Dear All,
I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
anyone seen anything like this before?

A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?

Thanks
Tom

--
Tom Crane, Dept. Physics, Royal Holloway, University of London, Egham Hill,
Egham, Surrey, TW20 0EX, England.
Email: T.Crane at rhul dot ac dot uk
Fax: +44 (0) 1784 472794

On Mon, 9 Jul 2007 21:32:09 +0000 (UTC),
wrote:

Dear All,
I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
anyone seen anything like this before?

A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?

Thanks
Tom


We have some mistletoe growing in a pin oak and another growing in a
hickory tree. Both are ball-shaped and about 1 yard across, too far
up to remove easily. Someone said you can shoot it out with a
22-rifle, or possibly with a powerful pellet gun. Our trees appear to
be healthy, but in your case I'd remove the parasite.

On Jul 9, 2:32 pm, wrote:
Dear All,
I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
anyone seen anything like this before?

A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?

Thanks
Tom

--
Tom Crane, Dept. Physics, Royal Holloway, University of London, Egham Hill,
Egham, Surrey, TW20 0EX, England.
Email: T.Crane at rhul dot ac dot uk
Fax: +44 (0) 1784 472794

What i know of Misstletoe is the seeds germinate and the plant grows
into the vascular tissue of the tree, which cuts off food and water
supply. I think if it's not too severe you could probably prune out
the branch with the parasite. I've heard in severe cases, it can kill
a tree.

What i know of Misstletoe is the seeds germinate and the plant grows
into the vascular tissue of the tree, which cuts off food and water
supply. I think if it's not too severe you could probably prune out
the branch with the parasite. I've heard in severe cases, it can kill
a tree.


Please explain what you mean when you say food?

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

On Jul 9, 4:18 pm, "symplastless" wrote:
What i know of Misstletoe is the seeds germinate and the plant grows
into the vascular tissue of the tree, which cuts off food and water
supply. I think if it's not too severe you could probably prune out
the branch with the parasite. I've heard in severe cases, it can kill
a tree.

Please explain what you mean when you say food?

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arboristhttp://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

Sorry. I meant carbohydrates which are manufactured during the
photosynthesis process and any nutrients taken up through the root
system. I don't claim to be an expert. Only stating what i've learned
(or remembered)through Hort. classes and working in the nursery
industry. But i always keep my ears open to new information.! Perhaps
John, you could add some information about parasitic plants and their
effect on fruit and ornamental trees. Regards, Bob.

In article ,
writes:
| Dear All,
| I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
| variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
| mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
| yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
| over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
| seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
| be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
| tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
| anyone seen anything like this before?

No, and no, but it sounds very odd.

| A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
| pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?

Unlikely. And the cause won't have been the mistletoe. 30 years is
about the life of many apple trees.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Jul 10, 10:18 am, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,UHAP...@alpha1. rhbnc.ac.uk writes:

| Dear All,
| I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
| variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
| mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
| yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
| over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
| seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
| be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
| tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
| anyone seen anything like this before?

No, and no, but it sounds very odd.

I think it can throw out new shoots from the internal parasitic
structures - particularly if you crop off the existing exterior
growth. In the UK mistletoe has never been aggressive enough to see
off a tree - although on the continent either a more aggressive form
or the warmer summers seem to make it more of a problem. I suspect
global warming may tip things over the edge for some of the weaker UK
trees with a large parasitic load.

The other possibility is that the bark on old branches is full of
cracks and there really are that huge number of mistletoe seedlings
growing on the tree. Worth looking to see that there isn't some other
sap sucking parasite like woolly aphid making matters worse for the
tree. Most trees I have seen in the UK co-exist happily with their
mistletoe.

| A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
| pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?

Unlikely. And the cause won't have been the mistletoe. 30 years is
about the life of many apple trees.

Could be old age, but I'd look for some other cause first. And maybe
try an anti-fungal spray too.

Regards,
Martin Brown

In article . com,
Martin Brown writes:
|
| | A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
| | pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?
|
| Unlikely. And the cause won't have been the mistletoe. 30 years is
| about the life of many apple trees.
|
| Could be old age, but I'd look for some other cause first. And maybe
| try an anti-fungal spray too.

Yes - but, once a tree has got to that state, is it likely to be
salvageable? A 30 year old apple is not a young tree.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Mon, 9 Jul 2007 21:32:09 +0000 (UTC),
wrote:

Dear All,
I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
anyone seen anything like this before?

A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?

Thanks
Tom

Your tree was most likely compromised to begin with. Then the
parasite seed was pooped out of a bird on the tree, the mistletoe put
its main root into the tree and it is now overtaking it. Your tree is
dying. Don't waste time. Just cut it down and plant some other type
of tree there. Do not plant another apple there. You can plant
another apple on some other area of your property.

Sorry. I meant carbohydrates which are manufactured during the
photosynthesis process and any nutrients taken up through the root
system. I don't claim to be an expert. Only stating what i've learned
(or remembered)through Hort. classes and working in the nursery
industry. But i always keep my ears open to new information.! Perhaps
John, you could add some information about parasitic plants and their
effect on fruit and ornamental trees. Regards, Bob.


Trees absorb elements not nutrients.

Food is a substance that provides and energy source, mostly. Nutrient is a
substance that provides an energy source, elements, and other substances
essential for life, in types and amounts that can provide a healthy life.
Fertilizer is a substance that provides elements, as salts mostly, or in
bonded forms, that require microorganisms to alter to forms that can be
absorbed by plants. I do not call elements - nutrients, however nutrients
would contain elements. You can put a file in a folder but you can't put a
folder in a file. A list of elements can be found he
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgu...US211%26sa%3DX

17 Elements For Life - Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Phosphorus,
Potassium, Calcium, Sulfur, Magnesium, Manganese, Iron, Copper, Boron,
Molybdenum, Chlorine, Zinc, Nickel [Sodium, Cobalt, Selenium?]

14 essential elements are obtained by trees from the soil. I do not have a
list of which ones they are.

Wood is the substrate of the base of the food web, the mycorrhizal fungi.
Mycorrhizae tend to be abundant in composted wood such as nurse logs. We
had great success at tree biology workshops finding mycorrhizae during dryer
times, in and about nurse logs. I believe, you don't have to agree with it,
please, just think. I think that by applying mulch as I recommend under
mulch here that you facilitate the mycorrhizae rather than just adding what
I believe you mean as humus, over a lawn. Not that its bad in any way,
adding humus i.e..

Mulching - http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/sub3.html
and
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/M/ Look up "Mulch"

Did I say - Mycorrhizae are organs that facilitate the absorption of
elements essential for healthy growth. Mycorrhizae resist the Demons Of D.
Mycorrhizae facilitate the absorption of elements. Demons of D are those
things that add up to the big D word DEATH. E.g., Depletion, disruption,
and dysfunction. Elements can be depleted. Disruption, you get hit my a
Mac truck. Dysfunction, some organ such as mycorrhizae may not function.


Major Elements C; H; N; O; P; K; S; Mg; Ni; Fe; Ca; Zn; Mo; Mn; B; Cl; Cu

There is the law of the minimum. It states the element that is deficient
the most, would be the determining factor in the health of the tree.

I think research would be wise in the search for the optimum fertility level
for trees.

I did some soil testing in the upper four inches of soil and from at and
about nurse logs in old growth forest which contain hemlocks and white
pines. And much more. Here is my average on my testing for the latter.
These where five test. 3 test sites where in Allegheny National
Forest(Hearts Content) Pennsylvania
and two where in Allegheny National Forest(Tionesta Scenic area)
Pennsylvania.
Results are in Pounds Per Acre PPA. AVAILABLE ELEMENTS
P 8.2
K 236
Mg 107
Ca 594
Al 220.6
Fe 110.8
Mn 118.6
Zn 11.96
NO3-N 28.8
Did not get B or CU.
Organic matter was 29.32%
Ex Acidity 81 ME/100G
Salts mmho: 0.01 mmho/cm
Moisture %3.97
Water Soluble mg/kg B 1.0738
ACID Soluble (mg/kg)
Cd 0.976
Cu 6.768
Ni 5.71 (Penn State discovered the element Ni to be essential in small
amounts)
Mn 426.378
Co 3.084
Zn 46.818
Pb 101.792
Cr 5.078
P 726.226
The CARBON TO NITROGEN RATION was 27:1
pH 4.2 WOW

That would be a goal of mine if I was going to provide essential elements
professionally. I did not see to many people in the old growth sections.

There was more calcium at a nurse logs in a separate test.

We don't feed trees, however, we can feed the soil with composted wood
(chips and nurse logs) and leaves. We can feed the system.

I have some results for some sick hemlocks (elements in soil)


--
Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

In uk.rec.gardening Martin Brown wrote:
: On Jul 10, 10:18 am, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
: In article ,UHAP...@alpha1. rhbnc.ac.uk writes:
:
: | Dear All,
: | I have a sick apple tree which is *covered* in mistletoe. The
: | variety is Howgate Wonder. It is about 30 years old and it had more
: | mistletoe than apple leaves and stems and the apple leaves are scruffy and
: | yellowed. The really strange thing is mistletoe shoots are emerging all
: | over its branches. As I understood it, mistletoe propagation requires
: | seeds to be inserted into the bark (eg. by birds) -- I'm sure this cannot
: | be the case here. It is as though the mistletoe has 'invaded' the apple
: | tree's tissues and taken over. Does this make an botanical sense and has
: | anyone seen anything like this before?
:
: No, and no, but it sounds very odd.

: I think it can throw out new shoots from the internal parasitic
: structures - particularly if you crop off the existing exterior

Interesting. How would one determine if the mistletoe had made these
'internal parasitic structures' ?

: growth. In the UK mistletoe has never been aggressive enough to see
: off a tree - although on the continent either a more aggressive form
: or the warmer summers seem to make it more of a problem. I suspect
: global warming may tip things over the edge for some of the weaker UK
: trees with a large parasitic load.

: The other possibility is that the bark on old branches is full of
: cracks and there really are that huge number of mistletoe seedlings

That is the odd thing -- the branches have smooth clean bark -- no
canker etc. The mistletoe erupts from these. Also I should have
mentioned that early this year I fed the tree with N+P+K as directed
by a decent fruit tree book -- to no avail. All of this tree's
contemporaries (different varieties, all cookers) have small amounts
of mistletoe on them but no sign of sickness.

: growing on the tree. Worth looking to see that there isn't some other
: sap sucking parasite like woolly aphid making matters worse for the
: tree. Most trees I have seen in the UK co-exist happily with their
: mistletoe.

I'm pretty sure there is no serious woolly aphid infestation.
Ornamentals seem to be plagued by them this year, but I digress...

:
: | A few months ago I cut off most of the mistletoe but the tree still looks
: | pretty sick. Is there any hope for it?
:
: Unlikely. And the cause won't have been the mistletoe. 30 years is
: about the life of many apple trees.

: Could be old age, but I'd look for some other cause first. And maybe
: try an anti-fungal spray too.

Sure.

: Regards,
: Martin Brown

Thanks to all who followed up.

--
Tom Crane, Dept. Physics, Royal Holloway, University of London, Egham Hill,
Egham, Surrey, TW20 0EX, England.
Email: T.Crane at rhul dot ac dot uk
Fax: +44 (0) 1784 472794

In article , writes:
|
| That is the odd thing -- the branches have smooth clean bark -- no
| canker etc. The mistletoe erupts from these. Also I should have
| mentioned that early this year I fed the tree with N+P+K as directed
| by a decent fruit tree book -- to no avail. All of this tree's
| contemporaries (different varieties, all cookers) have small amounts
| of mistletoe on them but no sign of sickness.

Assuming that there is some evidence left, I suggest that you contact
someone in your Botany department - they may be interested.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.