Hi,

I've been reading this newsgroup off and on and without a doubt there
are many ways to solve all sorts of problems. In fact, there seems to be
more knowledge in this news group than in any of my local pond stores.
On the other hand, the knowledge in this news group is sometimes
contradictory and sometimes vague; what works in one pond doesn't always
work in another. For example, when people complain about algae one
response is "shade the pond", yet some ponds are in full sun all day and
the water is clear. Or people suggest putting in water hyacinth but the
plants turn yellow, no matter what chemicals are added to the pond. So
there's a lot of knowledge here but it's not complete. I'd like to fill
in some of the gaps and find out what consistently works across a lot of
ponds.

My idea is to have people describe, with a lot of detail, what their
pond is like and what does or doesn't work for them. This would be done
with a survey that asked about pond size, shape, fish and plant load,
filter type, maintenance, and as much as we can think of. This info is
put in a data base. After we have a few hundred ponds described some
form of statistical pattern recognition, or data mining, is applied to
the data to look for some rules of thumb that aren't commonly known. We
could than put the results in a faq.

If this sounds interesting and you'd like to help, let me know. I can
write software to create surveys and data bases, but a few people should
think about the questions. Also, I haven't done much with data mining
and I can figure out enough to get it to work but if you have
experience, let me know.


Thanks,


Matt

btw, remove NOSPAM from the return address to get something that works.

I could lend a hand to something like this.

I am probably the other end of the pond person spectrum in that I pay very
little attention to my pond, after doing almost all the *wrong* things when
setting it up.

Hole in ground in full sun under tree.
Liner.
Primitive filter on too small capacity pump.
Anacaris and Water Lilly.
Pee gravel bottom.
Dollar a dozen feeder gold fish to start.
--------
That was two years ago
Water is clear
Lillys bloom
Anacaris Bloom
Never lost a fish - despite raccoons and cats.
Largest fish are now six inches long
Have twice as many fish now from offspring.
--------
GO FIGURE !



"Matt Rosing" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've been reading this newsgroup off and on and without a doubt there
are many ways to solve all sorts of problems. In fact, there seems to be
more knowledge in this news group than in any of my local pond stores.
On the other hand, the knowledge in this news group is sometimes
contradictory and sometimes vague; what works in one pond doesn't always
work in another. For example, when people complain about algae one
response is "shade the pond", yet some ponds are in full sun all day and
the water is clear. Or people suggest putting in water hyacinth but the
plants turn yellow, no matter what chemicals are added to the pond. So
there's a lot of knowledge here but it's not complete. I'd like to fill
in some of the gaps and find out what consistently works across a lot of
ponds.

My idea is to have people describe, with a lot of detail, what their
pond is like and what does or doesn't work for them. This would be done
with a survey that asked about pond size, shape, fish and plant load,
filter type, maintenance, and as much as we can think of. This info is
put in a data base. After we have a few hundred ponds described some
form of statistical pattern recognition, or data mining, is applied to
the data to look for some rules of thumb that aren't commonly known. We
could than put the results in a faq.

If this sounds interesting and you'd like to help, let me know. I can
write software to create surveys and data bases, but a few people should
think about the questions. Also, I haven't done much with data mining
and I can figure out enough to get it to work but if you have
experience, let me know.


Thanks,


Matt

btw, remove NOSPAM from the return address to get something that works.

Matt Rosing wrote:
Hi,


there's a lot of knowledge here but it's not complete. I'd like to fill
in some of the gaps and find out what consistently works across a lot of
ponds.



Thanks,


Matt

btw, remove NOSPAM from the return address to get something that works.



--

Mat
we do have a faq someplace but part of the problem is we have ponds
from below sea level to 8000 ft elevation, USDA zone 10 to zone 3, in
most of the United states England Holland Austrailia Canada Africa, some
of us with veggie filters, small to masive bio filters, no filters atall
we ar keeping Koi Goldfish Sturgeons bass carp et all in the ponds from
two or three to a couple hundred
there are just too many variables to come up with any hard and fast rules

all we can do is ask a question sift through the solutions and hope we
choose the one that will work in our particular situation.



John Rutz
Z5 New Mexico

good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad
judgement

see my pond at:

http://www.fuerjefe.com

I'm going to guess that the clearest ponds are the ones with the lowest
stocking. (Unless you are talking super-ponders, who can turn a sewer into a
grade AAA koi pond within a month ;-)

But if you come up with questions I'll answer them!
My pond is crystal clear :-)



k30a

Would you post that faq please?

~Wilson~


John Rutz wrote in message
...


Matt Rosing wrote:
Hi,


there's a lot of knowledge here but it's not complete. I'd like to fill
in some of the gaps and find out what consistently works across a lot of
ponds.



Thanks,


Matt

btw, remove NOSPAM from the return address to get something that works.



--

Mat
we do have a faq someplace but part of the problem is we have ponds
from below sea level to 8000 ft elevation, USDA zone 10 to zone 3, in
most of the United states England Holland Austrailia Canada Africa, some
of us with veggie filters, small to masive bio filters, no filters atall
we ar keeping Koi Goldfish Sturgeons bass carp et all in the ponds from
two or three to a couple hundred
there are just too many variables to come up with any hard and fast rules

all we can do is ask a question sift through the solutions and hope we
choose the one that will work in our particular situation.



John Rutz
Z5 New Mexico

good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad
judgement

see my pond at:

http://www.fuerjefe.com

we do have a faq someplace but part of the problem is we have ponds
from below sea level to 8000 ft elevation, USDA zone 10 to zone 3, in
most of the United states England Holland Austrailia Canada Africa,
some of us with veggie filters, small to masive bio filters, no filters
atall
we ar keeping Koi Goldfish Sturgeons bass carp et all in the ponds
from two or three to a couple hundred
there are just too many variables to come up with any hard and fast rules

This is the whole point of data mining. There are too many variables and
people can't see the patterns or rules. So mathematical techniques are
used to find correlations in the data. Given the wide variety of ponds
maybe 5000 surveys are needed, I don't know. But the more there are the
better.

all we can do is ask a question sift through the solutions and hope we
choose the one that will work in our particular situation.

Again, data mining might remove some of the guess work.

Here's the FAQ ...

http://www.geocities.com/justinm090/faq.html

--
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836
http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118
"Wilson" wrote in message
...
Would you post that faq please?

~Wilson~


John Rutz wrote in message
...


Matt Rosing wrote:
Hi,


there's a lot of knowledge here but it's not complete. I'd like to
fill
in some of the gaps and find out what consistently works across a lot
of
ponds.



Thanks,


Matt

btw, remove NOSPAM from the return address to get something that
works.



--

Mat
we do have a faq someplace but part of the problem is we have ponds
from below sea level to 8000 ft elevation, USDA zone 10 to zone 3, in
most of the United states England Holland Austrailia Canada Africa, some
of us with veggie filters, small to masive bio filters, no filters atall
we ar keeping Koi Goldfish Sturgeons bass carp et all in the ponds from
two or three to a couple hundred
there are just too many variables to come up with any hard and fast
rules

all we can do is ask a question sift through the solutions and hope we
choose the one that will work in our particular situation.



John Rutz
Z5 New Mexico

good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad
judgement

see my pond at:

http://www.fuerjefe.com

Gee, someone wanting us to talk about our ponds...in detail! I'm in!

--
Wendy* in N. California,

"Beautiful young people are accidents of nature, but beautiful old people
are works of art." Eleanor Roosevelt


"Matt Rosing" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I've been reading this newsgroup off and on and without a doubt there
are many ways to solve all sorts of problems. In fact, there seems to be
more knowledge in this news group than in any of my local pond stores.
On the other hand, the knowledge in this news group is sometimes
contradictory and sometimes vague; what works in one pond doesn't always
work in another. For example, when people complain about algae one
response is "shade the pond", yet some ponds are in full sun all day and
the water is clear. Or people suggest putting in water hyacinth but the
plants turn yellow, no matter what chemicals are added to the pond. So
there's a lot of knowledge here but it's not complete. I'd like to fill
in some of the gaps and find out what consistently works across a lot of
ponds.

My idea is to have people describe, with a lot of detail, what their
pond is like and what does or doesn't work for them. This would be done
with a survey that asked about pond size, shape, fish and plant load,
filter type, maintenance, and as much as we can think of. This info is
put in a data base. After we have a few hundred ponds described some
form of statistical pattern recognition, or data mining, is applied to
the data to look for some rules of thumb that aren't commonly known. We
could than put the results in a faq.

If this sounds interesting and you'd like to help, let me know. I can
write software to create surveys and data bases, but a few people should
think about the questions. Also, I haven't done much with data mining
and I can figure out enough to get it to work but if you have
experience, let me know.


Thanks,


Matt

btw, remove NOSPAM from the return address to get something that works.

Okay ... so what the heck is "data mining" ?

Nedra

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836
http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118
"Matt Rosing" wrote in message
...
we do have a faq someplace but part of the problem is we have ponds
from below sea level to 8000 ft elevation, USDA zone 10 to zone 3, in
most of the United states England Holland Austrailia Canada Africa,
some of us with veggie filters, small to masive bio filters, no filters
atall
we ar keeping Koi Goldfish Sturgeons bass carp et all in the ponds
from two or three to a couple hundred
there are just too many variables to come up with any hard and fast
rules

This is the whole point of data mining. There are too many variables and
people can't see the patterns or rules. So mathematical techniques are
used to find correlations in the data. Given the wide variety of ponds
maybe 5000 surveys are needed, I don't know. But the more there are the
better.

all we can do is ask a question sift through the solutions and hope we
choose the one that will work in our particular situation.

Again, data mining might remove some of the guess work.

Nedra wrote:

Okay ... so what the heck is "data mining" ?

In a nutshell. You collect as much data about a subject you can then do
statistical analysis on it to try to determine any trends or other useless
information. Like:

- All people who have ponds tend to like other animals

Or

- All people who have ponds have been picked up by their local psychiatric
police more than once.



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joe wrote - All people who have ponds have been picked up by their local
psychiatric
police more than once.

You mean they are going to come back?????
ak! Better hide the hand knitted fish sweaters I was going to introduce this
winter...


k30a

joe wrote:
Nedra wrote:


Okay ... so what the heck is "data mining" ?


In a nutshell. You collect as much data about a subject you can then do
statistical analysis on it to try to determine any trends or other useless
information. Like:



Or

- All people who have ponds have been picked up by their local psychiatric
police more than once.



hey did you get my answers already i dont remember filling out hte form


John Rutz
Z5 New Mexico

good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad
judgement

see my pond at:

http://www.fuerjefe.com

K30a wrote:
joe wrote - All people who have ponds have been picked up by their local
psychiatric
police more than once.

You mean they are going to come back?????
ak! Better hide the hand knitted fish sweaters I was going to introduce this
winter...


k30a

I thought I was the only one knitting sweaters. I started
with wool but then I thought it might shrink and harm the
fishes so I switcheed to acrylic yarn ;-)

--
Bonnie
NJ
http://home.earthlink.net/~maebe43/

"Wendy Kelly Budd" wrote in message
...
Gee, someone wanting us to talk about our ponds...in detail! I'm in!

--
Wendy* in N. California,

Ditto for this small ponder in zone 5b!

NJ

Matt Rosing wrote:

If this sounds interesting and you'd like to help, let me know. I can
write software to create surveys and data bases, but a few people should
think about the questions. Also, I haven't done much with data mining
and I can figure out enough to get it to work but if you have
experience, let me know.

Well, I may be able to help you out. I'm a web admin and have access to
some web survey software (I'm the admin for that too) that makes
creating a web based survey pretty simple. It also allows you to export
the data in tab delimited format so it can be brought into just about
anything for analysis. I also have some experience with analysis. *grin*

Susan
shsimko at duke dot edu
(don't bother doing a reply, use the above address as netscape.net is
simply a spam trap)