"George.com" wrote
snip
I use large supermarket plastic bags for bin liners (I need about 1 a
week) snip

I do that too.

Over here the major supermarkets provide a bin for recycling their old
used plastic bags. Perhaps you could get them to do the same where you
shop. If enough people demanded it they should listen.

The bigger places also do large boxes made of recycled plastic that you
buy and then use each time you shop.

I recall my local Sainsbury's providing paper sacks at one time but that
didn't seem to last long. I think people probably didn't find them
durable enough, e.g if it was raining, and handle-less bags are not much
good for anyone without a car needing to carry shopping home. I've also
read that paper sacks use more resources to make and transport than
plastic ones.

--
Sue

"Sue" wrote in message
reenews.net...

"George.com" wrote
snip
I use large supermarket plastic bags for bin liners (I need about 1 a
week) snip

I do that too.

Over here the major supermarkets provide a bin for recycling their old
used plastic bags. Perhaps you could get them to do the same where you
shop. If enough people demanded it they should listen.

we have those too Sue however I would rather reduce on the manufacture than
recycle. Reduce comes before recycle on the enviro hierarchy. A large
national retailer of cheap(ish), often made in china products, has plastic
bags with a large RECYCLE emblazened acorss them with a much small reduce
and a far smaller reuse. I simply tell the checkout operator no plastic bags
please and why. I use a cardboard box for groceries that the supermarket
puts out after stacking shelves.

rob

The best way is to reduce packaging use and change our life style. The
marketing communication promote wrong behaviours as cool models for
people. TV ask to all consumers to buy a lot of useless stuff every
day. I never see a sit com where the actors say stupid to someone
because he has a big polluting car or because someone forgot the light
on.. etc.. The first problem is our culture. I usually don't buy
products with useless packaging I prefer buy product using my own bag
and so on.. We have to work on comunication. On the other side,
according to the oil higher price plastic price is rising up very fast.
So the plastic scraps value is now higher than one years ago. If
everybody knows that plastic scrap has value and that it's better
recycle than disposal.
Try to check some waste stock exchange
www.recycle.net
www.wastexchange.co.uk

Sue wrote:
"George.com" wrote
snip
I use large supermarket plastic bags for bin liners (I need about 1 a
week) snip

I do that too.

Over here the major supermarkets provide a bin for recycling their old
used plastic bags. Perhaps you could get them to do the same where you
shop. If enough people demanded it they should listen.

The bigger places also do large boxes made of recycled plastic that you
buy and then use each time you shop.

I recall my local Sainsbury's providing paper sacks at one time but that
didn't seem to last long. I think people probably didn't find them
durable enough, e.g if it was raining, and handle-less bags are not much
good for anyone without a car needing to carry shopping home. I've also
read that paper sacks use more resources to make and transport than
plastic ones.


over here in Ireland plastic shopping bags used to be everywhere;
we have bad litter problems and the plastic bags were a very visible
sign of that; you got them all over roadsides and in hedges and fences
etc. We spent years trying to ask people to use re-usable bags or
boxes etc. That had almost no effect but it did allow me to feel very
superior everytime I asked for no bag and used my backsack for small
purchases. Eventually, the solution was very direct and simple. It
became illegal to give plastic bags away for shopping. You could still
get them but you had to ask for them and pay a tiny fee (15cents a bag
or so). It worked overnight. They have disappeared from the
countryside (at least the fresh ones have). Now, whenever you go to
the supermarked, you have to remember to bring 4 or 5 reusable ones
(made of cloth/canvas of some kind and that last about a year) or get
boxes or buy your bags. At first you can never remember to bring teh
bags; now it is second nature. It really worked.

Des in Dublin


--
Sue

wrote
over here in Ireland plastic shopping bags used to be everywhere;
we have bad litter problems and the plastic bags were a very visible
sign of that; you got them all over roadsides and in hedges and fences
etc. We spent years trying to ask people to use re-usable bags or
boxes etc. That had almost no effect but it did allow me to feel very
superior everytime I asked for no bag and used my backsack for small
purchases. Eventually, the solution was very direct and simple. It
became illegal to give plastic bags away for shopping. You could
still get them but you had to ask for them and pay a tiny fee (15cents
a bag or so). It worked overnight. They have disappeared from the
countryside (at least the fresh ones have). Now, whenever you go to
the supermarked, you have to remember to bring 4 or 5 reusable ones
(made of cloth/canvas of some kind and that last about a year) or get
boxes or buy your bags. At first you can never remember to bring teh
bags; now it is second nature. It really worked.

Yes I think that would certainly change things. I agree it's awful to
see the amount of plastic blowing around and stuck in roadside hedges
etc but sadly it's true that it takes a charge, however small, to
concentrate people's minds on not being careless with most resources.
I'm sure it would encourage me to remember to take bags to reuse more
often. I can't see the big supermarkets doing it here on their own
initiative though, as they'd each be wary of the others gaining some
advantage in pricing, so it probably would need legislating for. When
you think about it lots of seemingly minor law changes like that could
have quite big results in lots of ways.

--
Sue

The message ews.net
from "Sue" contains these words:

Yes I think that would certainly change things. I agree it's awful to
see the amount of plastic blowing around and stuck in roadside hedges
etc but sadly it's true that it takes a charge, however small, to
concentrate people's minds on not being careless with most resources.
I'm sure it would encourage me to remember to take bags to reuse more
often. I can't see the big supermarkets doing it here on their own
initiative though, as they'd each be wary of the others gaining some
advantage in pricing, so it probably would need legislating for.

The Co-op (and Sainsbury iirc) provides "bags for life" for a
single payment of 10 p each. It's strong plastic and lasts multiple
uses; when it wears out they give you a new one in exchange for the old
one which is recycled.

If you buy 6 bottles of wine the Co-op provide free , even stronger
foldable bags with divisions for 6 bottles. With the internal sections
cut out, those bags last indefinitely. For the diehards who use neither,
their flimsiest plastic carriers are biodegradeable.

We used to carry car-shopping home in used cardboard cartons but
supermarkets here are no longer allowed to keep them stacked where the
public can take one..fire hazard or some such rubbish.

Janet.

Janet Baraclough wrote:
The message ews.net
from "Sue" contains these words:

Yes I think that would certainly change things. I agree it's awful to
see the amount of plastic blowing around and stuck in roadside hedges
etc but sadly it's true that it takes a charge, however small, to
concentrate people's minds on not being careless with most resources.
I'm sure it would encourage me to remember to take bags to reuse more
often. I can't see the big supermarkets doing it here on their own
initiative though, as they'd each be wary of the others gaining some
advantage in pricing, so it probably would need legislating for.

The Co-op (and Sainsbury iirc) provides "bags for life" for a
single payment of 10 p each. It's strong plastic and lasts multiple
uses; when it wears out they give you a new one in exchange for the old
one which is recycled.

If you buy 6 bottles of wine the Co-op provide free , even stronger
foldable bags with divisions for 6 bottles. With the internal sections
cut out, those bags last indefinitely. For the diehards who use neither,
their flimsiest plastic carriers are biodegradeable.

We used to carry car-shopping home in used cardboard cartons but
supermarkets here are no longer allowed to keep them stacked where the
public can take one..fire hazard or some such rubbish.


clearly, in your case, you already do the right thing. In Ireland
quite a few people used to do this but the great majority (like in UK I
presume) did not and plastic bags got everywhere. Now most people do
it like you and all it took was a small law change.
It really worked (make it illegal to give plastic bags for nothing; you
must charge for them).


Janet.

The message .com
from contains these words:


clearly, in your case, you already do the right thing. In Ireland
quite a few people used to do this but the great majority (like in UK I
presume) did not and plastic bags got everywhere. Now most people do
it like you and all it took was a small law change.
It really worked (make it illegal to give plastic bags for nothing; you
must charge for them).

I don't dispute it worked, only (Sue's claim) that UK supermarkets
will take no action unless forced: they already do take action. IMHO
the problem is that so many of the public, given a choice, choose
mess. Its the public who won't stop littering unless forced.


Janet

. Its the public who won't stop littering unless forced.


Janet

MESS!!! You have seen nothing unless you have been to Sri Lanka. We called
in at Colombo on our recent Round the World Cruise on Aurora and we were
shocked at the litter and mess in the streets. And what did they do when it
got tooooooooooooooo bad? Pile it up against a wall/lampost/telephone pole
and set fire to it!!!

By the way Janet, you may recall you took a poke at me before I left on the
World Cruise, and put the report up about Aurora's 2005 World Cruise
problems, well I am delighted to say that the World Cruise this year, all 3
months of it, went off without a hitch :-))

Mike


--
------------------------------------------------
Royal Naval Electrical Branch Association
www.rnshipmates.co.uk
International Festival of the Sea 28th June - 1st July 2007

Janet Baraclough writes
The message .com
from contains these words:


clearly, in your case, you already do the right thing. In Ireland
quite a few people used to do this but the great majority (like in UK I
presume) did not and plastic bags got everywhere. Now most people do
it like you and all it took was a small law change.
It really worked (make it illegal to give plastic bags for nothing; you
must charge for them).

I don't dispute it worked, only (Sue's claim) that UK supermarkets
will take no action unless forced: they already do take action.

They haven't taken the critical action of withdrawing the free plastic
bags.

IMHO
the problem is that so many of the public, given a choice, choose
mess. Its the public who won't stop littering unless forced.

And well meaning initiatives like not allowing traders to dump their
waste free at recycling centres knocks on to more illegal dumping on
'waste ground' - aka green space in our urban centres.
--
Kay