & people buy a plant in full flower -- but it's the wrong zone &
though it won't drop dead it won't bloom again either.

Other possibilities:

They set buds a year in advance, & untimely pruning can remove all the
next year's flowers. Correct time to prune is immediately after bloom, as
they set new buds the summer after blooming. Pruning in autumn, winter, or
spring removes those buds.

Fertilizing with nitrogen-rich fertilizer can stop them from blooming.
Kelp or bonemeal is about as much fertilizer as they can stand.

So too overwatering can stop them from setting buds. Sometimes worrying
about a shrub causes a gardener to take extra special good care of it,
meaning watering it way too often & overfertilizing, when it would more
likely thrive on neglect.

Ours do fine in our naturally acidic soils, but sometimes they don't, &amp
if soil is too acidic it might slow them down, & feedings of lime or
wood-ash can help them flower. But don't lime the soil without knowing the
pH as if it doesn't need lime it seriously doesn't need lime.

A shrub planted too deep in the ground will not bloom; it should be
planted on a little hump.

It's rare that lilac buds freeze off, but if there is a harshe late freeze
that hits the buds just as they come out of dormancy, they could all be
killed.

There MIGHT be nothing wrong. If your shrub is really only five years old
total, it would not be at all unusual that it didn't bloom until it was
six years old &amp of substantial size -- it normally takes to to five
full years before they bloom at all. Even somewhat mature lilacs
pot-raised frequently take three to five full years to "settle in" from
the shock of being transplanted into the garden -- six or seven years
would be an unexpected length of time, but five is just within the normal
range of adjustment.

-paghat the ratgirl

Great information and worth saving. Our lilac bush has been planted for
quite a few years (7 or 8) and this is the first year of prolific bloom. I
do have questions, though. There's a heavy undergrowth of new shoots -
should these be removed at (or below) ground level, or even removed at all
because they will replace old growth - and when (and if) should old growth
be removed to encourage flowering?

Dora

In article , Ann
wrote:

(paghat) expounded:


#1 cause of failure to bloom is insufficient sunlight. Ideally they have
morning AND afternoon sun; morning sun alone could well be insufficient.

I guess all the lilacs I've seen around here in partial shade or
planted in a dooryard getting only partial day sun haven't heard this
rule yet. Yes, the prefer sun, but they do find with part-day sun and
filtered shade.

The newer cultivars are the most forgiving. But if you're merely telling
us that in Ookook Land nobody has has ever had any trouble getting lilacs
to bloom, then wow, that's such very special place.

-paghat the ratgirl
--
Get your Paghat the Ratgirl T-Shirt he
http://www.paghat.com/giftshop.html
"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden
people maintaining a free civil government." -Thomas Jefferson

(paghat) expounded:

The newer cultivars are the most forgiving. But if you're merely telling
us that in Ookook Land nobody has has ever had any trouble getting lilacs
to bloom, then wow, that's such very special place.

Lots of newer hybrids planted in dooryards of 250 year old colonials.

I identify where I garden, it's hardly an unknown area. Where you are
lilacs may need more sun because they don't get as much in the rainy
northwest - unless you're on the lee side of the mountains.

I'm pointing out the fact that there are numerous reasons why lilacs
don't flower, one of which is soil pH, the usual case around here in
acid-soil New England. You have experienced the lack of sun thing.
Different environments, different outcomes.

--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

In article , Ann
wrote:

(paghat) expounded:

The newer cultivars are the most forgiving. But if you're merely telling
us that in Ookook Land nobody has has ever had any trouble getting lilacs
to bloom, then wow, that's such very special place.

Lots of newer hybrids planted in dooryards of 250 year old colonials.

Too bad you're just being snotty, as otherwise you would finally have
spoken the truth. If you are seriously claiming the lilacs in your
neighborhood are a quarter-millenia old, why wouldn't I believe you? Could
it be because lilacs never live that long & the oldest lilacs in North
America are a mere 120 years old on Makinac Island?

While wild shrubs were brought to North America in the early 1700s (at
which time they were planted primarily in graveyards) virtually all garden
or front-of-house cultivars presently grown, if they actually are the
oldest ones, date only to the 1880s-1920s. There ARE still a very few
thriving thickets of true wild non-hybridized lilacs dating to the early
1800s in the Northeast, & to the 1840s or 1850s in the Northwest -- not
individually old trees like those profound rarities on Makinac Island of
course, but continuously renewed from suckers & seeds -- none of these
thickets are in peoples' front yards even if the houses are built on
forgotten graveyards, because naturalized wild lilacs need acres of space
& no other cultivation in the vicinity to perpetuate themselves.

If you were a credible witness I'd be truly excited to learn about that
magical colonial neighborhood devoid of modern cultivars (which begin in
Victorian France & began arriving stateside in the 1880s), a neighborhood
which did not participate in the first wave of serious lilac popularity
during the fin d'siecle, but have instead preserved for a quarter-millenia
only the descendants of natural wild graveyard plants just like those from
Transylvania. If it WERE true you shouldn't be kvetching at me for
disbelieving in the little town where time stood still & you can get a
free melmac plate-set with every tank of gas & a flophouse bed for a
nickel a night; rather, you should be writing it up for the horticultural
journals, because it's honestly too darned cool. Just don't add the part
about them blooming in the shade or the editor will know you're makin' it
all up.

Where you are
lilacs may need more sun because they don't get as much in the rainy
northwest - unless you're on the lee side of the mountains.

Making this up as you go along? Don't tell anyone our secret because we
already have too many moving here, but it scarsely ever rains here in the
summer, but only autumn through spring. The Northwest is great lilac
country, & there's hardly a block in any town on Puget Sound without
several. The sun goes down after nine o'clock at night at high summer, so
the lilacs just bask & bask developing their buds for the following
spring.

I'm pointing out the fact that there are numerous reasons why lilacs
don't flower, one of which is soil pH, the usual case around here in
acid-soil New England. You have experienced the lack of sun thing.
Different environments, different outcomes.

Actually my original post noted several & probably all the possible
reasons for failure to bloom including acidity as an occasional cause
especially for those less forgiving early cultivars -- plus I concluded
with my sense that three to five years is a NORMAL length of time for a
some baby lilacs not to have bloomed, so there MIGHT not actually be a
problem. I think it was a good post that insists on no single answer but
gave enough info to assist anyone trying to figure out why THEIR
particular shrubs haven't bloomed.

But you seem to have read only as far as the #1 cause of lilacs failing to
bloom -- then you strangely began to allege that the lilacs in your
neighborhood are 250 years old & bloom in the shade -- which even if you
hadn't made that up wouldn't change the broader realities I outlined.

-paggers
--
Get your Paghat the Ratgirl T-Shirt he
http://www.paghat.com/giftshop.html
"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden
people maintaining a free civil government." -Thomas Jefferson

-snipped-

ANHave you tested soil pH? Lilacs prefer a sweet soil, 6-7, I throw a cup of
ANlime on the rootzone each year and get plenty of blooms (my soil is naturall
ANvery acid, 5 or lower).

Our double blossomed french blues flowered beutifully yesterday
(May 12) here in Medford, in Middlesex county. How about yours?

Ciao, Ack.

---
# SLMR 2.1a # We now the speed of light, but what's the speed of dark?
* Origin: BBS Networks @ www.bbsnets.com [8010] (8:8/62)

By the way, and this is partly to defuse the little uncomfortable exchange
on this thread - scientists seem to have established that the date lilacs
bloom in a given location is predictable to a precise degree - based on
degree days above 40 - or in some versions, degree days above 33.
Here is a typical description:
"Bloom time data on the Hort. Farm lilacs was collected in 1978 -79. Bloom
period and degree-day accumulation to bloom was presented in UVM
Agricultural Experiment Station Research Report 1, 1980, entitled "Flowering
and Fruiting of Woody Ornamental Plants in Vermont." To calculate the degree
day accumulation before bloom we used the accumulated average daily
temperatures above the base temperature of 40°F until bloom. For example, a
day with maximum temperature of 60° and minimum of 38° would result in
average temperature of 49° giving a degree day accumulation of 9 degree
days. The earliest blooming lilac cultivars -- 'Evangeline', 'Minnehaha' and
'Lucie Baltet' commenced bloom May 10 in 1979 with a degree day accumulation
of 350. The latest to bloom were Preston hybrids 'Nocturne', 'Miss Canada'
and 'Elinor' which commenced flowering on June 5 with 911 degree days
accumulated. Using the degree day data, one can predict the date of bloom
for various locations for each cultivar for which we have data. "

Perhaps you are an overdiligent pruner? I recall reading newspaper articles
years ago in which gardeners were warned not to prune off certain twigs that
are near the flower points, because that is where next year's blossoms grow.
Some people were removing theses when they deadheaded.

"Boots" wrote in message
...
My lilac bush does not bloom. It is 5 years old and gets a
half a day of sun. Last summer I had one flower 1/2 " high
and nothing this year. What am I doing wrong?

--
b

I have never pruned them
"Andrew Ostrander" wrote in message
...
Perhaps you are an overdiligent pruner? I recall reading
newspaper articles
years ago in which gardeners were warned not to prune off
certain twigs that
are near the flower points, because that is where next
year's blossoms grow.
Some people were removing theses when they deadheaded.

"Boots" wrote in message
...
My lilac bush does not bloom. It is 5 years old and gets a
half a day of sun. Last summer I had one flower 1/2 " high
and nothing this year. What am I doing wrong?

--
b