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Old 20-11-2003, 05:32 AM
Rex Grigg
 
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Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.

Dear Mark,

We are writing to request that "SLANDER and DEFAMATION"
material be removed from the www.fins.actwin.com discussions web pages about our product, the ECO-Aqualizer.

Defined: "Slander and Defamation - are the utterance of false charges or misrepresentations meant to defame and damage another persons reputation. It is illegal."

After meeting we are our attorney, Trey Henderson, it has been
decided for the best interest of all parties involved, to cordially attempt and request that the following post be removed.

April 28, 2003 from Rex Grigg

April 23, 2003 from Jerry B

We request that these two post be removed immediately. Such remarks as "SNAKE OIL" is considered slander, especially when the author, publisher, printer, or party involved has willingly confessed that he or she has not tried, purchased, tested, or validat

ed such defamatory remarks. But chooses to post remarks.

True we live in a society of f reedom of speech. But when such a defamatory remark is posted to the world via the internet and the business' sales ratio drops by a dramatic amount greater than proceeding months of sales, one must review the recorded stati

stics to determine the loss potential dated from this April 23rd and forward.

Since sales are generated solely by internet transactions, it is only obvious that search engine results are the main driver of this business. In the event of the above posts which appear on the front page of GOOGLE search engine , items 3 and 4, have bee

n a significant main source of such defamatory issues and thereof.

In all civil actions for slander and libel the falsity of the
injurious statements is an essential element, so that the defendant is always entitled to justify his statements by their truth; but when the statements are in themselves defamatory, their falsity is presumed, and the burden of proving their truth is laid

upon the defendant. The gen eral theory of law with regard to these cases is this. It is assumed that in every case of defamation intention is a
necessary element; but in the ordinary case, when a statement is false and defamatory, the law presumes that it has been made or published with an evil intent, and will not allow this presumption to be rebutted by evidence or submitted as matter of fact t

o a jury. But there are certain circumstances in which the natural presumption is quite the other way. There are certain natural and proper occasions on which statements may be made which are in themselves defamatory,
and which may be false, but which naturally suggest that the
statements may have been made from a perfectly proper motive. In the cases of this kind which are recognized by law, the presumption is reversed. It lies with the plaintiff to show that the defendant was actuated by what is called express malice, by an in

tention to do harm and in this case the question is not one of legal in ference for the court, but a matter of fact to be decided by the jury. Although however, the theory of the law seems to rest entirely upon natura
presumption of intention, it is pretty clear that in determining the limits of privilege the courts have been almost wholly guided by considerations of public or general expediency.

Papers published under the authority of parliament are protected by a special act, 3 & 4 Vict c. 9, 1840, which was passed after a decree of the law court adverse to the privilege claimed. The general rule now is that all reports of parliamentary or judic

ial proceedings are privileged in so far as they are honest. Even ex parte proceedings,in so far as they take place in public, now fall within the same rule. But if the report is garbled, the party who is injured in
consequence is entitled to maintain an action, and to have the
question of malice submitted to a jury.

As a cordial request, I ask that the po st be removed within 5 days. After speaking with the Editor, Mark Rosenstein, he has indicated that he would remove the post if contacted by the parties to do so. Otherwise, FINS will take no responsiblility due to

the fact that these post are in the "mailing list archives". And authors of such post will be solely responsible.

If not removed, our attorney will have no other remedy but to see that justice is upheld and that such Slander and Defamation is valued in a court of law. If and when this takes place, we will sought after all parties involved, whether author, writer, pub

lisher, and or moderators to be held fully liable for the valuation accessed by the courts.

I will add that the statements made by Rex Griggs, have not only been damaging to ECO-Aqualizer Corp., but also may have cost many deaths within the fish aquarium community. I strongly suggest that all parties should find out more about ECO-Aqualizer and

our intent of saving fishes lives. Our product may be the biggest impact in this industry in saving marine fish with the introduction into captivity. As a fellow hobbyist, one must ask themselves, do I care about the fish? Or do I NOT care about their we
ll-being?

Please see APPMA statistical results about the percentage of fish deaths within the marine hobby. The numbers are mind-boggling. The intent of ECO-Aqualizer is to significantly decrease those numbers.

Mark Rosenstein has given ECO-Aqualizer these email addresses as a correspondence of contact. Please RESPOND back to avoid further complications. Please respond to Mark Rosenstein, Editor of FINS, as well to update and remove such unvalidated remarks.

Sincerely,

Carl Denzer , President



Semper Fi!

Visit the forums at Aqua Botanic!
http://aquabotanicwetthumb.infopop.cc/#1

Need Nitrate or Potassium for your tank? Go to www.litemanu.com
(Just a happy customer of the above!)

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Old 20-11-2003, 09:42 AM
Graham Ramsay
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

"Rex Grigg" wrote
You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.


There's no need to purchase this product before realising it is nonsense.
A read through the absurd web site is enough to come to the conclusion
that snake oil is an apt description.
I'd like to see them try and explain just exactly how their product works
with its far infrared waves and vibrational frequency effects. They'd be
laughed out of court.
To claim that fish have died because people have been put off buying
this useluess lump of plastic is beneath contempt.

--
Graham Ramsay


  #3   Report Post  
Old 20-11-2003, 10:12 AM
Happy'Cam'per
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

Go Graham. I second that. What a crock of shit. I don't think their sales
have ever been that good anyway, and I seriously doubt that Rex's remarks
damaged sales in such a negative way. EVERYONE is entitled to their
opinions.
--
**So long, and thanks for all the fish!**


"Graham Ramsay" wrote in message
...
"Rex Grigg" wrote
You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.


There's no need to purchase this product before realising it is nonsense.
A read through the absurd web site is enough to come to the conclusion
that snake oil is an apt description.
I'd like to see them try and explain just exactly how their product works
with its far infrared waves and vibrational frequency effects. They'd be
laughed out of court.
To claim that fish have died because people have been put off buying
this useluess lump of plastic is beneath contempt.

--
Graham Ramsay




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Old 20-11-2003, 11:04 AM
Tasslehoff
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!


"ECO-Aqualizer's specific magnetic polarity kills algae growth. (From their
website)
Crikey jingoes, I probably wouldn't want to risk it for my planted tank if
IT does that to algae. lol.

"Graham Ramsay" wrote in message
...
"Rex Grigg" wrote
You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.


There's no need to purchase this product before realising it is nonsense.
A read through the absurd web site is enough to come to the conclusion
that snake oil is an apt description.
I'd like to see them try and explain just exactly how their product works
with its far infrared waves and vibrational frequency effects. They'd be
laughed out of court.
To claim that fish have died because people have been put off buying
this useluess lump of plastic is beneath contempt.

--
Graham Ramsay




  #5   Report Post  
Old 20-11-2003, 02:23 PM
Peter Gennaro
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

If I remember right the Petswarehouse guy was counter-sued and thoroughly
crushed out of business.

Chuck Gadd has a link to it on his website.

"Rex Grigg" wrote in message
...
You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.





  #6   Report Post  
Old 20-11-2003, 06:43 PM
coelacanth
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

"Peter Gennaro" wrote in message
...
If I remember right the Petswarehouse guy was counter-sued and thoroughly
crushed out of business.


Yes, but not before taking down a very good website and
costing several people thousands in legal fees. See
http://www.petsforum.com/psw/ for further gory details.

I would suggest that we write it ecoaq*lizer to keep our
bank accounts from dying like pl*co.

-coelacanth

P.S. I must say the flash animation is quite convincing,
except that the tank appears to be filled with
molecules of a trivalent-oxygen compound (H30?).


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Old 20-11-2003, 07:23 PM
B Lee
 
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Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

"Peter Gennaro" wrote in message ...
If I remember right the Petswarehouse guy was counter-sued and thoroughly
crushed out of business.

Chuck Gadd has a link to it on his website.

"Rex Grigg" wrote in message
...
You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.


I find it disturbing that Petwarehouse would even dare to attempt to
threaten a public forum like this. I have never used the product,
don't even know what it is-- but I do appreciate the time people take
to review other products.

Personally, I highly doubt Petswarehouse would be successful in such a
lawsuit. Bad PR also. The press would have such a field day with a
story like that.
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Old 20-11-2003, 08:09 PM
RedForeman
 
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Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

snipped

I would suggest that we write it ecoaq*lizer to keep our
bank accounts from dying like pl*co.

-coelacanth


That is by far the funniest thing I've read in years....


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Old 20-11-2003, 09:36 PM
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

"Tasslehoff" wrote in message . au...
"ECO-Aqualizer's specific magnetic polarity kills algae growth. (From their
website)


Humm, as someone with a very long history in the aquarium hobby,
business and also academic background specifically in algae's ecology,
physiology and biochemistry, I do find their claims to be a very long
stretch at best,but I would challenge them to show more research on
this topic to support thier contentions.

Simply saying something does not make it so. The consumer needs some
back ground to show this is really what is happening.
I can speculate and make some business claim, and then chase after
anyone that says different. But if you have something that is more
than speculation, then you can back it up with evidence.

Then legal BS is not needed.

Doh!!!!

The consumer certainly does not need a company threatening them.
Back up your claims --------if-------- you are reputable company.
If you don't, you might want to spend more on legal cost and get less
profit due to suing potential consumers.

Threatening people/potential consumers is never a wise method of
business.

So prove that it works.

Regards,
Tom Barr
  #10   Report Post  
Old 20-11-2003, 11:44 PM
Eric Schreiber
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

Rex Grigg wrote:

You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.


If they've really met with their attorney, maybe they could ask him to
write their letters for them in the future, as it's quite clear that
Carl Denzer lacks any substantial grammatical skills.

--
www.ericschreiber.com


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Old 21-11-2003, 12:34 AM
Eric Schreiber
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

Rex Grigg wrote:

I will add that the statements made by Rex Griggs, have not only
been damaging to ECO-Aqualizer Corp., but also may have cost many
deaths within the fish aquarium community.


In addition to language problems, it appears from this non-Sequitur
that he has some trouble with logic, as well.

I assume this refers to Rex recommending that people not use Carl's
product. If we accept Carl's 'logic' and this makes Rex responsible
for the resulting fish deaths, then Carl is guilty of the same for not
marketing this product sooner, and for not giving it away to everyone
who needs it.


What is far infrared technology? Does it need electricity to operate?
Far Infrared is a combination of bioceramic elements originally
developed by NASA. It radiates electromagnetic photons.
ECO-Aqualizer does not need electricity to operate


Infrared is nothing more than heat radiation. There are several ways
to generate heat, but they rely either on chemical reactions (like
dropping a bit of liver into hydrogen peroxide), radioactive decay, or
energy conversion such as from running a current through a resistor.
Their FAQ rules out electricity. I'm reasonably sure their product
isn't radioactive, and I can't think of a closed chemical system that
will generate heat for 20 years (the promised product life). So, I
wonder where their infrared is coming from. I have a theory, but it
involves inappropriate anatomical references.


From http://tinyurl.com/vwq7

"Question: I want to know if any bioceramic materials are incorporated
in the space shuttle which are said to emit infrared rays which
improve circulation. There is a lot of news about this recently."

"Answer: These ceramic materials do not emit any more infrared rays
than any other material of the same temperature. Infrared rays are
just natural heat radiation and depend on the temperature of the
material. While locally applied heat has always been considered useful
under some circumstances to improve circulation near the skin, you can
get all the heat or infrared radiation you want just by raising the
temperature. There may be some bioceramic materials in the Space
Shuttle, but they are not there for any health benefits."

Sounds like NASA is pretty much debunking the entire 'technology'. Who
shall we trust - NASA, or someone who is trying to sell us something
and threatens lawsuits when people say negative things?


I strongly suggest that all parties should find out more about
ECO-Aqualizer and our intent of saving fishes lives.
As a fellow hobbyist, one must ask themselves, do I care about
the fish? Or do I NOT care about their well-being?


And he plays the 'appeal to emotions' card, which any high school
logic class student can easily recognize.


You've got a live one there, Rex. Better you than me


--
www.ericschreiber.com
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Old 21-11-2003, 12:34 AM
John
 
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Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 09:39:21 -0000, "Graham Ramsay"
wrote:

"Rex Grigg" wrote
You really have to watch what you say and make sure you don't give
opinions anymore. I received this nice email this evening. Just a
heads up for all of you.


There's no need to purchase this product before realising it is nonsense.
A read through the absurd web site is enough to come to the conclusion
that snake oil is an apt description.
I'd like to see them try and explain just exactly how their product works
with its far infrared waves and vibrational frequency effects. They'd be
laughed out of court.
To claim that fish have died because people have been put off buying
this useluess lump of plastic is beneath contempt.



I just took a look at there web site... really nice piece of
plastic... I have to get me one 'cause I've just become really lazy
and don't want to do a water change for up to "8 Months" WOW.

And here I thought some of my fish died because my tank was over
stocked for what the filters could reasonable handle. I stand
corrected, it is because I did not have one of these things that my
fish died. I have to get me one of those things so that I can add more
fish to my 33 gallon tank or maybe I can add that Arawana I always
wanted.

Thank you people for telling me about this "great" product.


-= Gandalf =-

p.s. and if you think i'm serious here.... then I will have to turn
you all into brine shrimp and feed you to my Kribs.
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Old 21-11-2003, 01:14 AM
Bob Alston
 
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Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

Hey - check out these two pages for the "technology" behind this Far
Infrared:

http://www.farinfraredtherapy.com/st...11201954428698

and

http://www.farinfraredtherapy.com/st...11201954428698

Convinced yet? If so, this place sells all kinds of products. Knock
yourself out!

Very similar to all the hoopla about therapeutic magnets a few years back.

--
Bob Alston

bobalston9 AT aol DOT com


  #14   Report Post  
Old 21-11-2003, 02:12 AM
John
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 19:02:30 -0600, "Bob Alston"
wrote:

Hey - check out these two pages for the "technology" behind this Far
Infrared:

http://www.farinfraredtherapy.com/st...11201954428698

and

http://www.farinfraredtherapy.com/st...11201954428698

Convinced yet? If so, this place sells all kinds of products. Knock
yourself out!

Very similar to all the hoopla about therapeutic magnets a few years back.




What? you mean my house made of magnets was a waist of time and money
too? :-)


psst hey mister you wan nay buy some magnets?



You really didn't take me seriously in my last post did you?


-= Gandalf =-



Bzzzzzzzit you are all now brine shrimp!!
  #15   Report Post  
Old 21-11-2003, 02:12 AM
Rex Grigg
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shades of the Petswarehouse Lawsuit!

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 19:02:30 -0600, "Bob Alston"
wrote:

Where do these minerals get the energy to emit those far infrared
rays? How come I'm still paying for home heating oil? All I need is
a pile of those rocks and my house will be toasty warm!

Hey - check out these two pages for the "technology" behind this Far
Infrared:

http://www.farinfraredtherapy.com/st...11201954428698

and

http://www.farinfraredtherapy.com/st...11201954428698

Convinced yet? If so, this place sells all kinds of products. Knock
yourself out!

Very similar to all the hoopla about therapeutic magnets a few years back.



Semper Fi!

Visit the forums at Aqua Botanic!
http://aquabotanicwetthumb.infopop.cc/#1

Need Nitrate or Potassium for your tank? Go to www.litemanu.com
(Just a happy customer of the above!)


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