I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!

"honey-do" wrote in message
...
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that
suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black
spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that
might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and
still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!

http://www.ars.org/explore.cfm/diseases/blackspot

That said, how huge a problem? Are your roses
losing their leaves and dying due to blackspot,
or is it that you just don't like the looks of
blackspotted leaves?

That's not a trivial (or insulting) question. Some
people require perfect rose bushes and are
willing to do whatever it takes to achieve &
maintain that perfection. Others - like me - ignore
minor (& sometimes major) imperfections. I don't
spray for anything and I have a great number
of different types of roses, modern as well as
antique, grafted as well as own root. Some roses
get a lot of blackspot (but don't die of it), some
roses get very little. None of it bothers me
particularly.

Read the ARS article carefully. There are some
cautions.

Gail
near San Antonio TX Zone 8

On Sun, 04 Jul 2004 03:32:38 GMT, "Gail Futoran"
wrote:

"honey-do" wrote in message
.. .
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that
suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black
spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that
might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and
still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!

http://www.ars.org/explore.cfm/diseases/blackspot

That said, how huge a problem? Are your roses
losing their leaves and dying due to blackspot,
or is it that you just don't like the looks of
blackspotted leaves?

That's not a trivial (or insulting) question. Some
people require perfect rose bushes and are
willing to do whatever it takes to achieve &
maintain that perfection. Others - like me - ignore
minor (& sometimes major) imperfections. I don't
spray for anything and I have a great number
of different types of roses, modern as well as
antique, grafted as well as own root. Some roses
get a lot of blackspot (but don't die of it), some
roses get very little. None of it bothers me.

particularly.


Sorry!, I will define HUGE a little better.

It is not my intention to get smart, or insult you, for I understand
what you are saying.

Okay- I have 18 roses, ranging from 9 years (Or older) to 3 years
old. Were you to remove all the leaves that are left, from all the
bushes, you could easily put them in a gallon fruit jar .

Two of my roses are 5 and 6 year old Don Juans and cover a 22 ft
fence. I have lost two of the major canes(defoliated and turned
brown).

It is hard to even write about it- -I have dedicated much time and
expense to these things, including an automatic watering system and
countless hours of pampering them.

Another way to put it is if HUGE gets any bigger, I won't have any
roses. (which at this point might not be so bad).

Thank you for your response, have a good day- -Honey-do.

Read the ARS article carefully. There are some
cautions.

Gail
near San Antonio TX Zone 8

"honey-do" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 04 Jul 2004 03:32:38 GMT, "Gail Futoran"
wrote:

"honey-do" wrote in message
.. .
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that
suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black
spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that
might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and
still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!

http://www.ars.org/explore.cfm/diseases/blackspot

That said, how huge a problem? Are your roses
losing their leaves and dying due to blackspot,
or is it that you just don't like the looks of
blackspotted leaves?

That's not a trivial (or insulting) question. Some
people require perfect rose bushes and are
willing to do whatever it takes to achieve &
maintain that perfection. Others - like me - ignore
minor (& sometimes major) imperfections. I don't
spray for anything and I have a great number
of different types of roses, modern as well as
antique, grafted as well as own root. Some roses
get a lot of blackspot (but don't die of it), some
roses get very little. None of it bothers me.

particularly.


Sorry!, I will define HUGE a little better.

It is not my intention to get smart, or insult you, for I
understand
what you are saying.

I tend to be abrupt & matter-of-fact when I write
which some people interpret as impatience or
rudeness, but I certainly didn't think *you* were
being smart or insulting!

Okay- I have 18 roses, ranging from 9 years (Or older) to
3 years
old. Were you to remove all the leaves that are left,
from all the
bushes, you could easily put them in a gallon fruit jar .

Whoa, that is a big problem. Seriously.

Two of my roses are 5 and 6 year old Don Juans and cover a
22 ft
fence. I have lost two of the major canes(defoliated and
turned
brown).

I've had a similar problem with my similar age Don
Juan. It was growing steadily, if slowly, now one
whole side is gone. The other side seems
healthy, but for how long?

One thing you might try is using epsom salts as
a soil additive to encourage basel breaks. Any
half-way decent rose book should have
information on epsom salts or do a google
search on epsom salts & roses.

It is hard to even write about it- -I have dedicated much
time and
expense to these things, including an automatic watering
system and
countless hours of pampering them.

Another way to put it is if HUGE gets any bigger, I won't
have any
roses. (which at this point might not be so bad).

I'd go ahead and try the baking soda method. Sounds
like you can't lose at this point. Is there a local
rose society or a botanical garden growing roses
so that you could ask others about their experiences?
Most rose people love to help others grow better
roses.

Another possibility is to get your soil tested.
Maybe some essential mineral is low or missing.

Thank you for your response, have a good day- -Honey-do.

Good luck! It is very frustrating to lose roses
when you've worked so hard on them.

Gail

"honey-do" wrote in message
...
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!


The Cornell method of fugus control works great for powdery mildew. It
doesn't touch black spot, so don't waste your time, money, and effort. If
you are going to go to the trouble of spraying, pick something that works.
You need to go to a local nursery and find some manzate or mancozeb (same
active ingredients). Use it mixed as directed (add a bit of vinegar to the
water if your water is alkaline) at 3 day intervals for 4 sprayings. Only
mix what you can apply at once, as it rapidly loses effectiveness,
especially in alkaline water (a matter of a few hours). 7 days from the 4th
mancozeb spraying, you need to spray with a fungicide with an alternative
method of action. Funginex, Immunox, BannerMaxx (or Fertilome Systemic
Fungicide, which is the generic version of BannerMaxx, i.e. propiconazole)
One of these ought to be easily available. The advantage to the
propiconazole is that it has a 14-21 day spray interval, thus reducing the
time you are out in the garden spraying. Funginex and Immunox have a 7 day
spray interval. Whichever you choose, continue to spray at the suggested
interval, and every other spraying, combine it with the manzate. Your roses
will be at least 95% clean for the rest of the summer and fall. Spraying
fungicides is a preventative though, and you will not see it cure any of the
affected foliage. The new foliage that grows in clean will remain clean if
kept sprayed. Next spring, begin spraying as soon as you have leaf out and
your roses will remain healthy. To promote new growth now, go to a feed
store and find some alfalfa for horses. Alfalfa contains a growth hormone
which will promote a lot of new growth above and beyond the NPK it contains.
Do not apply epsom salts unless you have had a professional soil test that
shows your soil is low in magnesium, as many soils already contain an almost
toxic level already and adding more can result in you killing your plants.

Or, if you prefer to not spray, get rid of the more disease prone ones like
Don Juan and grow something else like Dortmund. There are lots of roses out
there that don't require spraying, but your local nursery won't know about
them or stock them. Listen to gardeners in your area who grow roses and
don't spray and pick a few they recommend. Most modern roses like hybrid
teas, floribundas, and modern large flowered climbers will *not* be on the
list of anyone who is seriously no spray, so if you get a list of
"reccommended varieties" from a rose society that contains any of them, then
the whole list is probably suspect and formed by gardeners who think disease
resistance means that it doesn't spot *with* a regular spray program.. In
the north, portlands, polyanthas, hybrid musks, and rugosas are good
choices. In the south, teas, chinas, polyanthas, hybrid musks, and
noisettes are good choices. Most of these will only be available mail order
through specialty nurseries like Kedem's, Chamblee's or Ashdown's, but it's
worth the trouble if you really are committed to a no spray lifestyle.

Sunflower
MS 7b

I have a peace rose that is beautiful, but seems prone to blackspot, and as
the
original poster said, loses leaves as a result. Living near the ocean with
fog and
all doesn't help. I've found that using worm castings early in the spring
holds off
blackspot well for the summer. The brand that I'm using is "WormGold
Plus",
but I assume that this is characteristic of worm castings.

As a result, with healthy leaves left at mid- and the end of summer, I'm now
seeing those leaves getting laced out. This seems to be some sort of
insect, and
I'm now spraying weekly with "Rose Protector", an "organic" spray. It
smells
like Italian food (*smile*), but seems to have stopped the insect damage.
I'd
like to find a way to avoid the spraying, but at least this stuff makes me
hungry
rather than wanting to take a shower (*smile*).

Anyway, gardening is an on-going learning process for me. I used to use
malathion
and even Sevin, and am now finding "organic" stuff available at nuseries,
which
makes me happy. The less that I feel that I need stuff that I don't want to
live with,
the better I feel about my gardening. The worst thing that I use now is
horticultural
oil, and use organic plant foods, both soil and foiliar borne.

-Roger

"Sunflower" wrote in message
...

"honey-do" wrote in message
...
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!


The Cornell method of fugus control works great for powdery mildew. It
doesn't touch black spot, so don't waste your time, money, and effort. If
you are going to go to the trouble of spraying, pick something that works.
You need to go to a local nursery and find some manzate or mancozeb (same
active ingredients). Use it mixed as directed (add a bit of vinegar to
the
water if your water is alkaline) at 3 day intervals for 4 sprayings. Only
mix what you can apply at once, as it rapidly loses effectiveness,
especially in alkaline water (a matter of a few hours). 7 days from the
4th
mancozeb spraying, you need to spray with a fungicide with an alternative
method of action. Funginex, Immunox, BannerMaxx (or Fertilome Systemic
Fungicide, which is the generic version of BannerMaxx, i.e. propiconazole)
One of these ought to be easily available. The advantage to the
propiconazole is that it has a 14-21 day spray interval, thus reducing the
time you are out in the garden spraying. Funginex and Immunox have a 7 day
spray interval. Whichever you choose, continue to spray at the suggested
interval, and every other spraying, combine it with the manzate. Your
roses
will be at least 95% clean for the rest of the summer and fall. Spraying
fungicides is a preventative though, and you will not see it cure any of
the
affected foliage. The new foliage that grows in clean will remain clean
if
kept sprayed. Next spring, begin spraying as soon as you have leaf out
and
your roses will remain healthy. To promote new growth now, go to a feed
store and find some alfalfa for horses. Alfalfa contains a growth hormone
which will promote a lot of new growth above and beyond the NPK it
contains.
Do not apply epsom salts unless you have had a professional soil test that
shows your soil is low in magnesium, as many soils already contain an
almost
toxic level already and adding more can result in you killing your plants.

Or, if you prefer to not spray, get rid of the more disease prone ones
like
Don Juan and grow something else like Dortmund. There are lots of roses
out
there that don't require spraying, but your local nursery won't know about
them or stock them. Listen to gardeners in your area who grow roses and
don't spray and pick a few they recommend. Most modern roses like hybrid
teas, floribundas, and modern large flowered climbers will *not* be on the
list of anyone who is seriously no spray, so if you get a list of
"reccommended varieties" from a rose society that contains any of them,
then
the whole list is probably suspect and formed by gardeners who think
disease
resistance means that it doesn't spot *with* a regular spray program.. In
the north, portlands, polyanthas, hybrid musks, and rugosas are good
choices. In the south, teas, chinas, polyanthas, hybrid musks, and
noisettes are good choices. Most of these will only be available mail
order
through specialty nurseries like Kedem's, Chamblee's or Ashdown's, but
it's
worth the trouble if you really are committed to a no spray lifestyle.

Sunflower
MS 7b

In honey-do wrote:
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Both of those work for me, but black spot hasn't been a big problem
lately here in Sydney.

I found an old wives' cure as good as any. Mix one part milk to six
parts water and spray the leaves thoroughly. In sunlight one of the
milk proteins turns toxic to fungus (including mildew and black spot)
and it also provides the oil-like coating to form a protective film.

When I use fungicides I find that both triforine and myclobutanil
products work well (these are ingredients, not brand names).

On Fri, 02 Jul 2004 18:11:48 -0500, in rec.gardens.roses you wrote:

I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and still have a
HUGE problem.

I have had some luck using the following mixtu 1 tsp. baking soda,
1 tbs. horticulture oil, 1 1/4 tbs. Safer Insecticide soap per quart
of water. I believe both the soap and the oil help the baking soda in
adhering to the plant long enough for it to be effective.

The one thing is this: I haven't had a lot of luck rescuing a largely
affected rose bush, I have the best luck when I use this spray
preventively, or when the black spot hasn't gone too far, it seems to
be able to handle the problem. Once I had signficant black spot, it
seems like this spray could only do so much and I had to prune
drastically to get it back under control.

I learned from that episode, and since I've used this spray
preventively (2 years now) I haven't had a return of the black spot at
all, despite very good weather conditions for it.

Baking soda usually isn't strong enough in my attempts. Instead Iget a
product called remedy which is basically baking soda, but at a much higher
concentration.

I have found it works great on Powdery mildew. On black spot it controls/
prevents , but is not good at getting rid of it once you get it. My local
organic shop says that's because I need to do more to my spoil. I just go
out and use Daconil for 1-3 treatments and then go back to remedy

Www.dirtdoctor.com is a good place to get information on a lot of that.


"honey-do" wrote in message
...
I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and still have a
HUGE problem.

Thanks in advance!

On Fri, 02 Jul 2004 18:11:48 -0500, in rec.gardens.roses you wrote:

I recently read an article in an organic magazine that suggested using
Baking Soda and horticulture oil as a remedy for black spots on roses.

Has anyone tried this, or do you know of a remedy that might work? I
have tried many fungicides including dormant sprays and still have a
HUGE problem.

I have had some luck using the following mixtu 1 tsp. baking soda,
1 tbs. horticulture oil, 1 1/4 tbs. Safer Insecticide soap per quart
of water. I believe both the soap and the oil help the baking soda in
adhering to the plant long enough for it to be effective.

The one thing is this: I haven't had a lot of luck rescuing a largely
affected rose bush, I have the best luck when I use this spray
preventively, or when the black spot hasn't gone too far, it seems to
be able to handle the problem. Once I had signficant black spot, it
seems like this spray could only do so much and I had to prune
drastically to get it back under control.

I learned from that episode, and since I've used this spray
preventively (2 years now) I haven't had a return of the black spot at
all, despite very good weather conditions for it.