"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from Cheryl Isaak contains these words:

On 7/28/07 5:59 AM, in article ,
"George.com"
wrote:

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found
2 bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself
$20,
$10 a bale is about right.

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had
done
well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob



I believe that is filed under - oh SHIT! Rake it up and compost on hot!
Cheryl

Don't worry. If thistles germinate in the mulch, they will be easy to
tweak out while small

the *******s will be dealt to, no doubt at all. They will never see
flowering time.

rob

"rachael simpson" wrote in message
...
Cheryl Isaak wrote:
On 7/28/07 5:59 AM, in article ,
"George.com"
wrote:

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2
bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself
$20,
$10 a bale is about right.

$10/bale???? I hope that's for Alfalfa, or Timothy at that price....

no, grass hay. The animal feed store at the borth of the city sells them for
$10 a pop. If you want to drive put into the country you can get them
cheaper from the farmer. I will do neither. 2 free bales just looked too
good to pass up. Any thistles will germinate at their peril. Must have been
a mid summer cut of hay judging by the thistle heads. The prickles do keep
the dogs off the garden though.

rob

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2 bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself $20,
$10 a bale is about right.

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had done
well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob

On 7/28/07 5:59 AM, in article , "George.com"
wrote:

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2 bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself $20,
$10 a bale is about right.

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had done
well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob



I believe that is filed under - oh SHIT! Rake it up and compost on hot!
Cheryl

Cheryl Isaak wrote:
On 7/28/07 5:59 AM, in article , "George.com"
wrote:

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2 bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself $20,
$10 a bale is about right.

$10/bale???? I hope that's for Alfalfa, or Timothy at that price....

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had done
well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob



I believe that is filed under - oh SHIT! Rake it up and compost on hot!
Cheryl


I agree with cheryl......big uh-oh.....thistles got to go....

'round here square bales go from $2.50+ (depending on quality, sprayed &
or not sprayed). You can get a nice big round bale starting at $15+.
Of course with the way the weather has been here, I wouldn't be
surprised to see hay prices go up. Every one will be short on hay this
year...we've only cut each field 2-3 times so far. By this time last
year, we had already gotten at least 5 cuts. We're talking 100 or so
round bales per cut.....that adds up.

Rachael aka Rae
Co-owner/operator
Simpson Hay Farms

"George.com" wrote in
:

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2
bales of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved
myself $20, $10 a bale is about right.

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had
done well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob



Repeat to yourself: Hay is not straw.

Also, hay is expected to go for near-gold prices this fall. You probably
could have bought eight bags of mulch for what you could have got for those
two bails. I kid you not, I heard of a farmer here in Indiana being
offered $15/bale for a 1000 bale load NOW.

"George.com" wrote in message
...
A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2 bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself $20,
$10 a bale is about right.

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had done
well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob

I do not have the answer, however
I have this for examples of correct mulching.

Mulching - http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/sub3.html
and
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/M/ Look up "Mulch"

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

In article ,
rachael simpson wrote:

Cheryl Isaak wrote:
On 7/28/07 5:59 AM, in article , "George.com"
wrote:

A couple of nights ago whilst driving home on the open road I found 2 bales
of hay. I managed to get them in the car & figured I had saved myself $20,
$10 a bale is about right.

$10/bale???? I hope that's for Alfalfa, or Timothy at that price....

I spread one bale around some trees today as mulch. I reckoned I had done
well until I noticed all the thistle seeds in the mix.

rob



I believe that is filed under - oh SHIT! Rake it up and compost on hot!
Cheryl


I agree with cheryl......big uh-oh.....thistles got to go....

'round here square bales go from $2.50+ (depending on quality, sprayed &
or not sprayed). You can get a nice big round bale starting at $15+.
Of course with the way the weather has been here, I wouldn't be
surprised to see hay prices go up. Every one will be short on hay this
year...we've only cut each field 2-3 times so far. By this time last
year, we had already gotten at least 5 cuts. We're talking 100 or so
round bales per cut.....that adds up.

Rachael aka Rae
Co-owner/operator
Simpson Hay Farms

Wow, regional differences...

We are proud to get one cutting a year of timothy a year. We started
mowing two days ago. When we sell hay, we get $9 in the field for a
50# square bale. (We can't grow alfalfa. Our soil pH is wrong.) We
don't spray. (Are you talking about spraying with propionic acid or
herbicides?)

When we sell a 5x5 round bale, it's $60. Mostly we don't sell any,
but if we have a few extra and a neighbor needs some, we'll sell a
few bales. (Squares go for nearly $500/ton here in February!)

We normally put up 1000 square bales and 200 ton of round bales to
feed our cows and several really bratty horses. We normally have to
feed for 250 days/year. (High latitudes, deep snow country.) Our
protein runs between 8 and 13%, depending on the year. (I'd have to
look in my records to give you ADF & TDN's.)

Chris and I mowed a 30 acre meadow in 5 hours today. We may have set
a land-speed record for our place : ) Our newest tractor is a 1964
Ford 881 and our oldest is a 1951 Model M John Deere. That's what we
were running today, both with sickle bar mowers. (Don't laugh -- all
of our equipment is paid for, and we can fix all of it with a
screwdriver, a pair of pliers and a cresent wrench. Or damned near.)

Anyway, I found some yellow hawksbeard in one meadow last year. It's
a horrendous noxious weed that will totally invade a hay meadow, if
given half a chance. I carefully mapped the location of the weeds,
then forgot all about it this spring. The stuff is *really* hard to
eradicate, because it spreads by seed _and_ by creeping rhizomes.
(When I found it, I pulled every plant, bagged them and burned them,
but I know the roots will kick up new plants this year.)

We stopped letting friends park their pickups and horse trailers on
the ranch, because vehicles transport noxious weed seeds in mud on
the vehicle frames so efficiently. We provide alternate parking on
an old log deck away from our hay meadows. (We're at the trailhead
of a popular place for people to ride their horses.)

Jan in Alaska

Jan Flora wrote:
In article ,
rachael simpson wrote:
*snip*
I agree with cheryl......big uh-oh.....thistles got to go....

'round here square bales go from $2.50+ (depending on quality, sprayed &
or not sprayed). You can get a nice big round bale starting at $15+.
Of course with the way the weather has been here, I wouldn't be
surprised to see hay prices go up. Every one will be short on hay this
year...we've only cut each field 2-3 times so far. By this time last
year, we had already gotten at least 5 cuts. We're talking 100 or so
round bales per cut.....that adds up.

Rachael aka Rae
Co-owner/operator
Simpson Hay Farms

Wow, regional differences...

I'd say!

We are proud to get one cutting a year of timothy a year. We started
mowing two days ago. When we sell hay, we get $9 in the field for a
50# square bale. (We can't grow alfalfa. Our soil pH is wrong.) We
don't spray. (Are you talking about spraying with propionic acid or
herbicides?)


Spray fields are the ones around turkey, chicken, and hog houses/farms.
They spray the fields there with the liquid nitrogen aka waste. Some
people don't believe in feeding it to their stock..say it's not good
enough, but with the scarcity of hay this year (and last) more people
are turning to it because it is cheaper and there is more of it
available. Most of the hay on those farms is coastal bermuda, oat, and
rye (in winter only). We have a contract with some of those farms
around here to keep their fields cut and cleaned to regulations. We get
the hay to use however we see fit ie, keep or sell. The round bales from
spray fields start at $15.00. Rye/oats are $25.00.

We also cut and bale or just bale for others around here. They pay,
they keep, or we go halves....half for them, half for us.

We start our prices for hay a little cheaper than our local competition,
usually break just over even by the end of the season. When we get the
equipment payments off of us, we will clear more.

When we sell a 5x5 round bale, it's $60. Mostly we don't sell any,
but if we have a few extra and a neighbor needs some, we'll sell a
few bales. (Squares go for nearly $500/ton here in February!)

We normally put up 1000 square bales and 200 ton of round bales to
feed our cows and several really bratty horses. We normally have to
feed for 250 days/year. (High latitudes, deep snow country.) Our
protein runs between 8 and 13%, depending on the year. (I'd have to
look in my records to give you ADF & TDN's.)

Our cows and horses are on pasture, and we throw a few hay bales out
every few weeks. For 5 cows (3 cows, 2 calves), and 10 horses in that
location, we used about 75 round bales last year. With the current
drought, we will need a lot more hay this year for winter.

Chris and I mowed a 30 acre meadow in 5 hours today. We may have set
a land-speed record for our place : ) Our newest tractor is a 1964
Ford 881 and our oldest is a 1951 Model M John Deere. That's what we
were running today, both with sickle bar mowers. (Don't laugh -- all
of our equipment is paid for, and we can fix all of it with a
screwdriver, a pair of pliers and a cresent wrench. Or damned near.)

Hey, payed for is the best type....when they still run after the payment
is over with! We have a Case/New Holland round baler (can't remember
the model #, but it's only about 5-6 years old, from before new holland
went blue!, bought used and only one payment left!) a Massey Furgeson
399(was used) & 431(brand new upon purchase), still paying on both, and
a Vandmeer cutter (paid for!). The tedder and the rake are both Case I
think, and they are paid for.

Headed to the ag office today to see about applying for a usda loan.
Have resisted doing such for 4 years. The only loans we have taken out
were to finance the tractors & equipment. According to the website, we
still qualify for beginners loans. Want to buy some farm land to tend,
and I want to get a stud service started with our 2 paint ponies and one
quarter horse. They throw beautiful babies, so should do well there
with then right advertising and word-of-mouth. Paint ponies are a rare
thing around here. Also looking at new pasture land, as I found out some
info on the other pasture I had posted about in the past under the
"help" thread. It turns out that plans are to re-route a local highway
thru the area by that pasture within the next 5 years. Want to get away
from that. Will probably sell out when that time comes.

Anyway, I found some yellow hawksbeard in one meadow last year. It's
a horrendous noxious weed that will totally invade a hay meadow, if
given half a chance. I carefully mapped the location of the weeds,
then forgot all about it this spring. The stuff is *really* hard to
eradicate, because it spreads by seed _and_ by creeping rhizomes.
(When I found it, I pulled every plant, bagged them and burned them,
but I know the roots will kick up new plants this year.)

Sounds like our pigweed. We have an awful time with pigweed and crab
grass getting into the hay. Totally takes over if allowed and un-watched.

We stopped letting friends park their pickups and horse trailers on
the ranch, because vehicles transport noxious weed seeds in mud on
the vehicle frames so efficiently. We provide alternate parking on
an old log deck away from our hay meadows. (We're at the trailhead
of a popular place for people to ride their horses.)

We don't have that problem although we are near the opening to the dinny
woods trail, don't have much land open here at the house....People
usually park in the driveways and open areas near the turkey houses/farms.

Jan in Alaska

Oh, we generally set our baler to produce 4x5s, as they are a bit easier
for our customers to manage....but also do 5x5's.

Rae

In article ,
Janet Baraclough wrote:

The message
from Jan Flora contains these words:


Anyway, I found some yellow hawksbeard in one meadow last year. It's
a horrendous noxious weed that will totally invade a hay meadow, if
given half a chance. I carefully mapped the location of the weeds,
then forgot all about it this spring. The stuff is *really* hard to
eradicate, because it spreads by seed _and_ by creeping rhizomes.

I've found the best way to eliminate the yh roots is to bunch the
foliage to one side in my hand, slide a sharp knife down into the soil
and slice through the root as deep as possible. Very few of them will
come back from deep cutting.

We stopped letting friends park their pickups and horse trailers on
the ranch, because vehicles transport noxious weed seeds in mud on
the vehicle frames so efficiently.

You should see how careful Australia is about that; hugely impressive.

Janet

About 50 years ago a neighbor about 2 miles away was able to acquire a
few truck loads of discarded sheep wool. The intent was to enrich the
soil. The result was we have a bunch of weird weeds just about
everywhere.

DEATH to AJUGA.

Bill

--

S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade
http://www.ocutech.com/ High tech Vison aid
This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with
Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational
and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit.

In article ,
Janet Baraclough wrote:

The message

from William Wagner contains these words:

In article ,
Janet Baraclough wrote:

The message
from Jan Flora contains these words:


Anyway, I found some yellow hawksbeard in one meadow last year. It's
a horrendous noxious weed that will totally invade a hay meadow, if
given half a chance. I carefully mapped the location of the weeds,
then forgot all about it this spring. The stuff is *really* hard to
eradicate, because it spreads by seed _and_ by creeping rhizomes.

I've found the best way to eliminate the yh roots is to bunch the
foliage to one side in my hand, slide a sharp knife down into the soil
and slice through the root as deep as possible. Very few of them will
come back from deep cutting.

We stopped letting friends park their pickups and horse trailers on
the ranch, because vehicles transport noxious weed seeds in mud on
the vehicle frames so efficiently.

You should see how careful Australia is about that; hugely impressive.

Janet

About 50 years ago a neighbor about 2 miles away was able to acquire a
few truck loads of discarded sheep wool. The intent was to enrich the
soil. The result was we have a bunch of weird weeds just about
everywhere.

Hey, I use lots of discarded sheep wool in my compost heaps
(clippings from the shearing shed floor)
...no weird weeds have resulted, which is rather disappointing. What am
I doing wrong? :-)

Janet.

Give it a bit of time.

Bill

--

S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade
http://www.ocutech.com/ High tech Vison aid
This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with
Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational
and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit.

Janet Baraclough wrote:

Hey, I use lots of discarded sheep wool in my compost heaps
(clippings from the shearing shed floor)
...no weird weeds have resulted, which is rather disappointing. What am
I doing wrong? :-)

Will that stuff decompose?

So, the weird weeds, is that like Lamb's Ear? ;-)

Hey, I use lots of discarded sheep wool in my compost heaps
(clippings from the shearing shed floor)

We do the same (on a smaller scale) with cat and dog hair (which gets
recovered from any imaginable corner of the house).

...no weird weeds have resulted, which is rather disappointing. What am
I doing wrong? :-)

You need to be shearing alien sheep from outer space. That's where
the truly weird human-eating weeds come from in old movies, right?

doofy wrote in news:46af8aec$0$27171
:

Janet Baraclough wrote:

Hey, I use lots of discarded sheep wool in my compost heaps
(clippings from the shearing shed floor)
...no weird weeds have resulted, which is rather disappointing. What am
I doing wrong? :-)

Will that stuff decompose?

So, the weird weeds, is that like Lamb's Ear? ;-)

No. Lamb's Rear.

In article ,
Janet Baraclough wrote:

The message
from Jan Flora contains these words:


Anyway, I found some yellow hawksbeard in one meadow last year. It's
a horrendous noxious weed that will totally invade a hay meadow, if
given half a chance. I carefully mapped the location of the weeds,
then forgot all about it this spring. The stuff is *really* hard to
eradicate, because it spreads by seed _and_ by creeping rhizomes.

I've found the best way to eliminate the yh roots is to bunch the
foliage to one side in my hand, slide a sharp knife down into the soil
and slice through the root as deep as possible. Very few of them will
come back from deep cutting.

I'll try that. The SO asked what sort of herbicides I have. Uh, none,
except 15% acetic acid. I don't use garden poisons...

I told him to get a handful of urea and burn each plant. He
didn't do that yesterday, so I'll go cut those plants today,
as you recommend. Our infestation is very small and localized
right now. I pulled every bloom & seedhead off the plants and
burned them yesterday.

We stopped letting friends park their pickups and horse trailers on
the ranch, because vehicles transport noxious weed seeds in mud on
the vehicle frames so efficiently.

You should see how careful Australia is about that; hugely impressive.

Hmm. Do they make people pressure wash their vehicle frames?

Everytime I drive into Alaska from Canada (from running up western
Canada from Seattle), I stop in the first town in AK and
pressure wash my rig, mostly underneath. They have Canada thistle
in western Canada. We have a very small bit of it in Alaska right
now and our weed warriors are trying to eliminate it.

Janet

Jan