Last year I tried to go without any insecticides in my garden. Me and
my son did slug hunts at night, I spread diatomaceous earth for bugs
(especially squash bugs), and sprayed with neem when my tomatoes got
soft rot. It was a disaster, the bugs and rot got everything edible,
until late in the summer when I broke out malathion and seven, and
physan (benzalkonium chloride).

The squash bug nymphs are back already and destroying(and infesting)
my lettuce and they have already killed the cucumber and squash
seedlings. How do I manage things without resorting to poisons
again?!

Help me be green.

Jim

On Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:10:18 -0700, McGerm
wrote:

Last year I tried to go without any insecticides in my garden. Me and
my son did slug hunts at night, I spread diatomaceous earth for bugs
(especially squash bugs), and sprayed with neem when my tomatoes got
soft rot. It was a disaster, the bugs and rot got everything edible,
until late in the summer when I broke out malathion and seven, and
physan (benzalkonium chloride).

The squash bug nymphs are back already and destroying(and infesting)
my lettuce and they have already killed the cucumber and squash
seedlings. How do I manage things without resorting to poisons
again?!

Help me be green.

Jim

Read some of the myriad books on organic gardening. The more you use
poison, the more insects you'll have.

On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:39:33 -0500, jangchub
wrote:

On Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:10:18 -0700, McGerm
wrote:

Last year I tried to go without any insecticides in my garden. Me and
my son did slug hunts at night, I spread diatomaceous earth for bugs
(especially squash bugs), and sprayed with neem when my tomatoes got
soft rot. It was a disaster, the bugs and rot got everything edible,
until late in the summer when I broke out malathion and seven, and
physan (benzalkonium chloride).

The squash bug nymphs are back already and destroying(and infesting)
my lettuce and they have already killed the cucumber and squash
seedlings. How do I manage things without resorting to poisons
again?!

Help me be green.


Read some of the myriad books on organic gardening. The more you use
poison, the more insects you'll have.

I think what you are saying is if you misuse insecticides you will
help develop resistant strains of pests. If so, that is true.

But, if you choose to use insecticides, you must learn how to use them
properly including techniques to avoid encouraging the development of
local resistant strains.

JMHO

John

The squash bug nymphs are back already and destroying(and infesting)
my lettuce and they have already killed the cucumber and squash
seedlings.

Well, so you know which plants the squash bugs like. Try going a year
without planting those plants. Or if that is too much, at least plant
them in a different place than the squash bugs were last year.

Be willing to do some hand-picking of insects (potato bugs respond
well to this, for example).

Try to get your soil fertile (compost, manure, whatever you have
available) which can leave your plants a bit less vulnerable.

Plant a wide variety of crops. Rotate their locations (never grow the
same annual in the same bed two years in a row). If a plant is
consistently getting attacked, try another species or another variety.

Experiment with plants which may repel some pests (e.g. marigold) or
attract beneficial insects.

My firsthand experience is that I haven't had a lot of insect issues
which are big enough to prevent me from getting a good crop. I'm not
really sure whether I'm just lucky, or whether these practices have
prevented problems.

Organic gardening (as I've learned it anyway) is a bit more than
just replacing your malathion and physan with neem and diatomaceous
earth. There isn't one simple solution, but a variety of techniques
based on different situations and trial and error.

Thanks for the suggestions. I did my reading: two books on organic
gardening, and one on garden pests and control.

Yes, I have a massive Squash Bug (Anasa nistis) problem. My garden
site... actually my whole yard is part of my problem. Our property sits
next to a field that was used for years to grow pumpkins. Add to that
my garden sits next to my shed and not too far from the neighbors
virtually abandoned barn; adult squash bugs over winter in and under
structures, yeah.

As of last week the squash bug nymphs were suck the juices from
everything there were even punctures on green tomatoes. I hit then
with Pyrethrin...oh the slaughter. But virtually nothing kills the
adults (Sevin may work) so I will have to keep spraying all summer.
It looks like the farmer planted pumpkins this year...may the squash
bugs will migrate the 50 yards and go bug him instead of me.

One the bright side I picked my first two tomatoes tonight. Not bad
for Zone 6b.

On Wed, 20 Jun 2007 19:31:19 -0700, McGerm
wrote:

Thanks for the suggestions. I did my reading: two books on organic
gardening, and one on garden pests and control.

Yes, I have a massive Squash Bug (Anasa nistis) problem. My garden
site... actually my whole yard is part of my problem. Our property sits
next to a field that was used for years to grow pumpkins. Add to that
my garden sits next to my shed and not too far from the neighbors
virtually abandoned barn; adult squash bugs over winter in and under
structures, yeah.

As of last week the squash bug nymphs were suck the juices from
everything there were even punctures on green tomatoes. I hit then
with Pyrethrin...oh the slaughter. But virtually nothing kills the
adults (Sevin may work) so I will have to keep spraying all summer.
It looks like the farmer planted pumpkins this year...may the squash
bugs will migrate the 50 yards and go bug him instead of me.

Do not use Sevin when the flowers are open as you will kill
pollinators. It is possible to clamp the flowers closed and carefully
dust around them and then open them.

READ THE LABEL!

John

On Wed, 20 Jun 2007 19:31:19 -0700, McGerm
wrote:

Thanks for the suggestions. I did my reading: two books on organic
gardening, and one on garden pests and control.

Yes, I have a massive Squash Bug (Anasa nistis) problem. My garden
site... actually my whole yard is part of my problem. Our property sits
next to a field that was used for years to grow pumpkins. Add to that
my garden sits next to my shed and not too far from the neighbors
virtually abandoned barn; adult squash bugs over winter in and under
structures, yeah.

As of last week the squash bug nymphs were suck the juices from
everything there were even punctures on green tomatoes. I hit then
with Pyrethrin...oh the slaughter. But virtually nothing kills the
adults (Sevin may work) so I will have to keep spraying all summer.
It looks like the farmer planted pumpkins this year...may the squash
bugs will migrate the 50 yards and go bug him instead of me.

One the bright side I picked my first two tomatoes tonight. Not bad
for Zone 6b.

Sevin on food? I don't think so. Your yard is out of balance. Suffer
it out for three years and I assure you will have a balance where no
insect will infest anything. Don't use organic poison either. I
haven't used anything in years and my garden has a balance.

The tomato plants don't have tobacco horn worms on them because they
are busily eating the datura I plant as a catch crop. The datura
withstands complete defoliation and then we have magnificent
hummingbird moths which pollinate. With the disappearance of bees,
this is vital!

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 11:36:59 -0500, Charlie wrote:

The balance issue is true. This year our garden is seeing hardly any
baddies. I have had to pick a few cabbage loopers off the brussels
sprouts is all. The bush beans are clean, the zuchs are clean, the
cukes are clean. No flea beetles this year.....yet, and hopefully not!

Healthy soil grows healthy plants, which the baddies are leaving alone.

Agreed....tough it out and improve your soil. THings begin to happen.

Charlie

It's the hard part...the waiting it out. In commercial applications
it is harder because of the monitary association with good yields, but
for the homeowner the only drawback are the appearance of eaten
foliage and insect damage. When I first moved into this house nothing
was on the property sans the house. We had insects I never heard of,
let alone manage. Like, what the hell is a cicada killer? We had a
major infestation of them. Huge flying wasps that sting, but it only
hurts for an hour. They zoom by, lumbering their gigantic body,
buzzing while carrying a cicada to put into their hole for the larva
which hatch out next year.

I was not happy about it, but my husband cut them down over a two year
period using a tennis racket. They'd make a giant bong noise when
hit. Horrible.

But, if people would just tolerate some or a lot of damage the first
year, much less the second year, and the third year the amazing relief
with minimal insects. Tons of birds, lizards, snakes and they really
do manage it all.

In article , Charlie wrote:

The balance issue is true. This year our garden is seeing hardly any
baddies. I have had to pick a few cabbage loopers off the brussels
sprouts is all. The bush beans are clean, the zuchs are clean, the
cukes are clean. No flea beetles this year.....yet, and hopefully not!

Charlie, I thought that Brussels sprouts were a fall crop. What the hell
you doing planting them going into summer?

I just know I'm gonna hate the answer. Come on. Lay it on me.
--
Billy
Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly)

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 10:49:55 -0700, Billy Rose
wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

The balance issue is true. This year our garden is seeing hardly any
baddies. I have had to pick a few cabbage loopers off the brussels
sprouts is all. The bush beans are clean, the zuchs are clean, the
cukes are clean. No flea beetles this year.....yet, and hopefully not!

Charlie, I thought that Brussels sprouts were a fall crop. What the hell
you doing planting them going into summer?

I just know I'm gonna hate the answer. Come on. Lay it on me.

Double cropping, old son. One crop in early as possible in the spring,
another in the ground late summer for fall harvest. I have sprouts as
large as a fingernail and growing well. We use them fairly small, not
the size of the monster frozen ones you get at market.

Usually get good results. This year I tightened up the spacing and so
far they appear to be handling the "crowding". They, like the bush
beans have formed a solid canopy, a living mulch, that keeps the ground
under shaded and moist and cooler.

Think biointensive. As one crop is harvested and done, it is replaced
with another. I'm learning the whatfors and howtos as we go along.

A surprisingly small amount of space can produce an amazing amount of
produce.

Lots of cool season crops can be planted on both ends of the growing
season. Serious cold snaps and frosts can be avoided with mulching and
row covers, etc.....though some tolerate, and may improve in flavor
with a light frost.

I have been seeking, and finding, varieties of, oh, say cukes and
melons, that are more heat and drought resistant. Planted some true
lemon cukes that are supposed to take the heat well, along with mexican
Sour Gherkins.

Oops, went a little over on that answer.


Charlie

Never!

Will the fall crop come from the same plants or do you start all over
again? I left one Brussels from last year to make seeds but it wont let
the pods dry out and keeps making more flowers. What am I gonna have to
do to get seed? Drive a stake through its' . . . ? Don't have one does
it? What's a feller to do?
--
Billy
Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly)

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 10:49:55 -0700, Billy Rose
wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

The balance issue is true. This year our garden is seeing hardly any
baddies. I have had to pick a few cabbage loopers off the brussels
sprouts is all. The bush beans are clean, the zuchs are clean, the
cukes are clean. No flea beetles this year.....yet, and hopefully not!

Charlie, I thought that Brussels sprouts were a fall crop. What the hell
you doing planting them going into summer?

I just know I'm gonna hate the answer. Come on. Lay it on me.

Double cropping, old son. One crop in early as possible in the spring,
another in the ground late summer for fall harvest. I have sprouts as
large as a fingernail and growing well. We use them fairly small, not
the size of the monster frozen ones you get at market.

Usually get good results. This year I tightened up the spacing and so
far they appear to be handling the "crowding". They, like the bush
beans have formed a solid canopy, a living mulch, that keeps the ground
under shaded and moist and cooler.

Think biointensive. As one crop is harvested and done, it is replaced
with another. I'm learning the whatfors and howtos as we go along.

A surprisingly small amount of space can produce an amazing amount of
produce.

Lots of cool season crops can be planted on both ends of the growing
season. Serious cold snaps and frosts can be avoided with mulching and
row covers, etc.....though some tolerate, and may improve in flavor
with a light frost.

I have been seeking, and finding, varieties of, oh, say cukes and
melons, that are more heat and drought resistant. Planted some true
lemon cukes that are supposed to take the heat well, along with mexican
Sour Gherkins.

Oops, went a little over on that answer.


Charlie

Here Frost date is Oct 15 Last frost May 15 if lucky

July 4 100 days till above

Frost tender

85 days Snap Beans by July 25
97 days Corn by July 4
86 days Cucumbers by July 25
110 Days Tomatoes By June 25
81 Dayss Squash by Aug 1

Iv'e got Survive Light Frost and Survive Heavy Frost if anyone
wants me to type it. Stuff from Organic garden Mags early on.


Bill

--

S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade
http://www.ocutech.com/ High tech Vison aid
This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with
Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational
and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit.

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 15:13:38 -0400, William Wagner
wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 10:49:55 -0700, Billy Rose
wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

The balance issue is true. This year our garden is seeing hardly any
baddies. I have had to pick a few cabbage loopers off the brussels
sprouts is all. The bush beans are clean, the zuchs are clean, the
cukes are clean. No flea beetles this year.....yet, and hopefully not!

Charlie, I thought that Brussels sprouts were a fall crop. What the hell
you doing planting them going into summer?

I just know I'm gonna hate the answer. Come on. Lay it on me.

Double cropping, old son. One crop in early as possible in the spring,
another in the ground late summer for fall harvest. I have sprouts as
large as a fingernail and growing well. We use them fairly small, not
the size of the monster frozen ones you get at market.

Usually get good results. This year I tightened up the spacing and so
far they appear to be handling the "crowding". They, like the bush
beans have formed a solid canopy, a living mulch, that keeps the ground
under shaded and moist and cooler.

Think biointensive. As one crop is harvested and done, it is replaced
with another. I'm learning the whatfors and howtos as we go along.

A surprisingly small amount of space can produce an amazing amount of
produce.

Lots of cool season crops can be planted on both ends of the growing
season. Serious cold snaps and frosts can be avoided with mulching and
row covers, etc.....though some tolerate, and may improve in flavor
with a light frost.

I have been seeking, and finding, varieties of, oh, say cukes and
melons, that are more heat and drought resistant. Planted some true
lemon cukes that are supposed to take the heat well, along with mexican
Sour Gherkins.

Oops, went a little over on that answer.


Charlie

Here Frost date is Oct 15 Last frost May 15 if lucky

July 4 100 days till above

Frost tender

85 days Snap Beans by July 25
97 days Corn by July 4
86 days Cucumbers by July 25
110 Days Tomatoes By June 25
81 Dayss Squash by Aug 1

Iv'e got Survive Light Frost and Survive Heavy Frost if anyone
wants me to type it. Stuff from Organic garden Mags early on.


Bill

Indeed I would!

I'm sure Billy needs the education, as well.

Thanks Bill. Gettin' to be lots of Billy Bills round these parts.

Care
Charlie

Can't swing a cat without hitting a Bill, or a Billy, or a Memo. Sheesh.
--
Billy
Coloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly)

In article , Charlie wrote:


Late Planting Guide From Seed
From an Old Organic Magazine

Frost date is Oct 15 Last frost May 15

Your dates may differ due to your climate

July 4 100 days till Oct 15

Frost tender

85 days Snap Beans by July 25
97 days Corn by July 4
86 days Cucumbers by July 25
110 days Tomatoes by June 25
81 ays Squash by Aug 1


Survive Light Frost

90 days Cauliflower by July 25
84 days Chinese Cabbage by July 25
74 days Beets by Aug 15
113 days Endive by June 25
63 days Kohlrabi by Aug 30
76 days Loose Leaf Lettuce by Aug 1r
96 days Head Lettuce by July 4
70 days Peas by Aug 15

Survive Heavy Frost

99 days Cabbage by July 4
85 days Carrots by July 25
70 days Chard by Aug 15
90 days Collards by July 4
95 days Broccoli by July 4
120 days Brussels Sprouts by June 15
95 days Kale by July 4
42 days Radishes Summer by Sept 5
72 days Radishes Winter by Aug 15
64 days Spinach by Aug 25
51 days Turnips by Sept 15

--

S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade
http://www.ocutech.com/ High tech Vison aid
This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with
Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational
and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit.