Some weeks back, I said I thought a mysterious plant in my garden,
growing alongside my dahlias, looked like them to such an extent - and
yet not like them - that I thought it might just be a virused dahlia.
Now, having observed the plant closely since, I have come to the
conclusion that my theory is pretty daft: the plant looks increasingly
less like a diseased dahlia, and more and more like an obscenely
healthy something else.
Have I been lovingly nurturing a common garden weed?
Can anyone identify the beast?
The photos were taken some weeks ago.

http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg




Cat(h)
The world swirls...




Cat(h)
The world swirls...

In message , Cat
writes
Some weeks back, I said I thought a mysterious plant in my garden,
growing alongside my dahlias, looked like them to such an extent - and
yet not like them - that I thought it might just be a virused dahlia.
Now, having observed the plant closely since, I have come to the
conclusion that my theory is pretty daft: the plant looks increasingly
less like a diseased dahlia, and more and more like an obscenely
healthy something else.
Have I been lovingly nurturing a common garden weed?
Can anyone identify the beast?

Mugwort, _Artemisia vulgaris_

The photos were taken some weeks ago.

http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg


--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

In article , Stewart Robert Hinsley
writes
In message , Cat
writes
Some weeks back, I said I thought a mysterious plant in my garden,
growing alongside my dahlias, looked like them to such an extent - and
yet not like them - that I thought it might just be a virused dahlia.
Now, having observed the plant closely since, I have come to the
conclusion that my theory is pretty daft: the plant looks increasingly
less like a diseased dahlia, and more and more like an obscenely
healthy something else.
Have I been lovingly nurturing a common garden weed?
Can anyone identify the beast?

Mugwort, _Artemisia vulgaris_

I'm hesitate to question your identification since you have much greater
wildflower knowledge than I .... but the leaves are not as grey and
nowhere near as serrated as I know for Mugwort. Can it take this form?

My first reaction was some sort of chenopodium but if so it's huge!

The photos were taken some weeks ago.

http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg



--
Kay
"Do not insult the crocodile until you have crossed the river"

Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
In message , Cat
writes
[...]
Have I been lovingly nurturing a common garden weed?
Can anyone identify the beast?

Mugwort, _Artemisia vulgaris_

The photos were taken some weeks ago.

http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg

I think it's a particularly hearty goosefoot: if I'm right, have it
out before it drops any more seeds than it's probably scattered
already.

--
Mike.

Kay wrote:
In article , Stewart Robert
Hinsley writes
[...]
Mugwort, _Artemisia vulgaris_

I'm hesitate to question your identification since you have much
greater wildflower knowledge than I .... but the leaves are not as
grey and nowhere near as serrated as I know for Mugwort. Can it
take
this form?

My first reaction was some sort of chenopodium but if so it's huge!

Does that count as two of us so far, then? It's much more like a
goosefoot than anything else I can think of: remember, most gardeners
never see the thing in its pomp. For mugwort I'd want to see rather
white undersides and furriness as well as the greyness -- this is
very bright.

Just looked in Collins Field guide, and the pictures don't show
anything this crowded among the chenopods; but the pictures aren't
recent, so the thing's probably blown a lot by now. I'm still for one
of the goosefeet.

--
Mike.

In message , Kay
writes
In article , Stewart Robert Hinsley
writes
In message , Cat
writes
Some weeks back, I said I thought a mysterious plant in my garden,
growing alongside my dahlias, looked like them to such an extent - and
yet not like them - that I thought it might just be a virused dahlia.
Now, having observed the plant closely since, I have come to the
conclusion that my theory is pretty daft: the plant looks increasingly
less like a diseased dahlia, and more and more like an obscenely
healthy something else.
Have I been lovingly nurturing a common garden weed?
Can anyone identify the beast?

Mugwort, _Artemisia vulgaris_

I'm hesitate to question your identification since you have much greater
wildflower knowledge than I .... but the leaves are not as grey and
nowhere near as serrated as I know for Mugwort. Can it take this form?

My first reaction was some sort of chenopodium but if so it's huge!

You could well be right. Artemisia and Chenopodium are sufficiently
superficially similar that it took me some years to learn to distinguish
them in the flesh. (Which means I can still be fooled by photographs,
which give less context.) Looking again at the flowers, it does look
like a Chenopodium. Checking Keble-Martin, Red Goosefoot, Chenopodium
rubrum, looks the best match. (The only goosefoot that I see regularly
is Fat Hen, Chenopodium album.)

My experience is that Mugwort, as opposed to the other Artemisias, is
not particularly grey, or dissected-leaved. I'd say that Fat Hen is
greyer than Mugwort. (If you don't look at the underside of the leaves.)

According to Stace, Red Goosefoot can reach 1m. Fat Hen can reach 1.5m.
It's not the height, but the width, that seems wrong. Goosefoots are
mostly annual, and I'd expect them to be single stemmed, even if
extensively branched; the photograph looks like a multiply stemmed
plant. Good King Henry, Chenopodium bonus-henricus, is perennial, but
only reaches (according to Stace) 50cm.
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

"Cat" wrote in message
...
Some weeks back, I said I thought a mysterious plant in my garden,
growing alongside my dahlias, looked like them to such an extent - and
yet not like them - that I thought it might just be a virused dahlia.
Now, having observed the plant closely since, I have come to the
conclusion that my theory is pretty daft: the plant looks increasingly
less like a diseased dahlia, and more and more like an obscenely
healthy something else.
Have I been lovingly nurturing a common garden weed?
Can anyone identify the beast?
The photos were taken some weeks ago.

http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~#
Exceptionally good example of the variation found within the
Goosefoot family. [Chenopodiaceae] There are more than twelve native or
introduced species and each of these has a mutitude of variations. A
peculiar family, in that it has no natural habitat other than in association
with man and has evolved as such, similar to the dog.
Leaves were used as spinach and seeds as grain.
Best Wishes Brian.

Brian wrote:
http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~#
Exceptionally good example of the variation found within the
Goosefoot family. [Chenopodiaceae] There are more than twelve native or
introduced species and each of these has a mutitude of variations. A
peculiar family, in that it has no natural habitat other than in association
with man and has evolved as such, similar to the dog.
Leaves were used as spinach and seeds as grain.
Best Wishes Brian.

The plant has been so well looked after next to the dahlias - it's the
healthiest one I've seen in ages (beside one I've seen on an abandonned
plot recently, almost 2m high). The seeds used as grain is coming back
into fashion, like the quinoa (which I don't like at all). I think the
one you eat is called King Henry but I couldn't tell if the above can
be eaten. The leaves certainly look like goose feet.

In article , Stewart Robert Hinsley
writes
According to Stace, Red Goosefoot can reach 1m. Fat Hen can reach 1.5m. It's not
the height, but the width, that seems wrong. Goosefoots are mostly annual, and
I'd expect them to be single stemmed, even if extensively branched; the
photograph looks like a multiply stemmed plant. Good King Henry, Chenopodium
bonus-henricus, is perennial, but only reaches (according to Stace) 50cm.

I've seen them multi-stemmed. But they're not a group I'm particularly
interested in, so all the multi stemmed ones could well have been Good
King Henry
--
Kay
"Do not insult the crocodile until you have crossed the river"

On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 18:01:57 +0100, Malcolm
wrote:


In article , Kay
writes
In article , Stewart Robert Hinsley
writes
According to Stace, Red Goosefoot can reach 1m. Fat Hen can reach
1.5m. It's not
the height, but the width, that seems wrong. Goosefoots are mostly
annual, and
I'd expect them to be single stemmed, even if extensively branched; the
photograph looks like a multiply stemmed plant. Good King Henry, Chenopodium
bonus-henricus, is perennial, but only reaches (according to Stace) 50cm.

I've seen them multi-stemmed. But they're not a group I'm particularly
interested in, so all the multi stemmed ones could well have been Good
King Henry

I'm reasonably sure it is Red Goosefoot, C.album, not least because of
the density of the flowers in the spike, the fact that there are quite
large leaves among the flowers and, especially, the leaves are heavily
serrated, whereas the leaves of, e.g. Fat Hen, Good King Henry and
others, are smooth-edged or only slightly serrated. Plates 71 and 72 in
Keble Martin refer!


Malcolm, I hope you don't mind if I piggy back on your message to
thank all here for your help.
So, it's a goosefoot, and a red one at that.
I pulled it up this afternoon, and I'm affraid I contributed to its
greater propagation - it was quite a bit more mature than on the
photos Iposted, which are about 3 to 4 weeks old. There was seeds
everywhere, including on my sweater.
Just a couple of questions: is it a weed, or not? It actually proved
quite a handsome plant, if one a bit devoid of colour. But has it any
other use? Medicinal? Culinary?
And how did a single specimen end up in my garden - bearing in mind
the gazillions of seeds it produces?






Cat(h)
The world swirls...

On 23 Oct 2005 05:48:59 -0700, "La puce" wrote:


Brian wrote:
http://tinypic.com/euhk7q.jpg
http://tinypic.com/euhmhy.jpg
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~#
Exceptionally good example of the variation found within the
Goosefoot family. [Chenopodiaceae] There are more than twelve native or
introduced species and each of these has a mutitude of variations. A
peculiar family, in that it has no natural habitat other than in association
with man and has evolved as such, similar to the dog.
Leaves were used as spinach and seeds as grain.
Best Wishes Brian.

The plant has been so well looked after next to the dahlias - it's the
healthiest one I've seen in ages (beside one I've seen on an abandonned
plot recently, almost 2m high). The seeds used as grain is coming back
into fashion, like the quinoa (which I don't like at all). I think the
one you eat is called King Henry but I couldn't tell if the above can
be eaten. The leaves certainly look like goose feet.

Arumpf...
There is something deeply gratifying about raising the healthiest...
weed on records.






Cat(h)
The world swirls...

In article , Cat
writes

Just a couple of questions: is it a weed, or not?

What is a weed?


--
Kay
"Do not insult the crocodile until you have crossed the river"

On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 22:57:02 +0100, Kay
wrote:

In article , Cat
writes

Just a couple of questions: is it a weed, or not?

What is a weed?


Hum. I might have known not to ask such a phylistine question here...
Rephrase: has it any redeeming value?




Cat(h)
The world swirls...

Cat wrote:
[...]
There was seeds
everywhere, including on my sweater.

That's what I was afriad of.

Just a couple of questions: is it a weed, or not? It actually
proved
quite a handsome plant, if one a bit devoid of colour.

That's one of those "how long is a piece of string?" questions. If a
plant is where you don't want it, it's a weed. It doesn't really go
like hell except in cultivated ground, so if it pops up in a wild
patch, it isn't a problem. But in your tilled beds, it's not
decorative, endangered, or of any great kitchen value, and you want
your work to be for the benefit of things you like; so knock it out.

But has it any
other use? Medicinal? Culinary?

I don't know of any medicinal uses, but you can cook it as a green
vegetable. If you eat it in quantity day in, day out, it will make
you ill -- one of the symptioms is jaundicing of the skin -- but not
incurably. I'd use it a couple of times in a year if I had no other
green, but I've never tried it.

And how did a single specimen end up in my garden - bearing in mind
the gazillions of seeds it produces?

You've answered your own question, really. It produces a lot of seed,
and it seems they may survive for many years in the soil until the
conditions are right -- i.e., you come along and cultivate. It
doesn't compete too well with other plants in the wild, which is
often true of plants which produce huge quantitiies of seed. In those
ideal conditions, all it needs is one seed to come in stuck to your
boot if there aren't any in the soil already. I got some lovely
evening primroses that way, but usually what turns up is a waste of
space, like this.

--
Mike.

Mike Lyle wrote:
Cat wrote:


Snip Mike's most informative response.
Thank you.
I live and learn. And I enjoy gardening well enough that I am not too
worried about a few extra weeds to pluck.

Cat(h)
The world swirls...