We all know what a "fruit" or a "vegetable" are. They are plant
products which are soft and wet and have limited storage life. They
die, then they rot, and who wants to eat rotten fruit and vegetables?

But what is a "grain"? It seems to me that a grain is a plant product
which is hard and dry and has indefinite storage life. It may die, but
you can hardly tell, it can still be eaten.

Is this correct? Wheat is stored, as strategic food reserve, if not
actually as a commercial operation, for many years. Are the wheat
seeds dead when take out and milled? And does it make any difference
to the flour?

Michael Bell



--

In article ,
Michael Bell writes:
| We all know what a "fruit" or a "vegetable" are. They are plant
| products which are soft and wet and have limited storage life. They
| die, then they rot, and who wants to eat rotten fruit and vegetables?

Many people. We are, after all, scavengers. Look up "bletting",
and ask yourself what wine and cider are.

And biologists and botanists use those words differently :-)

| But what is a "grain"? It seems to me that a grain is a plant product
| which is hard and dry and has indefinite storage life. It may die, but
| you can hardly tell, it can still be eaten.

That is one meaning, yes.

| Is this correct? Wheat is stored, as strategic food reserve, if not
| actually as a commercial operation, for many years. Are the wheat
| seeds dead when take out and milled? And does it make any difference
| to the flour?

Partially. No. Not much.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
Michael Bell writes:
| We all know what a "fruit" or a "vegetable" are. They are plant
| products which are soft and wet and have limited storage life. They
| die, then they rot, and who wants to eat rotten fruit and vegetables?

Many people. We are, after all, scavengers. Look up "bletting",
and ask yourself what wine and cider are.

And biologists and botanists use those words differently :-)

| But what is a "grain"? It seems to me that a grain is a plant product
| which is hard and dry and has indefinite storage life. It may die, but
| you can hardly tell, it can still be eaten.

That is one meaning, yes.

| Is this correct? Wheat is stored, as strategic food reserve, if not
| actually as a commercial operation, for many years. Are the wheat
| seeds dead when take out and milled? And does it make any difference
| to the flour?

Partially. No. Not much.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Grain stored dry can survive a surprisingly long time, some grain from an
Egyptian tomb germinated after 2000 years or more!
Grain has different nutritional values depending on its freshness, rice
is particularly prone to losing value when dried and stored. and people
living off stored rice can become malnourished even when they appear to
have plenty to eat.
--
Charlie Pridham, Gardening in Cornwall
www.roselandhouse.co.uk
Holders of national collections of Clematis viticella cultivars and
Lapageria rosea

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:
In article ,
Michael Bell writes:

/snip/
| Is this correct? Wheat is stored, as strategic food reserve, if not
| actually as a commercial operation, for many years. Are the wheat
| seeds dead when take out and milled? And does it make any difference
| to the flour?

Partially. No. Not much.

It might be added that some grain found in ancient Egyptian pyramids has
been successfully germinated.

That's probably over 3,000 years old.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig

In article ,
Rusty Hinge 2 writes:
|
| It might be added that some grain found in ancient Egyptian pyramids has
| been successfully germinated.
|
| That's probably over 3,000 years old.

Do you have a reliable reference to that? It is a very long-standing
urban myth, but may well have some truth in it.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Kew have a formula to calculate how long a seed can be stored for and still germinate.

http://data.kew.org/sid/viability/index.html

In message
Rusty Hinge 2 wrote:

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:
In article ,
Michael Bell writes:

/snip/
| Is this correct? Wheat is stored, as strategic food reserve, if not
| actually as a commercial operation, for many years. Are the wheat
| seeds dead when take out and milled? And does it make any difference
| to the flour?

Partially. No. Not much.

It might be added that some grain found in ancient Egyptian pyramids has
been successfully germinated.

That's probably over 3,000 years old.


But as to the original question; Is it true that "a grain" is a hard
dry thing (whatever its botanical name) which can be kept long-term
because its eating qualities are unchanged by its death? (That UNlike
"vegetables" and "fruist" (whatever their botanical name) become
UNeatable on death - and starting to rot.)

Michael Bell
--

In article ,
Michael Bell writes:
|
| But as to the original question; Is it true that "a grain" is a hard
| dry thing (whatever its botanical name) which can be kept long-term
| because its eating qualities are unchanged by its death? (That UNlike
| "vegetables" and "fruist" (whatever their botanical name) become
| UNeatable on death - and starting to rot.)

No. Think of dates. The truth is rarely pure and never simple :-)


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Michael Bell wrote:
We all know what a "fruit" or a "vegetable" are. They are plant
products which are soft and wet and have limited storage life. They
die, then they rot, and who wants to eat rotten fruit and vegetables?

But what is a "grain"? It seems to me that a grain is a plant product
which is hard and dry and has indefinite storage life. It may die, but
you can hardly tell, it can still be eaten.

Is this correct? Wheat is stored, as strategic food reserve, if not
actually as a commercial operation, for many years. Are the wheat
seeds dead when take out and milled? And does it make any difference
to the flour?


Most grain is the fruit of grasses. A few exceptions - buckwheat and quinoa.

Grain is what is stored in granaries.

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:
In article ,
Rusty Hinge 2 writes:
|
| It might be added that some grain found in ancient Egyptian pyramids has
| been successfully germinated.
|
| That's probably over 3,000 years old.

Do you have a reliable reference to that? It is a very long-standing
urban myth, but may well have some truth in it.

Not unless you can search the last few years' output of Radio 4... (Or
possibly Radio 3)

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig

The message
from Michael Bell contains these words:

But as to the original question; Is it true that "a grain" is a hard
dry thing (whatever its botanical name) which can be kept long-term
because its eating qualities are unchanged by its death? (That UNlike
"vegetables" and "fruist" (whatever their botanical name) become
UNeatable on death - and starting to rot.)

By and large, probably. However, you can preserve 'dead' vegetable
matter by sterilising and then excluding air, pickling, freezing,
drying, etc.

'Grain' is a seed, and as such is usually only applied to those of
graminae - i.e., grasses.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig