Hi

After recent BBC and TimesOnline news articles saying how beneficial Aloe
Vera is I have been trying to find an organic, chemical free supplier.

I have found one that says they use lemon juice to stabilise their product
but another manufacturer, (who uses chemicals) says that's impossible
because as soon as you cut it starts going off. They say it must have been
heated which destroys most of the nutrients any way.

I would value some unbiased scientific opinions (preferable in layman's
terms if possible) on the validity of these statements.

Hopefully this is the appropriate group to ask.

Thanks for any input given

D

in article , Dave at
wrote on 6/24/05 5:04 PM:

Hi

After recent BBC and TimesOnline news articles saying how beneficial Aloe
Vera is I have been trying to find an organic, chemical free supplier.

I have found one that says they use lemon juice to stabilise their product
but another manufacturer, (who uses chemicals) says that's impossible
because as soon as you cut it starts going off. They say it must have been
heated which destroys most of the nutrients any way.

I would value some unbiased scientific opinions (preferable in layman's
terms if possible) on the validity of these statements.

Hopefully this is the appropriate group to ask.

Thanks for any input given

D


All unpreserved juices start to decay as soon as they are taken off the
vine/tree/bush. Lemon juice - actually the Vitamin C, ascorbic acid - is a
preservative that prevents oxidation. Herbalife used to sell a "natural"
aloe vera juice that had to be kept refrigerated. I'm not sure if it was
pasteurized or not.

--
John Gentile Editor, Rhode Island Apple Group
RIAG Web page: www.wbwip.com/riag/
"I never make mistakes, I only have unexpected learning opportunities!"

Hi

So would lemon juice be enough to preserve the product or would it need to
be processed too?

Thanks
D
"John Gentile" wrote in message
...
in article , Dave at
wrote on 6/24/05 5:04 PM:

Hi

After recent BBC and TimesOnline news articles saying how beneficial Aloe
Vera is I have been trying to find an organic, chemical free supplier.

I have found one that says they use lemon juice to stabilise their
product
but another manufacturer, (who uses chemicals) says that's impossible
because as soon as you cut it starts going off. They say it must have
been
heated which destroys most of the nutrients any way.

I would value some unbiased scientific opinions (preferable in layman's
terms if possible) on the validity of these statements.

Hopefully this is the appropriate group to ask.

Thanks for any input given

D


All unpreserved juices start to decay as soon as they are taken off the
vine/tree/bush. Lemon juice - actually the Vitamin C, ascorbic acid - is a
preservative that prevents oxidation. Herbalife used to sell a "natural"
aloe vera juice that had to be kept refrigerated. I'm not sure if it was
pasteurized or not.

--
John Gentile Editor, Rhode Island Apple Group
RIAG Web page: www.wbwip.com/riag/
"I never make mistakes, I only have unexpected learning opportunities!"

Dave

Addition of lemon juice will by degree lower the pH ( increase the
acidity ) of the Aloe vera system. At best your going to get it down to
minimum of pH 4.00 (Citric acid) but probabley the pH will be higher. This
action will provide some degree of preservation in terms of antimicrobial
control but I think refrigeration would still be mandatory.

Acidification to this degree is however unlikely to retard Yeasts and
certain types of bacetrial growth for long periods.

If you are determined to be chemical free I suggest you buy frozen
concentrate at source and thaw as required.

Pasteurisation is an option, I dont think that mild heat treament has any
adverse effects on the so called Manones in Aloe vera



Best N10


"Dave" wrote in message
...
Hi

So would lemon juice be enough to preserve the product or would it need to
be processed too?

Thanks
D
"John Gentile" wrote in message
...
in article , Dave at
wrote on 6/24/05 5:04 PM:

Hi

After recent BBC and TimesOnline news articles saying how beneficial
Aloe
Vera is I have been trying to find an organic, chemical free supplier.

I have found one that says they use lemon juice to stabilise their
product
but another manufacturer, (who uses chemicals) says that's impossible
because as soon as you cut it starts going off. They say it must have
been
heated which destroys most of the nutrients any way.

I would value some unbiased scientific opinions (preferable in layman's
terms if possible) on the validity of these statements.

Hopefully this is the appropriate group to ask.

Thanks for any input given

D


All unpreserved juices start to decay as soon as they are taken off the
vine/tree/bush. Lemon juice - actually the Vitamin C, ascorbic acid - is
a
preservative that prevents oxidation. Herbalife used to sell a "natural"
aloe vera juice that had to be kept refrigerated. I'm not sure if it was
pasteurized or not.

--
John Gentile Editor, Rhode Island Apple Group
RIAG Web page: www.wbwip.com/riag/
"I never make mistakes, I only have unexpected learning opportunities!"

Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are talking
about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does this
mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few weeks after
opening?

Thank you for your help

D

"N10" wrote in message
...
Dave

Addition of lemon juice will by degree lower the pH ( increase the
acidity ) of the Aloe vera system. At best your going to get it down to
minimum of pH 4.00 (Citric acid) but probabley the pH will be higher.
This action will provide some degree of preservation in terms of
antimicrobial control but I think refrigeration would still be mandatory.

Acidification to this degree is however unlikely to retard Yeasts and
certain types of bacetrial growth for long periods.

If you are determined to be chemical free I suggest you buy frozen
concentrate at source and thaw as required.

Pasteurisation is an option, I dont think that mild heat treament has any
adverse effects on the so called Manones in Aloe vera



Best N10


"Dave" wrote in message
...
Hi

So would lemon juice be enough to preserve the product or would it need
to be processed too?

Thanks
D
"John Gentile" wrote in message
...
in article , Dave at
wrote on 6/24/05 5:04 PM:

Hi

After recent BBC and TimesOnline news articles saying how beneficial
Aloe
Vera is I have been trying to find an organic, chemical free supplier.

I have found one that says they use lemon juice to stabilise their
product
but another manufacturer, (who uses chemicals) says that's impossible
because as soon as you cut it starts going off. They say it must have
been
heated which destroys most of the nutrients any way.

I would value some unbiased scientific opinions (preferable in layman's
terms if possible) on the validity of these statements.

Hopefully this is the appropriate group to ask.

Thanks for any input given

D


All unpreserved juices start to decay as soon as they are taken off the
vine/tree/bush. Lemon juice - actually the Vitamin C, ascorbic acid - is
a
preservative that prevents oxidation. Herbalife used to sell a "natural"
aloe vera juice that had to be kept refrigerated. I'm not sure if it was
pasteurized or not.

--
John Gentile Editor, Rhode Island Apple
Group
RIAG Web page: www.wbwip.com/riag/
"I never make mistakes, I only have unexpected learning opportunities!"

Dave wrote:
Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are talking
about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does this
mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few weeks after
opening?


If the yeasts are already in the bottle, they will not care that it is
sealed and they will still grow. Usually when product labels instruct
you to refrigerate after opening, it is because you are letting bugs
into the bottle which will then grow. Usually these products are sterile
or, at least, pateurised (heat treated) before packaging, and they're
packaged into sterile containers and sealed. Keeping it cold wont do it
any harm regardless of whether it needs it or not.

Perhaps the best option for you would be to buy an aloe vera plant!
You'd certainly get it as fresh as you want it. I dont know anything
about growing them, or how fast they grow, but I certainly know that you
can do it.

Scott.

lol

I would love to buy an Aloe Vera plant, but I cant seem to find a source of
the Aloe Barbadensis Miller variety here in UK.

D

"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...
Dave wrote:
Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are
talking about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does
this mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few
weeks after opening?


If the yeasts are already in the bottle, they will not care that it is
sealed and they will still grow. Usually when product labels instruct you
to refrigerate after opening, it is because you are letting bugs into the
bottle which will then grow. Usually these products are sterile or, at
least, pateurised (heat treated) before packaging, and they're packaged
into sterile containers and sealed. Keeping it cold wont do it any harm
regardless of whether it needs it or not.

Perhaps the best option for you would be to buy an aloe vera plant! You'd
certainly get it as fresh as you want it. I dont know anything about
growing them, or how fast they grow, but I certainly know that you can do
it.

Scott.

Dave wrote:
lol

I would love to buy an Aloe Vera plant, but I cant seem to find a source of
the Aloe Barbadensis Miller variety here in UK.


Well, this cactus nursery keeps A. barbadensis, which they also describe
as "Ugly boring long green leaves. Someone must like it!" haha. Dont
know which cultivar it is (I'm not sure it's important).

http://www.croston-cactus.co.uk

Also, I dont know how well it grows in your climate... all things you'll
have to investigate. Maybe you'll have to buy a greenhouse as well (:

Aloe barbadensis Miller is not a valid name.

Aloe vera (L.) Burman, f. is the correct name for the plant and has been all
along. It has yellow flowers.

The orange flowered plant with spotted leaves is the impostor.


"Dave" wrote in message
...
lol

I would love to buy an Aloe Vera plant, but I cant seem to find a source
of the Aloe Barbadensis Miller variety here in UK.

D

"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...
Dave wrote:
Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are
talking about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does
this mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few
weeks after opening?


If the yeasts are already in the bottle, they will not care that it is
sealed and they will still grow. Usually when product labels instruct you
to refrigerate after opening, it is because you are letting bugs into the
bottle which will then grow. Usually these products are sterile or, at
least, pateurised (heat treated) before packaging, and they're packaged
into sterile containers and sealed. Keeping it cold wont do it any harm
regardless of whether it needs it or not.

Perhaps the best option for you would be to buy an aloe vera plant! You'd
certainly get it as fresh as you want it. I dont know anything about
growing them, or how fast they grow, but I certainly know that you can do
it.

Scott.

Hmmm. Well, I've never realy had anything to do with Aloes of any kind,
but having had a look around, it seems that both are commonly used (even
in taxonomy circles), even if not correct.

Scott.

Cereus-validus..... wrote:
Aloe barbadensis Miller is not a valid name.

Aloe vera (L.) Burman, f. is the correct name for the plant and has been all
along. It has yellow flowers.

The orange flowered plant with spotted leaves is the impostor.


"Dave" wrote in message
...

lol

I would love to buy an Aloe Vera plant, but I cant seem to find a source
of the Aloe Barbadensis Miller variety here in UK.

D

"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...

Dave wrote:

Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are
talking about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does
this mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few
weeks after opening?


If the yeasts are already in the bottle, they will not care that it is
sealed and they will still grow. Usually when product labels instruct you
to refrigerate after opening, it is because you are letting bugs into the
bottle which will then grow. Usually these products are sterile or, at
least, pateurised (heat treated) before packaging, and they're packaged
into sterile containers and sealed. Keeping it cold wont do it any harm
regardless of whether it needs it or not.

Perhaps the best option for you would be to buy an aloe vera plant! You'd
certainly get it as fresh as you want it. I dont know anything about
growing them, or how fast they grow, but I certainly know that you can do
it.

Scott.

Taxonomy circles?

What's that?

A group of old ladies that sits around doing taxonomy?

According to the International Code of Botanical Nomenclature, a plant can
have only one correct name.

Many plants are sold with the wrong names in the horticultural trade. That's
not taxonomy. That's laziness.


"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...

Hmmm. Well, I've never realy had anything to do with Aloes of any kind,
but having had a look around, it seems that both are commonly used (even
in taxonomy circles), even if not correct.

Scott.

Cereus-validus..... wrote:
Aloe barbadensis Miller is not a valid name.

Aloe vera (L.) Burman, f. is the correct name for the plant and has been
all along. It has yellow flowers.

The orange flowered plant with spotted leaves is the impostor.


"Dave" wrote in message
...

lol

I would love to buy an Aloe Vera plant, but I cant seem to find a source
of the Aloe Barbadensis Miller variety here in UK.

D

"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...

Dave wrote:

Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are
talking about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does
this mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few
weeks after opening?


If the yeasts are already in the bottle, they will not care that it is
sealed and they will still grow. Usually when product labels instruct
you to refrigerate after opening, it is because you are letting bugs
into the bottle which will then grow. Usually these products are sterile
or, at least, pateurised (heat treated) before packaging, and they're
packaged into sterile containers and sealed. Keeping it cold wont do it
any harm regardless of whether it needs it or not.

Perhaps the best option for you would be to buy an aloe vera plant!
You'd certainly get it as fresh as you want it. I dont know anything
about growing them, or how fast they grow, but I certainly know that you
can do it.

Scott.

Dave wrote:
lol

I would love to buy an Aloe Vera plant, but I cant seem to find a source of
the Aloe Barbadensis Miller variety here in UK.

D

"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...

Dave wrote:

Hi

Thanks for this reply, it does help me to understand what they are
talking about.

If the bottle is sealed would it need to be refrigerated before it was
opened? Would the yeast and other bacteria grow while sealed. Or does
this mean it would need to be refrigerated and consumed within a few
weeks after opening?


If the yeasts are already in the bottle, they will not care that it is
sealed and they will still grow. Usually when product labels instruct you
to refrigerate after opening, it is because you are letting bugs into the
bottle which will then grow. Usually these products are sterile or, at
least, pateurised (heat treated) before packaging, and they're packaged
into sterile containers and sealed. Keeping it cold wont do it any harm
regardless of whether it needs it or not.

Perhaps the best option for you would be to buy an aloe vera plant! You'd
certainly get it as fresh as you want it. I dont know anything about
growing them, or how fast they grow, but I certainly know that you can do
it.

Scott.




One way to avoid all these problems would be to explore the possibility
of freeze drying. You need a source for -40 temperature, and some vacuum
pumps.

Freeze drying has been used to keep bacterial strains viable for over 10
years at room temperature.

Since you probably just want the gooey juices, why not try drying with
mild heat and reconstituting in a blender with water?

This sounds like more fun than slamming it in the fridge anyway

Cereus-validus..... wrote:
Taxonomy circles?
What's that?
A group of old ladies that sits around doing taxonomy?


Umm... whatever you reckon.


According to the International Code of Botanical Nomenclature, a plant can
have only one correct name.


That doesn't mean that others are not commonly used. You'll find both
listed in most places as synonyms. I think it may actually be an old
scientific name for the plant.


Many plants are sold with the wrong names in the horticultural trade. That's
not taxonomy. That's laziness.


I didnt say it was correct, incorrect, lazy or otherwise. I simply said
that both of them are commonly used, and given that this person was
looking for the plant, then I'd say a commonly used name is better than
a technically correct name.

The name popularly used for the species is the same as the correct
scientific name: Aloe vera

Stop being such a twit.

Just because other people are stupid, that doesn't mean you need to be
stupid too. On the other hand, maybe you do if you are really that insecure?


"Scott Coutts" wrote in message
...
Cereus-validus..... wrote:
Taxonomy circles?
What's that?
A group of old ladies that sits around doing taxonomy?


Umm... whatever you reckon.


According to the International Code of Botanical Nomenclature, a plant
can have only one correct name.


That doesn't mean that others are not commonly used. You'll find both
listed in most places as synonyms. I think it may actually be an old
scientific name for the plant.


Many plants are sold with the wrong names in the horticultural trade.
That's not taxonomy. That's laziness.


I didnt say it was correct, incorrect, lazy or otherwise. I simply said
that both of them are commonly used, and given that this person was
looking for the plant, then I'd say a commonly used name is better than a
technically correct name.

Cereus-validus..... wrote:
The name popularly used for the species is the same as the correct
scientific name: Aloe vera


That is one of the many popularly used names.


Stop being such a twit.


Start paying attention.


Just because other people are stupid, that doesn't mean you need to be
stupid too. On the other hand, maybe you do if you are really that insecure?


That does not even make sense.