It's easy to get ppm from your info. 1 grain (gr.) with a lower case "g" is
65 milligrams (mg.) and a gallon is about a litre. 1 grain per gallon is
therefore about 65 mg/litre = 65 ppm, parts per million. That's good water,
and I grew up with it :-)

6 grains per gallon is a bit harder, almost 400 ppm might be a problem for
Dracula. I have that Dracula here in Northern California and we get Sierra
Nevada runoff, about 60 ppm and it grows fine and blooms. I'm not a very
skilled grower... I've killed at least 100 orchids but am in no way an
expert. Let's see if someone else has better growing information for you.

Paul Simon
"GrlIntrpted" wrote in message
et...
I recently purchased a Dracula erythrochaete and Masdevallia infracta. I
was instructed to use very good quality water with absolutely no sodium
softener, but the water should not be hard. So I wrote to the Department
of
Enviormental Protection agency, and received the following answer:

"The water does not contain a sodium-based softener. Please be advised
that
New York City water is generally considered "soft", and the hardness
depends
on the location. All of Brooklyn, Staten Island, and most of Queens
receives Catskill/Delaware water, which has a hardness of about 1
grain/gallon. Parts of Manhattan and the Bronx receive Catskill/Delaware
water, and parts get Croton water (hardness about 6 grains/gallon). The
total dissolved solids for the Sheepshead area of Brooklyn is
approximately
52 mg/L. "

I'm trying to understand what the above means and was hoping that I can
get
some assistance from the more experienced orchid growers. Will my newly
aquired beauties be able to deal with the water in my area?

Mariana
Brooklyn, NYC 6b

This will depend on how much RO water you need. At the rate I am using
water, and at the cost of the water I can by from the local water shop, it
would take close to ten years for an RO unit to pay for itself; longer when
I set up my rain barrel, which I'd use all the time except winter. I won't
be buying an RO unit until my collection of orchids has grown substantially.
There are a couple stores here that specialize in water treatment systems
for home and small business use, plus some of the big hardware stores have a
limited selection of systems, and the specialty shops, and some of the
grocery and department stores, sell distilled and/or RO water.


Or befriend a graduate student in the life sciences or chemistry.
They have access to more RO or DI water than you can shake a stick at,
and it is free to them... However, I would suggest that a small RO unit
is not that expensive. I think I bought one several years ago which
produced much more than I could use (15-20gpd) for a little over $100.
Hooked it up to my kitchen sink with a little bit of quick connect
hardware and some ingenuity, and collected the water in a plastic trash
can. Cheap solutions are good. At my local store, distilled water is
over a dollar per gallon, so that pays for itself pretty quickly. If
you can get water for $0.10 per gallon, then perhaps it only pays for
itself in the convenience of not lugging gallon jugs of water around the
city.

I've since upgraded to a more elaborate (and correspondingly more
expensive) system, but then again I'm using RO for drinking and cooking
as well now. My new system is worth every penny. I sold the old unit
to a friend for a pittance. You might be able to find a gently used
unit on Ebay or a similar web location for cheap. Or ask around,
somebody in the local society might be giving one away. Or might let
you take a few gallons every once in a while.

Rob

--
Rob's Rules: http://www.msu.edu/~halgren
1) There is always room for one more orchid
2) There is always room for two more orchids
2a. See rule 1
3) When one has insufficient credit to purchase
more orchids, obtain more credit

You're absolutely right. Don't know what I was thinking... Been retired
too long.:-)
That'll help the calculation a lot.
Paul
"Ted Byers" wrote in message
.. .

"Paul Simon" wrote in message
...
It's easy to get ppm from your info. 1 grain (gr.) with a lower case
"g"
is
65 milligrams (mg.) and a gallon is about a litre. 1 grain per gallon
is

Not quite. A quart is about a litre, so a gallon is about 4 litres. But
this depends on which gallon you're using. I can recall the imperial
gallon
used many many years ago in Canada was a little larger than the gallon
used
in the US. John Talpa has given what look like the correct values for use
in the US.

Cheers,

Ted

"Rob Halgren" wrote in message
...


This will depend on how much RO water you need. At the rate I am using
water, and at the cost of the water I can by from the local water shop,
it
would take close to ten years for an RO unit to pay for itself; longer
when
I set up my rain barrel, which I'd use all the time except winter. I
won't
be buying an RO unit until my collection of orchids has grown
substantially.
There are a couple stores here that specialize in water treatment systems
for home and small business use, plus some of the big hardware stores
have a
limited selection of systems, and the specialty shops, and some of the
grocery and department stores, sell distilled and/or RO water.


Or befriend a graduate student in the life sciences or chemistry.
They have access to more RO or DI water than you can shake a stick at,
and it is free to them... However, I would suggest that a small RO unit
is not that expensive. I think I bought one several years ago which
produced much more than I could use (15-20gpd) for a little over $100.
Hooked it up to my kitchen sink with a little bit of quick connect
hardware and some ingenuity, and collected the water in a plastic trash
can. Cheap solutions are good. At my local store, distilled water is
over a dollar per gallon, so that pays for itself pretty quickly. If
you can get water for $0.10 per gallon, then perhaps it only pays for
itself in the convenience of not lugging gallon jugs of water around the
city.

I'll have to look for more suppliers. The least expensive unit I saw was
close to C$1000, and, since Orillia water is quite hard, I was advised to
add a water conditioning unit for an additional, paltry C$1000; and the
installation costs would have been more than the cost of the hardware. But
I pay C$0.20/litre for RO water. And I use about 10 litres a week; more if
I am soaking CHC in preparation for repotting.

Alas, the closest university is well over 100 km away.

Cheers,

Ted

On the pure water thread- we have awful water here in the desert,
and aside from zero-waste RO units, there's really not much you can do
that doesn't waste more water just to make it- or consume energy. A gallon
of distilled water runs you about $.24 in electrical cost. Pricey.

Given that the one thing the desert has is plenty of sun, I made
my own solar water still:

http://members.cox.net/ahicks51/osp/...lar_water.html

It's been in use for just about a year and a half now. Although
every now and again, I need to tweak it or flush it or whatever, it's on
full automatic 99.99% of the time, and feeds into a distilled water
reservoir.

This probably isn't a solution for many of you, but in relatively
warm, sunny climates where the water is pretty lousy, this works great.
Best of all, my trichocentrums love it!

Cheers,

-AJHicks
Chandler, AZ

The e-mail address in the header doesn't work. Sorry.

ve to look for more suppliers. The least expensive unit I saw was
close to C$1000, and, since Orillia water is quite hard, I was advised to
add a water conditioning unit for an additional, paltry C$1000; and the
installation costs would have been more than the cost of the hardware. But
I pay C$0.20/litre for RO water. And I use about 10 litres a week; more if
I am soaking CHC in preparation for repotting.



Seems very high... Even in Canadian dollars. That is about $650US
(according to the last 'cheque' I cashed). Could get a darn fine system
for that.

http://www.clearwater-az.com/ # Selling a system with a tank for
$80US. That seems _too_ cheap, but it is only 10gal/day.
http://www.havapure.com/ # A bigger system for $160US. Again, no
affiliation. I just found it on google.

Anyway, those both have storage tanks. You can probably get even
cheaper without a tank. I must say, I paid on the order of $1000US for
my new system, and it is worth every penny (two tanks, faucets, pump,
fairly large capacity, and expert installation). For complicated
things, there is no substitute for a skilled water professional. But a
cheap system mounted on a board and collecting the water in a garbage
can is fine for plants. For the deluxe system, get a stock tank float
valve (for livestock watering) and hook that up to the garbage can. $10
bucks maybe?

I wouldn't worry too much about the water pre-conditioning, if you
have a TDS meter you can check your output water quality frequently.
Unless your water stands up on its own... If you blow the membrane, you
will be able to tell. Might have to change the filters a little more
frequently. But then again, I'm not a professional. I don't even play
one on TV*.

Rob (*TiVo, actually, I haven't seen a commercial in 3 months...)

--
Rob's Rules: http://www.msu.edu/~halgren
1) There is always room for one more orchid
2) There is always room for two more orchids
2a. See rule 1
3) When one has insufficient credit to purchase
more orchids, obtain more credit

I have used evil tap water. (PH @ 8.0-9.5 and TDS around 250) on
orchids for short term. I still use this on most of my container house
plants. For the last two years I used only bottled distilled water on
the orchids and added small amounts of fert and PH up or down to get
it in the 6.5 range. The start of this year I set up an RO/DI 6 stage
with UV and pump (I use it for drinking, cooking, the kittys water,
and the orchids) People say that the PH swings wildly so I test
regularly and it has been very consistently in the 6 to 6.5 range
right out of the ten gallon tank. Total cost over three hundred
bucks, but I have two taps and two diff feeds upstairs and down and an
outside holding tanks with pumps for misting on the deck during the
day when it gets hot and dry. I was paying over forty bucks a month
for eight five gal. btls of distilled that I had to lug in, set up,
store and set back out for return. It has been worth every penny so
far.

Goodgrowintoyall
NANOOK

On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 11:10:22 -0400, "Ted Byers"
wrote:

So, I would suggest that you find out which source provides water to your
home. Then, determine the minimum water requirements for the plants. If
your water is too hard, you will need a reverse osmosis unit to get the
quality you need.


This will depend on how much RO water you need. At the rate I am using
water, and at the cost of the water I can by from the local water shop, it
would take close to ten years for an RO unit to pay for itself; longer when
I set up my rain barrel, which I'd use all the time except winter. I won't
be buying an RO unit until my collection of orchids has grown substantially.
There are a couple stores here that specialize in water treatment systems
for home and small business use, plus some of the big hardware stores have a
limited selection of systems, and the specialty shops, and some of the
grocery and department stores, sell distilled and/or RO water.

I'd suggest you compute how much water you need to use, and from that, along
with the price per litre and the cost of a suitably sized RO unit, compute
how long it would take to pay for itself, and then decide whether you need
to buy an RO unit or just buy the water. Another consideration is whether
or not you can use rainwater. I'd assume you can take a sample somewhere
locally to have it tested (I'd be concerned about airborne contaminants).

Cheers,

Ted

As a current resident of Rego Park, Queens, and a former resident of
Park Slope, Brooklyn I am quite familiar with NYC tap water....I would
worry far more about NYC climate for your Draculas, as its quickly
killed any I have tried...but do not worry about the water! NYC tapwater
is about as good as tap water can get, soft, and with a neutral to near
neutral (6.9) ph. It is perfectly safe on all orchids, including the Cyp
acaule that I have in my garden. Because of its softness, you should be
careful with the pH of your fertilizers. I use Dynagro, and use Prtekt
to adjust the pH of my fertilizer to about 6.5-6.8...The water is only
minimally chlorinated. It does contain trace amounts of phosphate...fine
for plants, but bad for my reef tank in the long run. To deal with that,
I got a Tap Water Purifer by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals (sells for about
$45 or so on any online pet dealer...more expensive in stores). Its a
deionizer....and our water is so good that a single cartridge can last
for 4-5 months before changing. Take care, Eric Muehlbauer is pleasant
Queens, NY, enjoying the spectacular Paph emersonii I bloomed, using NYC
water....11 cm across and fragrant!