Has anyone else seen the article in the garden which is an interview with
two women who used to work at Sissinghurst? Two things they said struck us
forcibly - they deplored the gimmicky TV programmes about gardening,
especially the treatment of Chelsea with its concentration on gurning
presenters and no plant names given, as most of us here do. It is to be
hoped that the BBC people who make that programme read that article. And
they remarked that there are far too many people doing far too many RHS
courses now. It does seem to have taken over from interior design as the
course some - I do repeat 'some' - people do when they don't know quite what
to do!
--

Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
)

Sacha wrote:
Has anyone else seen the article in the garden which is an interview with
two women who used to work at Sissinghurst? Two things they said struck us
forcibly - they deplored the gimmicky TV programmes about gardening,
especially the treatment of Chelsea with its concentration on gurning
presenters and no plant names given, as most of us here do. It is to be
hoped that the BBC people who make that programme read that article. And
they remarked that there are far too many people doing far too many RHS
courses now. It does seem to have taken over from interior design as the
course some - I do repeat 'some' - people do when they don't know quite what
to do!

Can you show us in the article where they actually said that 'far too
many people are taking RHS courses when they don't know quite what to
do', because that surprise me. Qualifications are now essential in
getting a job one wants. An RHS general qualification is now essential
to any job in public environmental work in councils across the UK. My
course alone last year was attended by 5 lads not really wanting to do
the course but had no option. All had been working over 5 years for
Oldham council but this wasn't sufficient.

So perhaps the rise of RHS applicants has risen because it is now
necessary to hold a qualification in horticulture and not just
'knowledge' one aquired through life experience and not because one
'just doesn't know what to do'.

"La Puce" wrote in message
ups.com...

Sacha wrote:
Has anyone else seen the article in the garden which is an interview with
two women who used to work at Sissinghurst? Two things they said struck
us
forcibly - they deplored the gimmicky TV programmes about gardening,
especially the treatment of Chelsea with its concentration on gurning
presenters and no plant names given, as most of us here do. It is to be
hoped that the BBC people who make that programme read that article. And
they remarked that there are far too many people doing far too many RHS
courses now. It does seem to have taken over from interior design as the
course some - I do repeat 'some' - people do when they don't know quite
what
to do!

Can you show us in the article where they actually said that 'far too
many people are taking RHS courses when they don't know quite what to
do', because that surprise me. Qualifications are now essential in
getting a job one wants. An RHS general qualification is now essential
to any job in public environmental work in councils across the UK. My
course alone last year was attended by 5 lads not really wanting to do
the course but had no option. All had been working over 5 years for
Oldham council but this wasn't sufficient.

So perhaps the rise of RHS applicants has risen because it is now
necessary to hold a qualification in horticulture and not just
'knowledge' one aquired through life experience and not because one
'just doesn't know what to do'.


What are your reasons for studying for the RHS general?
You already work in public environmental work without any qualifications.

Rupert wrote:

What are your reasons for studying for the RHS general?

To know more about plants and to give me the qualifications I need to
get more involve with tenants groups and help preserving and setting up
allotments with everyone in the community.

You already work in public environmental work without any qualifications.

No I don't. Why do you say that? I manage an urban regeneration
consultancy. I don't do environmental work. Our landscapers design the
public realm we create but I would like to see more involvement from
the residents of those areas we create or regenerate because I believe
it gives a sense of belonging, of pride, involvment thus reducing the
chances for vandalism, neglect, apathy to the environment etc. I
previously spent many years working in the arts. Now art and nature
meet )

"La Puce" wrote in message
oups.com...

Rupert wrote:

What are your reasons for studying for the RHS general?

To know more about plants and to give me the qualifications I need to
get more involve with tenants groups and help preserving and setting up
allotments with everyone in the community.

You already work in public environmental work without any qualifications.

No I don't. Why do you say that?
Snip

I thought that URBED was strongly associated with environmental issues
because their website says:-

"Through the Sustainable Urban Neighbourhood Initiative, URBED have been
exploring how the principles of environmental sustainability can be made to
work in urban areas"

Rupert wrote:

I thought that URBED was strongly associated with environmental issues
because their website says:-
"Through the Sustainable Urban Neighbourhood Initiative, URBED have been
exploring how the principles of environmental sustainability can be made to
work in urban areas"

I wish you'd stop mentioning my work all the time. It's as if you are
trying to test me as to what and why we do what we do. The SUN
initiative was slowly built when we discovered we (my husband and I)
had amassed tons of articles from around the UK and abroad and we
thought we ought to built a database of these and offer others to
peruse them. We employed a chap to record them. From these we thought
to seek sponsorship to create a quarterly newsletter - we now have over
5K contacts but sadly haven't made one since issue 12 ... 3 years ago.
We're too busy. This newsletter was very new at the time and we were he
first ones to mention 'sustainability'. We invited anyone to write
articles. The principles of sustainability we use are photovotaics, the
use of grey water systems etc. These principles are adopted on 1 or 2
houses but have never been seen on a neighbourhood scale. This is what
we are now trying to achieve, large neighbourhoods built with
sustainable materials. We created a housing cooperative using these
principles, it's called Homes For Change and has 175 flats, communal
gardens, workshops, offices for businesses, art gallery and studios, a
theatre, a recording studio, a creche and communal spaces. It's now
about 10 years old - and you can see the building on The Garden
magasine, November issue I think, along with the article of the Hulme
Community Garden Centre (which my husband and I developed the business
plan and supported it's creation, very strongly).

Any more questions Ruppert or perhaps you can you help me with my
question number 7. which is to list 4 purposes of the betula species
leaf, which is posing me quite a problem atm (

"La Puce" wrote in message
ups.com...

Rupert wrote:

I thought that URBED was strongly associated with environmental issues
because their website says:-
"Through the Sustainable Urban Neighbourhood Initiative, URBED have been
exploring how the principles of environmental sustainability can be made
to
work in urban areas"

I wish you'd stop mentioning my work all the time

Snip
I don't think I have mentioned your work before?I

Any more questions Ruppert or perhaps you can you help me with my
question number 7. which is to list 4 purposes of the betula species
leaf, which is posing me quite a problem atm (

It poses me a few problems as well. Have you repeated the question
correctly? Give us the full question and someone will have a go at an
answer.

The message . com
from "La Puce" contains these words:

This newsletter was very new at the time and we were he
first ones to mention 'sustainability'.

Another total fantasy. "Sustainability" in communal urban
environments was being studied, expounded and practised decades ago, in
the UK and all around the world, while you were still in school.

.. Your ignorant pretensions seriously undermine the credibility of URBED.

Janet

Janet Baraclough wrote:

Another total fantasy. "Sustainability" in communal urban
environments was being studied, expounded and practised decades ago, in
the UK and all around the world, while you were still in school.

In urban planning we were the first one to promote it.

. Your ignorant pretensions seriously undermine the credibility of URBED.

LOL!! And what is your credibility Janet?! Your woolie underwears?! Our
office in Manchester was set up by myself and my husband. For 3 years
we ran it from our attic after the first job my husband had for our
London office in Bradford. I was then working for him part time,
pregnant with my second son, and worked for a European exchange
programme as part of the demolitions of the 60s built housing estates
which included 12 countries. We then moved to an office in our newly
built cooperative. Three years ago we moved to Manchester city centre.
We are now 16. The office in London, set up in Covent Garden in 75 will
soon be separated from us. They principaly did economic redevelopment
and research. We are designers, architects, ecologists, planners,
consultants, masterplanners and urban designers.

I don't give a fig what you think. We are an amazing couple and worked
very very very hard to achieve what we have done. We are weekly in the
press, we write lots of publications and we just love what we do. We
are a fantastic team with passionate people. We were pioneers in
sustainability within our redevelopments projects, tenants
participation came close second.

You on the other hand have achieved so little, your bitterness and
loneliness is now showing. This is the last time I respond to you
beside horticultural questions.

Rupert wrote:
I don't think I have mentioned your work before?I

You keep mentioning my business name Ruppert since Janet first
mentioned it!!! Why? As I explained to you we don't work with 'nature'
but promote renewable energy etc. hence the 'sustainability' principles
we keep on pushing. Still, please stop mentioning my business.

It poses me a few problems as well. Have you repeated the question
correctly? Give us the full question and someone will have a go at an
answer.

What shape of leaf does the Betula species typically have and list 4
purposes of the leaf.

Dave Poole wrote:

Well the 'General' will help you or anyone else in their understanding
of basic horticulture. It is an excellent course for keen hobbyists
and those just starting out, but it is only the 'taster' and the real
stuff comes in at levels 3 and 4. To really make folks sit up and
take notice, diploma training at Wisley or Kew is still recognised as
being the best you can get - anywhere.

Ho, absolutely. My friend with her RHS 'Mention' just landed a job at
Wisley. Prior to this she worked at Tattoon. (Her lotty is next to
mine). I don't want to go deeper than knowing the differences within
the vascular bundles between dicots and monocots nor do I really need
to know how to draw the main component of the palisade cell, but want
to know what needs must be met when siting top fruit trees such as
malus or what may cause forced bulbs to fail to flower ... I however
will never stop to read, because I am fascinated, but I unfortunately
have a living to make because I have two growing children and sadly I
do not have the time to progress to RHS 3 and 4.

The 'bods' at Oldham really should be sending their lads on the NVQ
Landscaping (Amenity) course since can deal with their everyday work
more effectively.

The lads already had the NVQ landscaping. They just LOVED sitting on
the mower and do very little else. They didn't bother sorting out
rubbish and dog craps from their grass cuttings - they don't understand
the needs. They told us horror stories when preparing ground for tree
planting etc. because they don't have the passion, but they do like the
fresh air and the cuppa and ciggie breaks they get throughout the day.
The course has brought them the understanding they needed to understand
the consequences to doing a job well. This is only an example, you
understand. I know there's hundreds of devoted lads in environmental
works!

In my experience, the RHS level 2 (General)
provides too much of what council workers do not need to know, and not
quite enough of what they do.

This is generally combined with the C&G practical skills which I had
started in Sept. 04 but sadly the course was closed by the college
because we were 13 and they needed 15 students to meet their costings.
I was devastated. It started again in Sept. 05, full day on Tuesday but
I cannot give a full day. However, I feel that I've had 'practical' all
my life. What I need is an understanding, in English, in a different
environment, climate and with differents people. This is the challenge
I've set myself - I'm not good at kniting, nor kept indoors put it this
way ;o)

This causes more than a few problems
from the motivational point of view. The NVQ can be tailor-made to
fit employers' and employees' requirements with hands-on assessment in
work. By contrast, the basic RHS course has a set curriculum and is
paper-based with only a modicum of 'practical', which isn't assessed.
However, if employees undertake both courses, they get an extremely
well-rounded insight. Unfortunately few employers can afford to allow
sufficient time off for both courses.

Yes and that is so frustrating indeed. On Saturday we demanded to
plant trees around our college, and not leave it to the NVQ and the
practical course students. Our tutor bend over backwards for us. She's
so committed to us, it's wonderful to see. We also did a soil pit. She
studied geology at Edinburgh for years and is more her passion than
horticulture is. We managed to dig a 7ft deep hole and it was as fun as
it was fascinating. I've found 6 clay pipe bits, and enough ceramic
chunks to make a small coaster )

The message .com
from "La Puce" contains these words:

(context restored to avoid another Puke slither )

This newsletter was very new at the time and we were he
first ones to mention 'sustainability'.

Another total fantasy. "Sustainability" in communal urban
environments was being studied, expounded and practised decades ago, in
the UK and all around the world, while you were still in school.

... Your ignorant pretensions seriously undermine the credibility of URBED.

In urban planning we were the first one to promote it.

One post ago, you claimed to be the first even to MENTION sustainability.

Now, you claim to be the first to promote it. So, are you now trying
to make out that others "mentioned it" first, but did nothing about
promoting green sustainable urban regeneration until the fortuitous day
you came down from the attic in 93?

Green sustainable urban regeneration was heavily promoted in Glasgow's
Garden festival in 1988. That was a follow-on from earlier similar
events in depressed post-industrial areas of Northwest England, such as
Liverpool 84. All years before your husband started work in the north in
1990. And those are far from early examples, just ones that gardeners
here will recall.

I don't give a fig what you think.

So you keep telling us, but clearly it's untrue. With pathetic
desperation, you pour out on this group an unending flood of vanity,
boasting, lies, self-justification and self-serving self- promotion of
which

We are an amazing couple

Is just one pitiable example. People here have been taught, by
yourself, that you constantly lie, fake and misrepresent.Therefore,
your blind self-aggrandisement is pointless, self-defeating, the
ultimate "emperor with no clothes" act. You parade yourself here as one
thing, and every post demonstrates that the truth about you is quite the
opposite.

Janet

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message .com
from "La Puce" contains these words:

argument snipped


Ladies please!!

In 1429 you might both have been fighting on the same side:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Herrings

Jenny "~)

JennyC wrote:
Ladies please!!
In 1429 you might both have been fighting on the same side:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Herrings

smile

It's totally absurd. I don't understand why she goes on like this ...

Janet Baraclough wrote:
In urban planning we were the first one to promote it.
One post ago, you claimed to be the first even to MENTION sustainability.

No. I didn't. You talk of 'garden sustainability' because you don't
understand what I do. We have nothing, but nothing to do with gardens.
I managed art projects in a newly built park a few years ago but that's
how close we get to the grass.

You perhaps write better than me, I'm foreign and you are visibly
enjoying the upper hand that this gives you and perhaps you are more
articulate, mais moi je pourrais te dire que lorsqu'une conne comme toi
ouvre sa bouche en public elle jette un froid, que nous appellons un
froid de connard. Do you understand now?

So until you do I won't talk to you about it because I don't think you
have the intelligence nor the courage to stop being rude to me now that
you've found someone to punch. Perhaps one day you'll stop. Until then
I suggest you go and get some good nookie, a good long session should
sort out your cobwebs. But then again perhaps there lies your problem,
as it's been suggested to me.