Two years ago, while I was having my garden flattened by a bloody great big
digger, I had a brilliant idea - why don't I get him to dig a lake! No
water table.

Get a liner? Estimated cost £17,000.

A big pond? Liner needs to be joined on site - big cost.

A smaller pond. OK!

Ahhh....

Get some fish? THREE HUNDRED QUID EACH!!!

Smaller fish. OK!

Friend offers 50 free goldfish. Great!!

Water goes dirty green colour - can't see fish!

Another friend says, "buy a filter". Great. EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY
QUID!!!!!

PLEEESE HELP!!! I can't take any more of this.

I'm told I have about 8000 gallons of green water and a surface area of
about 400 sq feet. Can some one suggest the cheapest way of making the
water sparkle. If this means a filter and a pump, then which one -and what
about UV?

Any help would be very much appreciated. It all seemed such a good idea at
the beginning!

Thanks

JIM

In article , Orincs
wrote:

Two years ago, while I was having my garden flattened by a bloody great big
digger, I had a brilliant idea - why don't I get him to dig a lake! No
water table.

Get a liner? Estimated cost £17,000.

A big pond? Liner needs to be joined on site - big cost.

A smaller pond. OK!

Ahhh....

Get some fish? THREE HUNDRED QUID EACH!!!

Smaller fish. OK!

Friend offers 50 free goldfish. Great!!

Water goes dirty green colour - can't see fish!

Another friend says, "buy a filter". Great. EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY
QUID!!!!!

PLEEESE HELP!!! I can't take any more of this.

I'm told I have about 8000 gallons of green water and a surface area of
about 400 sq feet. Can some one suggest the cheapest way of making the
water sparkle. If this means a filter and a pump, then which one -and what


about UV?

The best come from England:

http://www.tmc-ltd.co.uk/Pond/pro-add.asp


good luck

jay
Tue Jun 22, 2004




Any help would be very much appreciated. It all seemed such a good idea at
the beginning!

Thanks

JIM

That's 8000 gallons in US terms? Yowza, that's a lot of green water. It took
six weeks for my 3,000 gallons of new water to clear.

What a mechanical filter will do for you is strain some of the muck out of the
pond. Muck is one of algae's favorite foods. A pump will move the water to the
mechanical filter and provide water movement which will help some. A biological
filter won't help algae, it turns fish waste into plant fertilizer, which algae
is in its own demented fashion.

I'm posting the algae primer below here for you. Mainly your decision is the
amount of work you want to put into solving your algae problem. Constructing a
veggie filter is more work for you, whereas buying a UV filter would be fairly
quick to set up. It's all in what you want to handle at this point. Let us know
what you decide and how it works for you!

ALGAE PRIMER
~ Nutrients for all forms of algae are sun, new water, fish waste, fertilized
run off, rotting plants, blown in dirt.
~ New ponds and spring ponds need time for plants to get established, algae is
quicker at getting going.
~ add plants, of any kind, in the pond. Especially underwater plants.
~ or build a veggie filter* see below (one of the best and prettiest way to
clear a pond)
~ Shade is good - provided by lily pads, floating plants or artificial shade
for part of the day.
~ LOW fish stocking (20 gallons per goldfish, 100 per koi after starting with
1,000 gallons) and *not* overfeeding the fish. Too many fish and too much
feeding is probably responsible for most pea soup water, followed closely by
too much decaying plant matter, sludge and overall gunk in the water
~ clean up dead plant matter and screen for falling leaves in the fall. Clean
out pond once a year.
~ building ponds with bottom drains and skimmers.
~ do not use algaecides, they only make lots of suddenly dead algae and that
will feed the next algae bloom.
~ do not use products to dye to the water...
~ do not worry about algae that grows on things (substrate algae) this is good
for a pond
~ gently remove string algae or look to the end of this article for information
using clay (koi clay or plain clay kitty litter) on string algae.
http://www.sfbakc.org/koienews/clayvsclay.html
or try String Algae Buster which works by " forcing the strands of string algae
to take in excess calcium from the surrounding water. When the algae absorbs
this calcium, the strands break off, floating to the surface. Once they
separate, they will either go into the skimmer, or be easily weeded out by
hand"
~ water movement and occasional water changes of 10%
~ add a sludge consumer, concentrated bacteria.
some rec.ponders use http://www.united-tech.com/m-aq4u-toc.html
~ Check your pH, too high, over 8.8, or too low, under 6.4, and most higher
plant forms can't take up the nutrients.
~ UV lights work on suspended algae (green water) - does cost some $$
~ adding a combination mechanical and biological filter to screen gunk, dead
algae and convert fishy ammonia waste for fish health.
~ read the following webpage for the use of barley straw
http://www.aquabotanic.com/barleyarticle.html
~ patience, more patience, remember to be patient and time
;-)

*Veggie filter ~ running the pond's water through plants
- as easy as floating water hyacinth in top of a stock tank and planting
watercress in your waterfall (my method ;-)
or
read Ingrid's post on plant filters:
"The essence of a plant filter is a water proof container with the water from
the pond
being pumped in one end flowing thru the roots of various plants and flowing
back
into the pond at the other end.
It needs to be long enough that solids settle to the bottom OR have filter
material
that will slow or hold the solids (and get rinsed out periodically).
It needs plants of different kinds to maximize removal of all wastes.
it needs sufficient amount of plants to remove in one day all the wastes
produced by
the fish load in one day. It needs plants with extensive roots and/or plants
that get big so they used up more
nutrients. It needs to be only 8-12" deep so it doesnt go anaerobic."
or go he
http://www.iheartmypond.com/Design/D...rs/default.asp



kathy :-)
algae primer
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html

Loads of plants and less fish?

In article , Ka30P
wrote:

That's 8000 gallons in US terms? Yowza, that's a lot of green water. It took
six weeks for my 3,000 gallons of new water to clear.

What a mechanical filter will do for you is strain some of the muck out of the
pond. Muck is one of algae's favorite foods. A pump will move the water to the
mechanical filter and provide water movement which will help some. A
biological
filter won't help algae, it turns fish waste into plant fertilizer, which
algae
is in its own demented fashion.

I'm posting the algae primer below here for you. Mainly your decision is the
amount of work you want to put into solving your algae problem. Constructing a
veggie filter is more work for you, whereas buying a UV filter would be fairly
quick to set up. It's all in what you want to handle at this point. Let us
know
what you decide and how it works for you!

ALGAE PRIMER

~ LOW fish stocking (20 gallons per goldfish, 100 per koi after starting with
1,000 gallons) and *not* overfeeding the fish. Too many fish and too much
feeding is probably responsible for most pea soup water,


I don't think this is very accurate; same pond, same fish and feeding
but 2 months later with no green water is common.

jay
Tue Jun 22, 2004





followed closely by
too much decaying plant matter, sludge and overall gunk in the water
~ clean up dead plant matter and screen for falling leaves in the fall. Clean
out pond once a year.
~ building ponds with bottom drains and skimmers.
~ do not use algaecides, they only make lots of suddenly dead algae and that
will feed the next algae bloom.
~ do not use products to dye to the water...
~ do not worry about algae that grows on things (substrate algae) this is good
for a pond
~ gently remove string algae or look to the end of this article for
information
using clay (koi clay or plain clay kitty litter) on string algae.
http://www.sfbakc.org/koienews/clayvsclay.html
or try String Algae Buster which works by " forcing the strands of string
algae
to take in excess calcium from the surrounding water. When the algae absorbs
this calcium, the strands break off, floating to the surface. Once they
separate, they will either go into the skimmer, or be easily weeded out by
hand"
~ water movement and occasional water changes of 10%
~ add a sludge consumer, concentrated bacteria.
some rec.ponders use http://www.united-tech.com/m-aq4u-toc.html
~ Check your pH, too high, over 8.8, or too low, under 6.4, and most higher
plant forms can't take up the nutrients.
~ UV lights work on suspended algae (green water) - does cost some $$
~ adding a combination mechanical and biological filter to screen gunk, dead
algae and convert fishy ammonia waste for fish health.
~ read the following webpage for the use of barley straw
http://www.aquabotanic.com/barleyarticle.html
~ patience, more patience, remember to be patient and time
;-)

*Veggie filter ~ running the pond's water through plants
- as easy as floating water hyacinth in top of a stock tank and planting
watercress in your waterfall (my method ;-)
or
read Ingrid's post on plant filters:
"The essence of a plant filter is a water proof container with the water from
the pond
being pumped in one end flowing thru the roots of various plants and flowing
back
into the pond at the other end.
It needs to be long enough that solids settle to the bottom OR have filter
material
that will slow or hold the solids (and get rinsed out periodically).
It needs plants of different kinds to maximize removal of all wastes.
it needs sufficient amount of plants to remove in one day all the wastes
produced by
the fish load in one day. It needs plants with extensive roots and/or plants
that get big so they used up more
nutrients. It needs to be only 8-12" deep so it doesnt go anaerobic."
or go he
http://www.iheartmypond.com/Design/D...rs/default.asp



kathy :-)
algae primer
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html

Jay wrote ~ LOW fish stocking (20 gallons per goldfish, 100 per koi after
starting with
1,000 gallons) and *not* overfeeding the fish. Too many fish and too much
feeding is probably responsible for most pea soup water,

I don't think this is very accurate; same pond, same fish and feeding
but 2 months later with no green water is common.

I'm not sure what you mean and how it refers to the above statement. Care to
elaborate?


kathy :-)
algae primer
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html

In article , Ka30P
wrote:

Jay wrote ~ LOW fish stocking (20 gallons per goldfish, 100 per koi after
starting with
1,000 gallons) and *not* overfeeding the fish. Too many fish and too much
feeding is probably responsible for most pea soup water,

I don't think this is very accurate; same pond, same fish and feeding
but 2 months later with no green water is common.

I'm not sure what you mean and how it refers to the above statement. Care to
elaborate?

Yes, I should of been clearer.


A pond that has green water does clear without changing the fish load
or the level of feeding. It generally does not return during that same
season despite the fact that the same amount of fish and feeding is the
as it was when the green water was present.

I think its more accurate to associate green water with higher pH, rise
in water temps and available phosphates.

jay
Tue Jun 22, 2004





kathy :-)
algae primer
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html

jay wrote I think its more accurate to associate green water with higher pH,
rise
in water temps and available phosphates.

I see what you are getting at.
And that probably is the case in well managed ponds.

But I guess I'm working from the premise that many of the green water problems
random folks come to rec.ponds with are associated with a heavy fish load,
overfeeding and a pond that has a heavy load of organic gunk. Remember that
Wall Street Journal article of a couple years ago? People jumping on the hot
gardening trend of ponds and ending up with a slimey, green mess.

I could be guilty of assuming facts not in evidence ;-)

That said, that's why I put down every conceivable reason and solution to cover
all the bases. Even UV ;-)



kathy :-)
algae primer
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html

it sounds like new pond greening. with aeration it will clear on its own, but veggie
filters are cheap and easy. Ingrid

EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:

jay wrote I think its more accurate to associate green water with higher pH,
rise
in water temps and available phosphates.

I see what you are getting at.
And that probably is the case in well managed ponds.

But I guess I'm working from the premise that many of the green water problems
random folks come to rec.ponds with are associated with a heavy fish load,
overfeeding and a pond that has a heavy load of organic gunk. Remember that
Wall Street Journal article of a couple years ago? People jumping on the hot
gardening trend of ponds and ending up with a slimey, green mess.

I could be guilty of assuming facts not in evidence ;-)

That said, that's why I put down every conceivable reason and solution to cover
all the bases. Even UV ;-)



kathy :-)
algae primer
http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

Orincs wrote:
Two years ago, while I was having my garden flattened by a bloody great big
digger, I had a brilliant idea - why don't I get him to dig a lake! No
water table.

Get a liner? Estimated cost £17,000.

A big pond? Liner needs to be joined on site - big cost.

A smaller pond. OK!

Ahhh....

Get some fish? THREE HUNDRED QUID EACH!!!

Smaller fish. OK!

Friend offers 50 free goldfish. Great!!

Water goes dirty green colour - can't see fish!

Another friend says, "buy a filter". Great. EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY
QUID!!!!!

PLEEESE HELP!!! I can't take any more of this.

I'm told I have about 8000 gallons of green water and a surface area of
about 400 sq feet. Can some one suggest the cheapest way of making the
water sparkle. If this means a filter and a pump, then which one -and what
about UV?

Any help would be very much appreciated. It all seemed such a good idea at
the beginning!

Thanks

JIM



Get some real plants, like lily-pads. They'll use up the nutrients that
the algae would otherwise eat. Also, make sure you have a waterfall or
something to aerate the water.

As suggested add plants, etc.

Then if you still need a filter, build your own. Mine cost me about $40CDN.
Will probably rebuild mine in the near future, didn't make the first one big
enough. It works, but takes too long to clean-up the pond.

There are several web sites that have VG designs on them.

ANO

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
In article , Ka30P
wrote:

I think its more accurate to associate green water with higher pH, rise
in water temps and available phosphates.

This is not true. Green water is DIRECTLY related to NH4 (Ammonium). It is
either directly from your fish or dust that has blown into the water. All
replies are correct in that all you need to do is add as many plants as you
can to your pond. Plants will readily take up NH4 before moving on to NO3
(Nitrates). Try it and I bet that in 2 weeks max your pond will be pretty
free of green water.
--
**So long, and thanks for all the fish!**