On Sat, 15 May 2004 19:40:43 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades
wrote:

The message
from martin contains these words:

I can i get them to stay away?

jam jar half filled with water will, get them to stay forever.

Hornets are protected.

from what?

The message
from Malcolm contains these words:
In article , Jaques
d'Alltrades writes
The message
from martin contains these words:

I can i get them to stay away?

jam jar half filled with water will, get them to stay forever.

Hornets are protected.

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are. I once spent a winter with five queen
hornets lurking somewhere in my bedroom.

When they woke up and I let them out they set off in the direction of
Heathrow.......

(And yes, I do know the difference between queen hornets and queen wasps!)

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

Xref: kermit uk.rec.gardening:205301


"Jaques d'Alltrades" wrote in message

:
: My information is that they are. I once spent a winter with five queen
: hornets lurking somewhere in my bedroom.
:
: When they woke up and I let them out they set off in the direction of
: Heathrow.......


Ah yes, I remember it well, I was in terminal 4 when they flew past in arrow
formation.

It inspired several TV ad's, Just one ornetto, give it to meeeeee.

See

http://www.insectstings.co.uk/hornets.html

In article , Jaques
d'Alltrades writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:
In article , Jaques
d'Alltrades writes
The message
from martin contains these words:

I can i get them to stay away?

jam jar half filled with water will, get them to stay forever.

Hornets are protected.

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?

I once spent a winter with five queen
hornets lurking somewhere in my bedroom.

Wow!

When they woke up and I let them out they set off in the direction of
Heathrow.......

I hope you phoned Air Traffic :-)

(And yes, I do know the difference between queen hornets and queen wasps!)

Once seen, never forgotten, I agree.

--
Malcolm

The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?


Wait for a Mary to come along - she'll know.

Next time I'm in Norwich I'll call in on Norfolk Wildlife Trust.

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article , Jaques
d'Alltrades writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?


Wait for a Mary to come along - she'll know.

Fairynuff.

Next time I'm in Norwich I'll call in on Norfolk Wildlife Trust.

Who will, I am sure, refer to the W&C Act.

--
Malcolm

On Mon, 17 May 2004 08:44:05 +0100, Malcolm wrote:

Hornets are protected.

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?

They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though. They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.
--
Tim C.

On Mon, 17 May 2004, Tim Challenger wrote:

They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though. They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.

They certainly aren't in France because I've got the local fire brigade
to come and kill them off when they invaded my loft.

--
+-------------------------------------------------------+
| Internet: | writing from |
| Fidonet: David Rance 2:252/110 | Caversham, |
| BBS: telnet://mesnil.demon.co.uk | Reading, UK |
+-------------------------------------------------------+

On Mon, 17 May 2004 14:43:13 +0100, David Rance wrote:

On Mon, 17 May 2004, Tim Challenger wrote:

They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though. They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.

They certainly aren't in France because I've got the local fire brigade
to come and kill them off when they invaded my loft.

Could this be the start of a major International Incident?
Germany vs. France? ;-)

--
Tim C.

In article m, Tim
Challenger d writes
On Mon, 17 May 2004 08:44:05 +0100, Malcolm wrote:

Hornets are protected.

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?

They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though.

No, although some birds are protected throughout Europe, e.g. those
specified in the Birds Directive and lots of other plants and animals,
including invertebrates, in the Habitats Directive, each country has its
own schedules of other species. As far as I can see, the Hornet isn't
scheduled in the Habitats Directive.

They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.

Golly.

As well as statutory protection under the law, there are longer lists of
species which are the subject of Biodiversity Action Plans, but the
Hornet doesn't figure on these either.


--
Malcolm

On Mon, 17 May 2004 15:18:57 +0100, Malcolm wrote:

In article m, Tim
Challenger d writes
On Mon, 17 May 2004 08:44:05 +0100, Malcolm wrote:

Hornets are protected.

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?

They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though.

No, although some birds are protected throughout Europe, e.g. those
specified in the Birds Directive and lots of other plants and animals,
including invertebrates, in the Habitats Directive, each country has its
own schedules of other species. As far as I can see, the Hornet isn't
scheduled in the Habitats Directive.

They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.

Golly.

As well as statutory protection under the law, there are longer lists of
species which are the subject of Biodiversity Action Plans, but the
Hornet doesn't figure on these either.

Yes, I had a quick search of the DEFRA site and couldn't come up with
anything.
--
Tim C.

On Mon, 17 May 2004, Tim Challenger wrote:

They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though. They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.

I've never heard of this. Can you give me a reference for this?

--
+-------------------------------------------------------+
| Internet: | writing from |
| Fidonet: David Rance 2:252/110 | Caversham, |
| BBS: telnet://mesnil.demon.co.uk | Reading, UK |
+-------------------------------------------------------+

On Mon, 17 May 2004 12:05:05 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades
wrote:

The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

No, I don't think they have any protection under UK law. However, as
several people have said, they are rarely aggressive and should be left
alone.

My information is that they are.

Well, they aren't listed on any schedule of the W&C Act so far as I can
see, so where does your information come from?


Wait for a Mary to come along - she'll know.

Next time I'm in Norwich I'll call in on Norfolk Wildlife Trust.

and claim asylum? :-)

On Sun, 16 May 2004 21:54:37 +0200, martin wrote:

On Sat, 15 May 2004 19:40:43 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades
wrote:

The message
from martin contains these words:

I can i get them to stay away?

jam jar half filled with water will, get them to stay forever.

Hornets are protected.

from what?

from people.
--
Tim C.

Sorry if this has come through twice, but the first time I sent it it
hasn't shown up.
Tim.




They may be in the EU protected species lists, I don't know if they all
apply to the UK though. They certainly are protected in Germany, Austria
and I'm pretty sure Switzerland. In Germany there is a fine of up to ten
thousand Euros.

I've never heard of this. Can you give me a reference for this?

There's a quote he
http://www.vespa-crabro.de/downloads/hornissen.pdf
I paraphrase, but you'll have to look up the exact text in the German
Statute books. A copy can be found he
http://www.bna-ev.de/bna_inhalt/gese...tzgesetz_d.htm

"Hornets have been on the German 'red list' of threatened species since
1984.
Almost all wasp species are protected under the General Protection of Wild
Animals and Plants legislation (§20d BNatSchG - the
Bundesnaturschutzgesetz).
Specifically, since 01-01-1987 they are protected in appendix 1 of the §20f
law. Fines up to DM 100 000" (~EUR 50 000).

This is the Schleswig-Holstein list.
http://www.umweltdaten.landsh.de/nui...mmen_72dpi.pdf
(Page 18)


See:
http://www.naturschutzrecht.net/BNat...bnatschg09.htm
The dirty deed would fall under this clause:
"§ 65 Bußgeldvorschriften
1. entgegen § 42 Abs. 1 Nr. 1 wild lebenden Tieren nachstellt, sie fängt,
verletzt oder tötet oder ihre Entwicklungsformen, Nist-, Brut-, Wohn- oder
Zufluchtstätten der Natur entnimmt, beschädigt oder zerstört,...."
......

§ 66 Strafvorschriften
(1) Mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu drei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe wird
bestraft, wer eine in § 65 Abs. 1, 3 Nr. 1 oder 3 oder Abs. 4 bezeichnete
vorsätzliche Handlung gewerbs- oder gewohnheitsmäßig begeht.

(2) Mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu fünf Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe wird
bestraft, wer eine in § 65 Abs. 1, 3 Nr. 1 oder 3 oder Abs. 4 bezeichnete
vorsätzliche Handlung begeht, die sich auf Tiere oder Pflanzen einer streng
geschützten Art bezieht.

So the Hornet, being specially protected, would fall in clause (2) up to
five years imprisonment. and/or a fine up to one hundred and eighty days
salary.
Maybe my original quote was out of date as I can't find anything in the law
texts after 2002 about a fixed fine, the latest versions all have a
relative fine (180 days).

--
Tim C.


--
Tim C.