Hi Everyone

Thanks for the welcoming messages when I introduced myself to the group the
other day.

OK, here goes my first question about my new garden: does anyone have any
experience of growing cardoon? It's one of the few plants in my new
allotment that isn't a weed, and is looking particularly healthy right now
with beautiful purple flowers. A Google search for it suggests that I've
probably missed my chance to eat the heads this year, as you have to get
them before they start flowering, but I can maybe eat the stems in a few
weeks time.

Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how to
get the best out of it? Any recipes?

Many thanks
Adam

On 29/7/06 08:37, in article ,
"Adam" wrote:

snip

Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how to
get the best out of it? Any recipes?

We grow ours in the garden for ornament only and they are indeed, very
striking and beautiful plants. But if you want to eat them, I think it's
the leaf part only and they have to be wrapped in cardboard to blanch them,
or so I read at one time. The general feeling appears to be that it's a bit
of a faff and that you're better of growing artichokes for food and cardoons
for ornament.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(email address on website)

Sacha writes
On 29/7/06 08:37, in article ,
"Adam" wrote:

snip

Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how to
get the best out of it? Any recipes?

We grow ours in the garden for ornament only and they are indeed, very
striking and beautiful plants. But if you want to eat them, I think it's
the leaf part only and they have to be wrapped in cardboard to blanch them,
or so I read at one time. The general feeling appears to be that it's a bit
of a faff and that you're better of growing artichokes for food and cardoons
for ornament.

Vilmorin-Andrieux "The Vegetable Garden" (first pub 1885): "The blanched
stalks or ribs of the inner leaves are chiefly used as a winter
vegetable, as well as the main root, which is thick, fleshy, tender and
of an agreeable flavour. Cooked in a delicate way, it is excellent, but
with the ordinary cook, this, like many another good vegetable, is
easily spoiled. The degree of tenderness to which it is boiled should be
studied, and the sauce should not be rank with salt and spice after the
vulgar fashion"

"Unlike the Artichoke, which is almost always propagated by means of
offsets, the Cardoon is always raised from seed....if treated in the
same way as celery [it] will generally be found to succeed; the only
difference there is in the mode of blanching, which requires more care
than in blanching celery" He suggests wrapping in matting surrounded by
hay so only the tips of the leaves are visible and then earthing up, but
if you have only a few plants, then use a drainpipe.

He refers to several varieties - Prickly Tours, Smooth Solid, Long
Spanish, Artichoke-leaved and Red-stemmed.
--
Kay

"Sacha" wrote in message
...
On 29/7/06 08:37, in article ,
"Adam" wrote:

snip

Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how
to
get the best out of it? Any recipes?

We grow ours in the garden for ornament only and they are indeed, very
striking and beautiful plants. But if you want to eat them, I think it's
the leaf part only and they have to be wrapped in cardboard to blanch
them,
or so I read at one time. The general feeling appears to be that it's a
bit
of a faff and that you're better of growing artichokes for food and
cardoons
for ornament.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(email address on website)

They are two seperate plants which do look similar, Cardoons are normally
eaten like celary and are quite disgusting (but beautifull in the garden)
Artichokes are a better eat but are less satisfactory in a herbaceous
setting!
As to growing cardoons - try stopping them! some people remove the flower
heads (I don't) If you want more then root cuttings are easier than seed
which for the size of seed head are few and of poor viability.

--
Charlie, gardening in Cornwall.
http://www.roselandhouse.co.uk
Holders of National Plant Collection of Clematis viticella (cvs)

"Adam" wrote in message
...
Hi Everyone

Thanks for the welcoming messages when I introduced myself to the group
the other day.

OK, here goes my first question about my new garden: does anyone have any
experience of growing cardoon? It's one of the few plants in my new
allotment that isn't a weed, and is looking particularly healthy right now
with beautiful purple flowers. A Google search for it suggests that I've
probably missed my chance to eat the heads this year, as you have to get
them before they start flowering, but I can maybe eat the stems in a few
weeks time.

Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how to
get the best out of it? Any recipes?

Many thanks
Adam


If it really is a Cardoon and not an Artichoke then you can have a go at
eating the blanched stems as per Kay's article.
However, I assure you that regardless of how they are cooked they are
disgusting. It is not as if you could acquire a taste for them.
I grow both Artichoke and Cardoon, the later can have either red or blue
flowers but I never find the cardoons to be as vigorous or as majestic as
the Artichokes.

On 29/7/06 09:36, in article ,
"Charlie Pridham" wrote:


"Sacha" wrote in message
...
snip

We grow ours in the garden for ornament only and they are indeed, very
striking and beautiful plants. But if you want to eat them, I think it's
the leaf part only and they have to be wrapped in cardboard to blanch
them,
or so I read at one time. The general feeling appears to be that it's a
bit
of a faff and that you're better of growing artichokes for food and
cardoons
for ornament.


They are two seperate plants which do look similar, Cardoons are normally
eaten like celary and are quite disgusting (but beautifull in the garden)
Artichokes are a better eat but are less satisfactory in a herbaceous
setting!
As to growing cardoons - try stopping them! some people remove the flower
heads (I don't) If you want more then root cuttings are easier than seed
which for the size of seed head are few and of poor viability.

Kay's post has shown that they can be blanched and then eaten and how. And
when I did a Google, I read that they were very popular with Victorian
cooks. I must say that I find even artichokes a bore to eat * so much
effort for so little result tends to be my reaction!
When I first encountered cardoons I planted *three* together at the side of
a large pond, not realising the size they got to! In fact, it turned out to
be a happy accident because one keeled over for some reason but the other
two went from strength to strength and were, quite literally, traffic
stoppers. I think they're wonderful things but I couldn't bear to wrap them
up and hide them so that I could eat them!
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(email address on website)

In article ,
"Adam" writes:
|
| OK, here goes my first question about my new garden: does anyone have any
| experience of growing cardoon? It's one of the few plants in my new
| allotment that isn't a weed, and is looking particularly healthy right now
| with beautiful purple flowers. A Google search for it suggests that I've
| probably missed my chance to eat the heads this year, as you have to get
| them before they start flowering, but I can maybe eat the stems in a few
| weeks time.

No, it is the young, blanched, stems that are eaten.

| Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how to
| get the best out of it? Any recipes?

I grew them; they taste like repulsant snozzcombers. Bitter as hell,
even when throughly blanched (in both senses).


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article ,
"Adam" writes:
|
| OK, here goes my first question about my new garden: does anyone have
any
| experience of growing cardoon? It's one of the few plants in my new
| allotment that isn't a weed, and is looking particularly healthy right
now
| with beautiful purple flowers. A Google search for it suggests that
I've
| probably missed my chance to eat the heads this year, as you have to
get
| them before they start flowering, but I can maybe eat the stems in a
few
| weeks time.

No, it is the young, blanched, stems that are eaten.

| Does anyone have any experience with cardoon? Any hints or tips for how
to
| get the best out of it? Any recipes?

I grew them; they taste like repulsant snozzcombers. Bitter as hell,
even when throughly blanched (in both senses).


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.
I agree with Sacha that artichokes are much the better culinary plant. I
have cardoons and artichokes in the garden and have grown both in Cheshire
and Devon.
Both require a sunny open spot and would look well in the flower border. The
flowers are extremely beautiful and dry to an iridescent mauve head which in
some areas is highly prized by flower arrangers.(I heard a figure of £25 a
head in 1998). I had to catch the flowers just fully open to dry to the best
shape and colour, but the indoor display lasted for over a year.
As for taste artichokes are delicious this year growing to tennis ball size
without forming a coarse choke.
Our cardoons blanched as celery have a rather undistinguished bland taste-I
know they're reputed to be bitter. I treat them as perennials and they are
becoming overshadowed by trees. I am debating whether to move them to a
sunny spot as specimen plants but have written them of as a culinary
vegetable.
regards
David T

In article ,
"david taylor" writes:
|
| Our cardoons blanched as celery have a rather undistinguished bland taste-I
| know they're reputed to be bitter. I treat them as perennials and they are
| becoming overshadowed by trees. I am debating whether to move them to a
| sunny spot as specimen plants but have written them of as a culinary
| vegetable.

Are you one of the people who can distinguish bitter from sour? For
example, which is bitter and which sour of lemon and grapefruit juice?


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
Martin writes:
|
| Are you one of the people who can distinguish bitter from sour? For
| example, which is bitter and which sour of lemon and grapefruit juice?
|
| Lemon sour
| Grapefruit bitter
| ?

About half of the UK can't do that. I am interested that you didn't
find them bitter, because the ones I ate were well blanched and as
bitter as hell.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Martin writes:
|
| Are you one of the people who can distinguish bitter from sour? For
| example, which is bitter and which sour of lemon and grapefruit juice?
|
| Lemon sour
| Grapefruit bitter
| ?

About half of the UK can't do that. I am interested that you didn't
find them bitter, because the ones I ate were well blanched and as
bitter as hell.

I am indeed able to distinguish between bitterness and acidity. My
cardoons were insipid if you require a more accurate description.
A week ago I acidently put a flat bug into my mouth-it was sitting on the
other side of a raspberries I had picked.
It emmitted an extremely hot and bitter fluid. Charles Darwin used to keep
captured beetles in his mouth and had commented that on had emitted a bitter
discharge as a protective measure. Try one of these if you wish to broaden
your experience.
Regards
David T
Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"david taylor" wrote in message
...

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Martin writes:
|
| Are you one of the people who can distinguish bitter from sour? For
| example, which is bitter and which sour of lemon and grapefruit
juice?
|
| Lemon sour
| Grapefruit bitter
| ?

About half of the UK can't do that. I am interested that you didn't
find them bitter, because the ones I ate were well blanched and as
bitter as hell.

I am indeed able to distinguish between bitterness and acidity. My
cardoons were insipid if you require a more accurate description.
A week ago I acidently put a flat bug into my mouth-it was sitting on the
other side of a raspberries I had picked.
It emmitted an extremely hot and bitter fluid. Charles Darwin used to keep
captured beetles in his mouth and had commented that on had emitted a
bitter discharge as a protective measure. Try one of these if you wish to
broaden your experience.
Regards
David T
Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

P.S
I think Nick Maclaren and I may be talking at cross purposes. The stems of
cardoons immediately below the flower heads and above the leaves are very
bitter-flavour like dandelion(unblanched), hops or the highly convoluted
Indian concurbit whose name I don't remember.
The recommended blanching procedure is to tie up the leaves when the plant
has stopped growing around mid September, wrap paper or polythene round the
plant, earth up and leave for a month. This is more than just immersing the
stems in boiling water and in my case has resulted in an insipid tasting
vegetable.
Maybe there is an optimum procedure that neither of us have discovered
Regards
David T

In article ,
"david taylor" writes:
|
| I think Nick Maclaren and I may be talking at cross purposes. The stems of
| cardoons immediately below the flower heads and above the leaves are very
| bitter-flavour like dandelion(unblanched), hops or the highly convoluted
| Indian concurbit whose name I don't remember.

Not really.

| The recommended blanching procedure is to tie up the leaves when the plant
| has stopped growing around mid September, wrap paper or polythene round the
| plant, earth up and leave for a month. This is more than just immersing the
| stems in boiling water and in my case has resulted in an insipid tasting
| vegetable.

I blanched them in seakale pots, though while they were growing, used
only the inner stems, and then blanched them in the cooking sense.
That matched some references I had. It is possible that the variety
I grew didn't lose its bitterness, or that only ypur process works.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.